Where does meaning come from?

La Première

Please . . . you are welcome to join me for a walk on this mental pathway for a few moments - the question in the subject may seem vague if not impossible to answer for some people, but we all derive our meaning differently and the question has been left intentionally vague for that reason.

I will offer up some some writing to prime the conversation. You may leave now if you wish . . .

. . . Synergy is the creation of a whole that is greater than the simple sum of its parts. The term synergy comes from the Attic Greek word συνεργία synergia from synergos, συνεργός, meaning “working together”. I hope that by working together along with the original question that we find synergy with meaning - with a bit of luck I may set a theme. As we stop by my Zen Garden and take our seats, I say to you; by considering that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts - I wonder whether is it wise enough to speculate that meaning is derived somehow in the first instance of the first time meaning came to be - in other words - can meaning come about by lack of contrast?

The total sum of experience from birth to the present does not always provide enough meaning to some peoples lives and hence they go soul-searching or seek enlightenment or participate in any number of other potential activities that might bring meaning to their own lives. By asking something abstract and only using the accumulated information in ones memory is it possible to derive meaning from anything? How is it that somehow we are able to gain meaning from the unrelated? For example metaphors, analogy, parables or what ever you want to call your chosen device - poetry has proven to be such a device - as has art.

We get up and continue walking . . .

I once heard a saying that went something like “The fish uses its tail to swim forward. The fish uses its head to swim backwards.” and in my quest to find meaning I started to wonder whether meaning may be propagated in more than one direction. We use devices like metaphors to convey meaning and so it is that I am mixing concepts to make an attempt to get to the bottom of a more abstract mental impression of meaning. At what point in our mental process does meaning start?

An acquaintance of mine once responded to me by stating, lets try again to add some meaning to it - the question - Where does meaning come from? Lurking in the background is the question of whether it is even meaningful to ask the question on meaning. For example if it might have to do with some kind of fundamental open-ended mess or ambiguity of things. The question itself then would relate to a potential answer or direction, starting off in the mental realm. Meaning then as an expression of direction, from the known to the unknown, from the past to the future.

He went on further to state that until now I “simplified” meaning to be some form of expression of connection, of relating. This is based on the experience of when or how some activity, or even “life”, feels meaningful or not. And it always showed itself to be a function of the amount of connections something or someone has to other activities, people and events. It also explains the well known experience of a complete loss of meaning, which seems to be a result of engaging in activities for too long all having little relation to anything, or anyone, else beyond its own confines.

Philosophy then is deeply connected to meaning giving, since all the philosophical questioning, all the philosophical exploring is aimed to connect to everything: all the finer points of existing, of language, of dealing with experiencing and deriving sense from all of it. And yet it can also lead to meaninglessness, probably when one would stop applying this thought to all sense and all times. When all thought on life would become a bubble of life, becoming isolated. Such perhaps unavoidable form of alienation could then be part and parcel of having a mind in the first place; creating limited representations as a way to reason.

But back to the question, which was not as much about what meaning was but also where it would come from. Perhaps it would simply flow out of a more useful definition. If meaning indeed flows out of complex connection making, being it physical, interactions between senses and events, or pure mentally – words connecting with words – then it would connect deep down to the fundamental, driving forces of life itself. From these connections, all importance and value can be derived, arriving back again at the usual dictionary definitions of meaning.

This mental pathway shows how it can be said that truth, the alchemy of philosophy, is the greatest treasure as it leads to the giving of value itself, to self-knowledge, to value-knowledge. Everything else of value would be derivative.

Two questions that come to mind:

► How do you derive meaning in your life?

► What gives your life meaning?

And something like the original question: where do you think meaning comes from?

We leave the path here to hopefully answer any question we want and ask any question we want with the intention of adding meaning to our existence . . .

Meaning is inherent within the nature of things.

The meaning of a rock is defined by its hardness and solid structure, difficult to break. The meaning of water is defined by its malleability, flow, liquidity, and ability to take form of its containers. The meaning of air is defined by its invisibility, its cool, hot, dry, or moist temperatures, and by the storms which cause lightning and electricity. The meaning of fire is defined by its extreme hotness, burning, chaotic flames, shapelessness, and ability to shine light into darkness.

The meaning of people and lifeforms is much more complex and extensive. The nature of this or that person exposes his or her meaning. Some people find meaning in life through different tasks, goals, and accomplishments. What is difficult for one person, may not be so for another. What is meaningful to one person, may not be so for another. Difference of meaning in humanity represents differences of values, which again, define and identify the nature of particular people, apart from others.

Philosophy uncovers, discovers, and recalls the meaning of existence in the smallest possible ways. So the philosopher, arguably, has the best relationship and understanding about ‘meaning’ in life. The average person and human passes by life rather oblivious, or even ignorant to his or her own meaning. The average human is simply unaware, blissfully, innocently, or ignorantly, of the meaning that he or she chases around in life. People are ignorant of their own values and beliefs, are not necessarily self-conscious of them.

Philosophy is very much focused on all meanings, all possibilities, and all values of life. So while something may not seem meaningful to the average person, will be meaningful to the philosopher.

There is meaning in everything, as everything has a nature. It is within every forgotten and unseen crack within existence. It permeates everything, even the pitch blackness in dead space.

Meaning would seem to revolve around the unimaginably complex interaction between genes and memes.

There are the biological imperatives applicable to all of us. In other words, we can’t be around to discuss the meaning of meaning if we are not around at all. So meaning is clearly embedded in subsisting.

On the other hand, once subsistence [and reproduction and defense] is achieved [and then sustained] meaning comes to revolve around any number of additional human interactions. Relating to, among other things, social, political and economic relationships. Moral and aesthetic values. Sexual memes. Memes relating to God and religion.

Then the question [for folks like me] comes to revolve around this: the extent to which we are able to demonstrate to others that our meaning reflects that which all reasonable men and women are obligated to share.

Also, in bringing particular arguments and analysis “down to earth”; examining how “for all practical purposes” our own meaning may or may not be applicable to others.

Discover the objective truth of what you are and from there the meaning of your life will spring.

The desire to find meaning in our lives is made possible by our ability as a species to think in abstract terms
As it is a concept that transcends the purely physical and extends beyond to the philosophical or ideological

What are you, James?

Objectively.

And note some specific examples of how this is manifested in your day to day interactions with others. As this [in turn] becomes embodied in “I”. As this [in the final analysis] reflects [philosophically] the conjunction between RM/AO and the Real God.

Meaning what exactly?

In the context of “all there is”.

It is true of course that while all other species of animals share with us the need to subsist, we are the one species that above all others have the capacity to create historical and cultural memes. Memes that configure [and than reconfigure in a world of contingency, chance and change] the genetic components of our behaviors in ways that would never even occur to the overwhelming preponderance of other species.

For them meaning is ever and always on automatic pilot. It revolves almost entirely around biological imperatives.

But: What does that mean?

How might we grapple with it in terms of the meaning that we ascribe to our own behaviors? In particular the meaning that we assign to behaviors that come into conflict?

The ability to think in abstract terms will guarantee paradoxes given enough time simply because of the sheer scale of possibilities. As the only limitation will
be one of imagination. And this is why there will be conflicts within ourselves as we explore specific options and also conflicts between possibilities in general
This arises because human beings are not conditioned to think of themselves as part of a single collective but of smaller ones within it all the way down to the
individual. We may be a social species but we are no where near as organised with common goals as other social species like ants or bees or wasps for example

Meaning is a difficult word.

There’s the everyday definition, i.e what one thing means or denotes.
i.e. gracias means thank you, generally.

The idea of symbolic meaning is malleable.

Something happens to us and we decide it means this or that.
A guy hits you could mean to you that life is dangerous. We tell ourselves stories about the world
based on what happens or what we perceive, which is never complete, so we have to
create meaning, i.e. order, in the chaos. In this, meaning is a creative process, that can be conscious or unconscious on
a continuum. A conscious meaning maker is like an artist, who constructs meaning using values as the measure.
I.e. if I value pleasure instead of pain, generally, my effort will be or “mean” a war against pain, both my own and others’.
If I have no war, code, or agenda, or no values that I choose or that choose me, the word “meaningless” feels apropos,
not in that there’s no meaning, but that I don’t know WHAT my life means, in the absence of one of those things mentioned
above. Surely it means something, but “meaningless” is generally used to denote a “meaning” that has a value that is unclear or
suspect.

Then there’s universal meaning, i.e. the “meaning” of life.

If there’s a God who created us against a standard or goal, then our life “means” an effort or picture that is held
against or contributing to that goal. If God didn’t create us and there’s no outside or extrinsic force interpreting what our
actions “mean” then we are the ones figuring out what life means, which is fine. It just means our meaning will be somewhat made up,
because unlike an omniscient God, we don’t have access to all the facts that go into the complete, comprehensive meaning of what’s all going on.

I’ve thought long and hard about this and here’s what I think life means:

You run around and do a bunch of shit, say a bunch of shit, and literally shit a bunch of shit, and then you die having no clue what the fuck all that seeing and hearing and thinking/feeling and being a body in time and space was all about. And you fall into a deep dreamless sleep and other people (and bugs, and animals, and possibly trees, and Aliens like Galactus, and definitely dolphins) think the universe, cause the universe ain’t gonna think itself, although that’s exactly what it’s doing, in separate little windowless nodules connected by communication, like this piece of writing.

On many days I’ve thought that meaning is a form of pudding. Not chocolate pudding. More like Black Pudding, from D&D. But also banana pudding. JELL-O brand.

What a bullshit thread.

Some Guy in History

With two responses up to this point that contain the word bullshit.

Some Guy in History

Perhaps you would like to explain why it is a bullshit thread.

Why bother?

Some Guy in History

How would I know? This is a very meaningful conversation we are having here.

:laughing:

I bet you’re constantly amused by your own wittiness.

Some Guy in History

Not constantly, only occasionally.

8-[

I’m your mirror.

Don’t get lost.

Some Guy in History

I do believe you are my mirror. I wont get lost.

And then the mirror shatters
broken glass and broken dreams
lacerations to your skin
blood flowing from deep within
dark and crimson
laugh and the world laughs with you
cry and the world laughs at you
The end is here and the world has had the last laugh
at your expense as they blast
every bit of you that you could have
believed to be worthy of long-term existence

Some Guy in History

Quite beautiful in an antithetical kind of way . . .