The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

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Does life make sense?

Yes.
15
63%
No.
5
21%
I don't know.
4
17%
 
Total votes : 24

Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 4:09 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Arminius wrote:This universe seems to require life.


Is this a case of putting the cart before the horse? :-k

Arc, sorry to have pre-empted You, but maybe some of what was meant as to Your questions has some relevance
At any rate it may not be coming from the same source, or going toward the same type of conclusion.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Sat Sep 23, 2017 4:24 pm

Meno_ wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:
Arminius wrote:This universe seems to require life.


Is this a case of putting the cart before the horse? :-k

Arc, sorry to have pre-empted You, but maybe some of what was meant as to Your questions has some relevance
At any rate it may not be coming from the same source, or going toward the same type of conclusion.


Hi Meno,

Don't worry about it. I do not see you as having pre-empted me.

Perhaps I might have used a different expression.
What I was implying there was that because THERE IS Life we see the Universe as actually requiring it. It's like putting the effect before the cause.

Is there another expression for that?
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:00 pm

The semantic relativity about it is one level of conscious effect that perhaps perscribes it, while revealing deeper levels of inscriptions; making descriptions almost literally poetic, in as much those levels are not usually available.(literally).

Perhaps this is, what Nietzsche tried.to bring out.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:09 pm

Meno_ wrote:The semantic relativity about it is one level of conscious effect that perhaps perscribes it, while revealing deeper levels of inscriptions; making descriptions almost literally poetic, in as much those levels are not usually available.(literally).

Perhaps this is, what Nietzsche tried.to bring out.


Can you point me to what Nietzsche said about the above? I would be interested.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 5:47 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Meno_ wrote:The semantic relativity about it is one level of conscious effect that perhaps perscribes it, while revealing deeper levels of inscriptions; making descriptions almost literally poetic, in as much those levels are not usually available.(literally).

Perhaps this is, what Nietzsche tried.to bring out.


Can you point me to what Nietzsche said about the above? I would be interested.

Specifically no, but his use of aphorisms signify some effort on his part to express some state of belief which may not be available directly.

As far As that goes, an expert in Nietzche may perhaps have a specific aphorism which confirms this. I will try to find something in the interim.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 6:24 pm

I haven't begin to look, but primarily the will to power shows a his attempt to overcome the differences alluding to the semantic structures implicit in textual representation of explicit Darwinian differences , where from his search for meaning.But will search, Arc for befitting aphorism [s].
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 7:34 pm

Found one in 'Will to Power', s635; walter Kaufmann ed
it comes.closest in the dynamic between praxis and process that seems credible as an analogy.

It's long and I have no capacity to transpose with a Samsung phone.
Last edited by Meno_ on Sat Sep 23, 2017 7:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby phyllo » Sat Sep 23, 2017 7:40 pm

In order to sustain the theory of a mechanistic world, therefore, we always have to stipulate to what extent we are employing two fictions: the concept of motion (taken from our sense language) and the concept of the atom (=unity, deriving from our psychical "experience"): the mechanistic theory presupposes a sense prejudice and a psychological prejudice...

The mechanistic world is imagined only as sight and touch imagine a world (as "moved") --so as to be calculable-- thus causal unities are invented, "things" (atoms) whose effect remains constant (--transference of the false concept of subject to the concept of the atom)...
If we eliminate these additions, no things remain but only dynamic quanta, in a relation of tension to all other dynamic quanta: their essence lies in their relation to all other quanta, in their "effect" upon the same. The will to power is not a being, not a becoming, but a pathos --the most elemental fact from which a becoming and effecting first emerge--

from The Will to Power, s.635, Walter Kaufmann transl.
"Who loves not wine, woman and song, remains a fool his whole life long."

"Only the educated are free" - Epictetus
"Music is a higher revelation than all wisdom and philosophy" -Beethoven
"Everyday life is the way" -Wumen
"Do not permit the events of your daily life to bind you, but never withdraw yourself from them" - Wumen
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Alf » Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:35 pm

Meno_ wrote:Literally, life doesent 'make sense;' sense 'makes' life.

Is God the "sense" you are speaking of?
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 9:55 pm

Alf wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Literally, life doesent 'make sense;' sense 'makes' life.

Is God the "sense" you are speaking of?


Maybe a higher power would be a better way to put it.

Phylo thanks for.the paraphrase.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Alf » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:00 pm

Meno_ wrote:
Alf wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Literally, life doesent 'make sense;' sense 'makes' life.

Is God the "sense" you are speaking of?


Maybe a higher power would be a better way to put it.

Why? Are you afraid of the word "God"?
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sat Sep 23, 2017 10:42 pm

It's not that except that spelled backwards God is dog
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Alf » Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:28 am

Meno_ wrote:It's not that except that spelled backwards God is dog

What is the "sense" you are speaking of then?
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Arminius » Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:35 am

Meno_ wrote:
Arminius wrote:
Meno_ wrote:Literally, life doesent 'make sense;' sense 'makes' life.

In German it is said „Leben hat Sinn“ ("life has sense"), not „Leben macht Sinn“ ("life makes sense"). Though meanwhile and unfortunately, the latter is also possible.

Meno_ wrote:Otherwise, have a nice vacation in Spain, and remember,
The rain in Spain falls mainly in the plain

Thank you.

* The Spain in the rain falls plainly in the main. :wink:

Okay. :wink:

I will tell this to the Spaniards. :wink:
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By the way: From where did you get the information that I am going to go to Spain again (with rain in the main plain ... and so on)? From here?

Got it there blogs up in this forum in the communication with Zinnat
The distinction in usage pertaining to meaning from ' life has sense' and ' life makes sense'' is interesting, and revolves around two orbits. One ' in the sense' of sensibility-in the former, and two in the perceivable coherence of what Russell called "sense data" for intelligibility.

There is a novel out there, which I haven't read, named ' Sense and Sensibility, I think by a woman by the name of Jane Austen, that may allude to the difference.

When You imply a regret for the use of the conjuctive 'makes' , instead of 'has', shows a German geneologocal tenet holding for praxis rather then process. That ,in turn implies the philosophical value underlying differance.

The plain in rain falls mainly in Spain? Naaaaaaaa.
Again have a good one.

Thank you again.

Alf wrote:
Meno_ wrote:It's not that except that spelled backwards God is dog

What is the "sense" you are speaking of then?

I think, he means "nature" in a way of pantheism ("nature <=> God") by avoiding the word "God".
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Alf » Sun Sep 24, 2017 12:11 pm

Or he is just joking.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sun Sep 24, 2017 5:51 pm

Actually it's not really a joke, it only appears as such with a purpose, to show the indigenous way that the difference, subtly estranged shades of meaning. That reverse spelling creates an unintended meaning, is the very contrary views not.accomodatong but creating what Nietzsche calls a.Pathetic rejection of both: the central idea of.'god' and the what Armenius calls a pantheism

They are not reconciable meaningfully because their genesis are far removed from each other. [From Nietzsche' s Sleep]

As far as I understand it its neither an acceptance or rejection, but a pathetic understanding of an unresolved state of being.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Alf » Sun Sep 24, 2017 9:30 pm

Meno_ wrote:Actually it's not really a joke, it only appears as such with a purpose, to show the indigenous way that the difference, subtly estranged shades of meaning. That reverse spelling creates an unintended meaning, is the very contrary views not.accomodatong but creating what Nietzsche calls a.Pathetic rejection of both: the central idea of.'god' and the what Armenius calls a pantheism

They are not reconciable meaningfully because their genesis are far removed from each other. [From Nietzsche' s Sleep]

As far as I understand it its neither an acceptance or rejection, but a pathetic understanding of an unresolved state of being.

So the "sense" which "'makes' life", as you said, is "a pathetic understanding of an unresolved state of being"? Or what?
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:32 pm

The word 'makes' is the conjuctive which introduces the difference, which is intrinsic in the higher purpose, where by the confusion arises.

That that is the produced the pathetic nature of neither/nor, into the equation-A throwback into Descartes' contribution into Hegelianism , [either/or] for that matter, -the tacit nature of the Inversion- or, the logic of contraries, points to it Yes,
that isnwhats meant here. A clear nihilization of process, of a synthetic result of lower types of goal setting.

That inaccessibility is.geared toward a select, is an inescapable condition here, and thus the resistive misapprehension. The resistive pathetic sense has to be based on condition of maximising the differential distance, sorrily and necessarily leaving behind more and more relevant connections, leaving more vacuous space and resulting in more aphoristic connections. This is the bases of the Wil to Power.

Yes, Your observation of this sense appears correct, as far as I can tell.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Sun Sep 24, 2017 10:42 pm

The original thesis, 'Does life make sense',.the vernacular points to -commonnsense.of the common sense, linguistic Sessseur-Ian post modern type signaling type, and the problem with that has been demonstrated by the deconstruction of meaning by the infinite regression of the concept-'sense data'

The unresolition of that bears actual witness to Nietzche's prophetic use of 'pathetic'
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:48 pm

Meno_ wrote:It's not that except that spelled backwards God is dog


Let us also not forget, Meno, that spelled backwards L I V E becomes E V I L.
I often muse on that.

Anyway, dogs can be quite faithful though I am an agnostic and a skeptic.

~~ and ~~

There are many, who by their *moral* perception, believe that living truly can be evil.

:evilfun:
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Mon Sep 25, 2017 2:57 pm

phyllo wrote:
In order to sustain the theory of a mechanistic world, therefore, we always have to stipulate to what extent we are employing two fictions: the concept of motion (taken from our sense language) and the concept of the atom (=unity, deriving from our psychical "experience"): the mechanistic theory presupposes a sense prejudice and a psychological prejudice...

The mechanistic world is imagined only as sight and touch imagine a world (as "moved") --so as to be calculable-- thus causal unities are invented, "things" (atoms) whose effect remains constant (--transference of the false concept of subject to the concept of the atom)...
If we eliminate these additions, no things remain but only dynamic quanta, in a relation of tension to all other dynamic quanta: their essence lies in their relation to all other quanta, in their "effect" upon the same. The will to power is not a being, not a becoming, but a pathos --the most elemental fact from which a becoming and effecting first emerge--

from The Will to Power, s.635, Walter Kaufmann transl.


That is an aphorism? I thought that they were short and to the point.
SAPERE AUDE!


If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

Thomas Nagel


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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Mon Sep 25, 2017 3:43 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Meno_ wrote:It's not that except that spelled backwards God is dog


Let us also not forget, Meno, that spelled backwards L I V E becomes E V I L.
I often muse on that.

Anyway, dogs can be quite faithful though I am an agnostic and a skeptic.

~~ and ~~

There are many, who by their *moral* perception, believe that living truly can be evil.

:evilfun:




It's interesting.to ponder about whether the degree of relevance between reverse spelling and the ideas represented above have any signification. Given the idea that it is not a question of if there is such signifier or connection, but the degree of it, one stops to wonder.

If as You bring up the significance of dogs being man's best friend, then the hidden dimensions may become more revealing

This all makes 'sense' only if we.somehow adhere to the idea that there are.no absolutely exclusive events in
existence,.because everything is related, however remotely

The search for an evolutionary missing link is an example of keeping this quest going.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Alf » Wed Sep 27, 2017 12:02 am

But is that a proof or evidence that life makes no sense (to you)?
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Meno_ » Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:15 pm

On one level, it does make sense, on another it is a sensless, hidden ,pathetic idea. But they do connect on yet another , instinctual level.
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Re: The Meaning of Life. Does life make sense?

Postby Brando » Wed Sep 27, 2017 2:23 pm

I think that life is what the whole is in a sense of immediacy. It must be integrated into a Mediation. Perhaps by Music, which sets categorial perception on controlled Change. In this way a certain Musical way/direction mirrors social Relations. And this does mediate life.
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