Philosophy For Us Dummies

This is the place to shave off that long white beard and stop being philosophical; a forum for members to just talk like normal human beings.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Ierrellus » Tue Apr 29, 2014 2:43 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:Religion is infantile so long as it contains bullies' e.g., threats of eternal damnation. It is infantile if it is married to politics. It is infantile if it does not support hope and love for each other.

Religion is infantile so long as it doesn't lead to conscious thought and moral and ethical behavior. I have found that many people, christians and otherwise, (but not you Ierrellus) seem to separate their religion and/or spirituality from what they DO and how they live. Religion for them IS simply an opiate.

I tried to comment on religion, but Turtle seems to prefer discussion of death and loneliness. I agree with the above.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Orbie » Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:12 pm

It really makes little difference whether religion is an internally self caused opiate, or one which results from the effects of outside forces, because it is extremely difficult to separate one from the other. Is consciousness the result of the effects of the same evolutionary processes as those which we share with other primates, in fact with all organic and even inorganic material? If so, and i suspect that it is, then does it make a scintilla of difference whether we call this upward surge toward the realization of the self god's work, or that of natural progression of nature? The fact is, religion is a lot more than simply an anthropomorphic defense against the vagrancy of nature, it is the attempt to overcome the remaining doubt which remains over the Being, which tries desperately to define man in cosmically enduring ways, to benefit the memory of that cosmic Being. This Being's memory more likely then not, tries to infiltrate the opaqueness enveloping the cloud of doubt surrounding the inherent unity of it's self, simultaneously in singular and universal terms, i strongly suspect.
[size=50][/size]Allone's Obe issance



In answer to your prayer
sincere, the centre of
your circle here,
i stand ; and , without
taking thought,-
i know nothing. But i can

Full well your need-as
you be men
This: Re-Creation. With a
bow,
Then, your obedient

servant now.
One gift is all i find in me,
And that is faithful
memory
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Thu May 01, 2014 1:02 pm

obe wrote:It really makes little difference whether religion is an internally self caused opiate, or one which results from the effects of outside forces, because it is extremely difficult to separate one from the other. Is consciousness the result of the effects of the same evolutionary processes as those which we share with other primates, in fact with all organic and even inorganic material? If so, and i suspect that it is, then does it make a scintilla of difference whether we call this upward surge toward the realization of the self god's work, or that of natural progression of nature? The fact is, religion is a lot more than simply an anthropomorphic defense against the vagrancy of nature, it is the attempt to overcome the remaining doubt which remains over the Being, which tries desperately to define man in cosmically enduring ways, to benefit the memory of that cosmic Being. This Being's memory more likely then not, tries to infiltrate the opaqueness enveloping the cloud of doubt surrounding the inherent unity of it's self, simultaneously in singular and universal terms, i strongly suspect.


we are trying to deal with personal extinction[death] and loneliness...
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Ierrellus » Thu May 01, 2014 1:53 pm

I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Thu May 01, 2014 1:57 pm

Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Ierrellus » Thu May 01, 2014 2:49 pm

turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

The inevitability of death demands that we consider the meaning of life. If we become extinct, life becomes the more precious because it is all we have. I hope that is not the case.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Thu May 01, 2014 3:43 pm

Ierrellus wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

The inevitability of death demands that we consider the meaning of life. If we become extinct, life becomes the more precious because it is all we have. I hope that is not the case.


yes ier
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Sat May 03, 2014 1:07 pm

Ierrellus wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

The inevitability of death demands that we consider the meaning of life. If we become extinct, life becomes the more precious because it is all we have. I hope that is not the case.


as far as the meaning of life....I think the most important thing to do is be personally happy with your life....unless your behavior runs up against the rules...
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby MagsJ » Sun May 04, 2014 9:24 am

turtle wrote:...as far as the meaning of life....I think the most important thing to do is be personally happy with your life....unless your behavior runs up against the rules...

...because that is all we have... everything else being conceptual or material and therefore likely to only create fleeting happiness... and how very positive of you Turtle to respond with that :)

I have perceived that the long-term ill crack the most jokes... I guess what other choice but to make ones-self feel better rather than worse.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get that time back, and I may need it for something at some point in time. Wait! What?

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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Ierrellus » Sun May 04, 2014 3:01 pm

Turtle,
What rules do you have in mind that cannot foster happiness?
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Sun May 04, 2014 7:31 pm

Ierrellus wrote:Turtle,
What rules do you have in mind that cannot foster happiness?

DO NOT KILL
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Fri May 09, 2014 1:00 pm

hello us dummies....it is time to unite to improve the quality of posting on ilp---------------
I would like to start a discussion on the dangers and benefits of television...
I have noticed a dumbing down of tv programing...and the drug ads have to go..
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby phyllo » Fri May 09, 2014 1:19 pm

I have noticed a dumbing down of tv programing...and the drug ads have to go..
Drug ads are the best. Images of happy people living life to the fullest... followed by a long list of the worst imaginable side effects. LOL
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Arcturus Descending » Sat May 10, 2014 4:28 pm

turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...


1897041.jpg
1897041.jpg (8.92 KiB) Viewed 1352 times


How do you think this little guy feels?
Makes you want to cry, doesn't it? Just so you know, you're not alone in your fear.
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Sat May 10, 2014 4:31 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...


1897041.jpg


How do you think this little guy feels?
Makes you want to cry, doesn't it? Just so you know, you're not alone in your fear.


thanks arc--we are in this together...
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Arcturus Descending » Sat May 10, 2014 4:35 pm

thanks arc--we are in this together...

Did you tell him that?
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Wed May 14, 2014 2:41 pm

the dummies need you arc....where are you..
we need some reasonable talk here...
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Ierrellus » Fri May 16, 2014 2:10 pm

These days, I see little in the forums worth comment. Where is Arc? Where is Voice Out of the Wilderness? All I see about are flamers and trolls. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just my saturnine temperament talking.
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Lev Muishkin » Fri May 16, 2014 4:29 pm

Ierrellus wrote:These days, I see little in the forums worth comment. Where is Arc? Where is Voice Out of the Wilderness? All I see about are flamers and trolls. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just my saturnine temperament talking.


Well the Internet (bless his connectivity) in in the eye of the beholder. What you are actually seeing, perhaps, is people not finding you so worthy of comment, as you expect or think you deserve.
People disagree with you and you denounce them as Trolls and Flamers. It all sounds a bit like "Burn the Heretic" to me.

Maybe you are wrong. Maybe it's because you are dwelling on 'depression'. Maybe you still have faith that there are answers out there to you mortality? It's enough to test the patience of Job.

"Science is entirely Faith Based.... Obama is Muslim....Evil is the opposition to life (e-v-i-l <=> l-i-v-e ... and not by accident). Without evil there could be no life.", James S. Saint.
"The Holocaust was the fault of the Jews; The Holocaust was not genocide", Kriswest
"A Tortoise is a Turtle", Wizard
" Hitler didn't create the Nazis. In reality, the Judists did ... for a purpose of their own. Hitler was merely one they chose to head it up after they discovered the Judist betrayal in WW1, their "Judas Iscariot";James S Saint.
These just keep getting funnier.
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Fri May 16, 2014 11:37 pm

Lev Muishkin wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:These days, I see little in the forums worth comment. Where is Arc? Where is Voice Out of the Wilderness? All I see about are flamers and trolls. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just my saturnine temperament talking.


Well the Internet (bless his connectivity) in in the eye of the beholder. What you are actually seeing, perhaps, is people not finding you so worthy of comment, as you expect or think you deserve.
People disagree with you and you denounce them as Trolls and Flamers. It all sounds a bit like "Burn the Heretic" to me.

Maybe you are wrong. Maybe it's because you are dwelling on 'depression'. Maybe you still have faith that there are answers out there to you mortality? It's enough to test the patience of Job.


go away lev.....you are angry and making personal attacks...I want evidence not opinions...
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Ierrellus » Sat May 17, 2014 2:01 pm

It's ok, Turtle. Those who have little to say on topics argue personality.
So what good question do you have for us dummies today?
"We must love one another or die." W.H.Auden
I admit I'm an asshole. Now, can we get back to the conversation?
From the mad poet of McKinley Ave.
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Wed May 21, 2014 2:06 pm

I am looking at the [horrible thoughts] post...that is an important topic...
maybe it will develop into a good thread...
you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed May 21, 2014 3:19 pm

The little reptile has said:

you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

No, you can't but if one continues to think about it and think about it, dwells on it to the point of rage and emplanting a seed within the brain, one may eventually end up in jail. :lol:
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby turtle » Wed May 21, 2014 3:24 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:The little reptile has said:

you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

No, you can't but if one continues to think about it and think about it, dwells on it to the point of rage and emplanting a seed within the brain, one may eventually end up in jail. :lol:


of course arc...hello....that is what is always said and it may be wishful thinking...almost everyone has all kinds of bad thoughts...and we have been taught we are bad to think them or we are on the brink of being a bad person for thinking this stuff..
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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed May 21, 2014 3:33 pm

turtle wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:The little reptile has said:

you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

No, you can't but if one continues to think about it and think about it, dwells on it to the point of rage and emplanting a seed within the brain, one may eventually end up in jail. :lol:


of course arc...hello....that is what is always said and it may be wishful thinking...almost everyone has all kinds of bad thoughts...and we have been taught we are bad to think them or we are on the brink of being a bad person for thinking this stuff..


What part of it is "wishful thinking"?
Thoughts are neutral until they are "really" put into gear. But we do have to take responsibility for them. Relishing negative thouights, indulging in them can eventually lead to perdition. Observing them afterwards and questioning their roots, can lead to wisdom.
"Look closely. The beautiful may be small."


"Two things fill the mind with ever new and increasing admiration and awe, the oftener and more steadily we reflect on them: the starry heavens above me and the moral law within me."


“Whereas the beautiful is limited, the sublime is limitless, so that the mind in the presence of the sublime, attempting to imagine what it cannot, has pain in the failure but pleasure in contemplating the immensity of the attempt.”

Immanuel Kant
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