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Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 2:43 pm
by Ierrellus
Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:Religion is infantile so long as it contains bullies' e.g., threats of eternal damnation. It is infantile if it is married to politics. It is infantile if it does not support hope and love for each other.

Religion is infantile so long as it doesn't lead to conscious thought and moral and ethical behavior. I have found that many people, christians and otherwise, (but not you Ierrellus) seem to separate their religion and/or spirituality from what they DO and how they live. Religion for them IS simply an opiate.

I tried to comment on religion, but Turtle seems to prefer discussion of death and loneliness. I agree with the above.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 3:12 pm
by Orbie
It really makes little difference whether religion is an internally self caused opiate, or one which results from the effects of outside forces, because it is extremely difficult to separate one from the other. Is consciousness the result of the effects of the same evolutionary processes as those which we share with other primates, in fact with all organic and even inorganic material? If so, and i suspect that it is, then does it make a scintilla of difference whether we call this upward surge toward the realization of the self god's work, or that of natural progression of nature? The fact is, religion is a lot more than simply an anthropomorphic defense against the vagrancy of nature, it is the attempt to overcome the remaining doubt which remains over the Being, which tries desperately to define man in cosmically enduring ways, to benefit the memory of that cosmic Being. This Being's memory more likely then not, tries to infiltrate the opaqueness enveloping the cloud of doubt surrounding the inherent unity of it's self, simultaneously in singular and universal terms, i strongly suspect.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 1:02 pm
by turtle
obe wrote:It really makes little difference whether religion is an internally self caused opiate, or one which results from the effects of outside forces, because it is extremely difficult to separate one from the other. Is consciousness the result of the effects of the same evolutionary processes as those which we share with other primates, in fact with all organic and even inorganic material? If so, and i suspect that it is, then does it make a scintilla of difference whether we call this upward surge toward the realization of the self god's work, or that of natural progression of nature? The fact is, religion is a lot more than simply an anthropomorphic defense against the vagrancy of nature, it is the attempt to overcome the remaining doubt which remains over the Being, which tries desperately to define man in cosmically enduring ways, to benefit the memory of that cosmic Being. This Being's memory more likely then not, tries to infiltrate the opaqueness enveloping the cloud of doubt surrounding the inherent unity of it's self, simultaneously in singular and universal terms, i strongly suspect.


we are trying to deal with personal extinction[death] and loneliness...

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 1:53 pm
by Ierrellus
I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 1:57 pm
by turtle
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 2:49 pm
by Ierrellus
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

The inevitability of death demands that we consider the meaning of life. If we become extinct, life becomes the more precious because it is all we have. I hope that is not the case.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Thu May 01, 2014 3:43 pm
by turtle
Ierrellus wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

The inevitability of death demands that we consider the meaning of life. If we become extinct, life becomes the more precious because it is all we have. I hope that is not the case.


yes ier

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sat May 03, 2014 1:07 pm
by turtle
Ierrellus wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...

The inevitability of death demands that we consider the meaning of life. If we become extinct, life becomes the more precious because it is all we have. I hope that is not the case.


as far as the meaning of life....I think the most important thing to do is be personally happy with your life....unless your behavior runs up against the rules...

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 9:24 am
by MagsJ
turtle wrote:...as far as the meaning of life....I think the most important thing to do is be personally happy with your life....unless your behavior runs up against the rules...

...because that is all we have... everything else being conceptual or material and therefore likely to only create fleeting happiness... and how very positive of you Turtle to respond with that :)

I have perceived that the long-term ill crack the most jokes... I guess what other choice but to make ones-self feel better rather than worse.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 3:01 pm
by Ierrellus
Turtle,
What rules do you have in mind that cannot foster happiness?

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2014 7:31 pm
by turtle
Ierrellus wrote:Turtle,
What rules do you have in mind that cannot foster happiness?

DO NOT KILL

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 1:00 pm
by turtle
hello us dummies....it is time to unite to improve the quality of posting on ilp---------------
I would like to start a discussion on the dangers and benefits of television...
I have noticed a dumbing down of tv programing...and the drug ads have to go..

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2014 1:19 pm
by phyllo
I have noticed a dumbing down of tv programing...and the drug ads have to go..
Drug ads are the best. Images of happy people living life to the fullest... followed by a long list of the worst imaginable side effects. LOL

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:28 pm
by Arcturus Descending
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...


1897041.jpg
1897041.jpg (8.92 KiB) Viewed 1342 times


How do you think this little guy feels?
Makes you want to cry, doesn't it? Just so you know, you're not alone in your fear.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:31 pm
by turtle
Arcturus Descending wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I cannot imagine my own death because I am immersed in consciousness. I can only hope that consciousness will continue after my inevitable demise.


I hope also for me....the threat of extinction is awful...


1897041.jpg


How do you think this little guy feels?
Makes you want to cry, doesn't it? Just so you know, you're not alone in your fear.


thanks arc--we are in this together...

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sat May 10, 2014 4:35 pm
by Arcturus Descending
thanks arc--we are in this together...

Did you tell him that?

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Wed May 14, 2014 2:41 pm
by turtle
the dummies need you arc....where are you..
we need some reasonable talk here...

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 2:10 pm
by Ierrellus
These days, I see little in the forums worth comment. Where is Arc? Where is Voice Out of the Wilderness? All I see about are flamers and trolls. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just my saturnine temperament talking.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 4:29 pm
by Lev Muishkin
Ierrellus wrote:These days, I see little in the forums worth comment. Where is Arc? Where is Voice Out of the Wilderness? All I see about are flamers and trolls. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just my saturnine temperament talking.


Well the Internet (bless his connectivity) in in the eye of the beholder. What you are actually seeing, perhaps, is people not finding you so worthy of comment, as you expect or think you deserve.
People disagree with you and you denounce them as Trolls and Flamers. It all sounds a bit like "Burn the Heretic" to me.

Maybe you are wrong. Maybe it's because you are dwelling on 'depression'. Maybe you still have faith that there are answers out there to you mortality? It's enough to test the patience of Job.

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2014 11:37 pm
by turtle
Lev Muishkin wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:These days, I see little in the forums worth comment. Where is Arc? Where is Voice Out of the Wilderness? All I see about are flamers and trolls. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe it's just my saturnine temperament talking.


Well the Internet (bless his connectivity) in in the eye of the beholder. What you are actually seeing, perhaps, is people not finding you so worthy of comment, as you expect or think you deserve.
People disagree with you and you denounce them as Trolls and Flamers. It all sounds a bit like "Burn the Heretic" to me.

Maybe you are wrong. Maybe it's because you are dwelling on 'depression'. Maybe you still have faith that there are answers out there to you mortality? It's enough to test the patience of Job.


go away lev.....you are angry and making personal attacks...I want evidence not opinions...

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Sat May 17, 2014 2:01 pm
by Ierrellus
It's ok, Turtle. Those who have little to say on topics argue personality.
So what good question do you have for us dummies today?

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 2:06 pm
by turtle
I am looking at the [horrible thoughts] post...that is an important topic...
maybe it will develop into a good thread...
you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 3:19 pm
by Arcturus Descending
The little reptile has said:

you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

No, you can't but if one continues to think about it and think about it, dwells on it to the point of rage and emplanting a seed within the brain, one may eventually end up in jail. :lol:

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 3:24 pm
by turtle
Arcturus Descending wrote:The little reptile has said:

you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

No, you can't but if one continues to think about it and think about it, dwells on it to the point of rage and emplanting a seed within the brain, one may eventually end up in jail. :lol:


of course arc...hello....that is what is always said and it may be wishful thinking...almost everyone has all kinds of bad thoughts...and we have been taught we are bad to think them or we are on the brink of being a bad person for thinking this stuff..

Re: Philosophy For Us Dummies

PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2014 3:33 pm
by Arcturus Descending
turtle wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:The little reptile has said:

you cant go to jail for what you are thinking....

No, you can't but if one continues to think about it and think about it, dwells on it to the point of rage and emplanting a seed within the brain, one may eventually end up in jail. :lol:


of course arc...hello....that is what is always said and it may be wishful thinking...almost everyone has all kinds of bad thoughts...and we have been taught we are bad to think them or we are on the brink of being a bad person for thinking this stuff..


What part of it is "wishful thinking"?
Thoughts are neutral until they are "really" put into gear. But we do have to take responsibility for them. Relishing negative thouights, indulging in them can eventually lead to perdition. Observing them afterwards and questioning their roots, can lead to wisdom.