a man amidst mankind: back again to dasein

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Re: a man amidst mankind: back again to dasein

Postby Ecmandu » Mon Feb 23, 2015 7:30 pm

iambiguous wrote:wrong thread


=) No problem here... sorry that happened to you.
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Re: a man amidst mankind: back again to dasein

Postby iambiguous » Mon Apr 20, 2015 12:54 am

This...

https://philosophynow.org/issues/107/Why_We_Cant_Agree

...is more or less in alignment with the manner in which I have come to understand the meaning of dasein [and conflicting goods] out in the world of human interaction.

Not being able to agree about some things is basically a description of the human condition itself.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

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Re: a man amidst mankind: back again to dasein

Postby iambiguous » Sun Nov 15, 2015 7:47 pm

Came upon this quote from Salman Rushdie:

Meaning is a shaky edifice we build out of scraps, dogmas, childhood injuries, newspaper articles, chance remarks, old films, small victories, people hated, people loved; perhaps it is because our sense of what is the case is constructed from such inadequate materials that we defend it so fiercely, even to death.

Yes, this also captures the manner in which I try to convey the meaning of dasein. All the variables -- some of which we are barely cognizant of -- coming together over the years to predispose us to one rather than another meaning. A very personal meaning to say the least.

What then are philosophers to make of this? How are they able to pin down the one true objective meaning when that meaning revolves around conflicting values -- around the question "how ought one to live?"
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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Re: a man amidst mankind: back again to dasein

Postby iambiguous » Thu Mar 10, 2016 7:49 pm

Uccisore wrote:
iambiguous wrote:
How is the manner in which I construe the meaning of dasien in the OP not applicable to you?


This is a rather transparent sort of Kafka trap with 'objectivist' used in place of 'bigot'. If I answer that 1.) it is applicable to me, then you take it to mean you're right about everything, and I'm obligated to go on criticizing horrible objectivists. If I try to explain how it's 2.) not applicable to me, then I'm guilty of being an 'objectivist', which to you is a dirty, dirty intellectual bad guy who thinks the rules don't apply to him.


What on earth does this actually have to do with the points that I raise? Consider:

I am an individual....a man; yet, in turn, I am but one of 6,500,000,000 additional men and women that constitutes what is commonly called "mankind". So, in what sense can I, as an individual, grasp my identity as separate and distinct from mankind? How do I make intelligent distinctions between my personal, psychological "self" [the me "I" know intimately from day to day], my persona [the me "I" project -- often as a chameleon -- in conflicting interactions with others], and my historical and ethnological self as a white male who happened adventitiously to be born and raised to view reality from the perspective of a 20th century United States citizen?

How is this not applicable to everyone? How is this not applicable to you? Depending on when we are born historically, where we are born culturally, and the actual accumulation of personal experiences that we encounter, how will the manner in which any particular individual's moral and political values not be profoundly implicated in this?

How do your own transcend it?

Instead, the role of philosophy [in my view] is this: After acknowledging these profoundly existential/problematic components of any particular individual's indoctrination as a child, what, using the tools of philosophy, can we then go on to establish is within the framework of a rational and virtuous behavior?

In other words, what isn't "bullshit"? And don't the moral and political objectivists insist that what isn't bullshit is what they value? what they embrace as the "ideal"?

Again, you choose the value judgment and we can explore our respective assessments regarding the "conflicting goods" in the philosophy forum.

Or, with respect to extreme behaviors in which there is an overwhelming consensus regarding right and wrong, good and evil, you can address my point regarding the extreme narcissist who roots morality [in a world sans God] in that which he or she construes to be in their own self-interest.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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Re: a man amidst mankind: back again to dasein

Postby iambiguous » Fri Jan 13, 2017 9:06 pm

wrong thread.
He was like a man who wanted to change all; and could not; so burned with his impotence; and had only me, an infinitely small microcosm to convert or detest. John Fowles

Start here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529
Then here: viewtopic.php?f=15&t=185296
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