GOD=NATURE

Half-formed posts, inchoate philosophies, and the germs of deep thought.

GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Tue Jul 15, 2014 3:05 pm

we are all talking about the same thing...we just argue about what is real and what is supernatural...because we are driven to compete...
and some people don't know about nature...
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Wed Jul 16, 2014 2:05 pm

turtle wrote:we are all talking about the same thing...we just argue about what is real and what is supernatural...because we are driven to compete...
and some people don't know about nature...


heh I am laying a big egg here....atheists take notice....you cant attack it because you only attack the fathergod...
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby zinnat » Wed Jul 16, 2014 8:07 pm

turtle wrote:we are all talking about the same thing...we just argue about what is real and what is supernatural...because we are driven to compete...
and some people don't know about nature...


The term supernatural is oxymoron.

Supernatural means that something is superior than nature.
But, the problem is that if anything is superior than nature, how it can ever exist or happen?
If anything can happen, than simply means that it natural.

Someone may argure that supernatural is that does not happen normally. But, even that does not the test of logic.
Cyclones and earh-quakes rarely happen but that rarity does not make then supernatural.
They are very much the part of the nature.

with love,
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:20 pm

turtle wrote:we are all talking about the same thing...we just argue about what is real and what is supernatural...because we are driven to compete...
and some people don't know about nature...


atheists please try to attack this position------------GOD=NATURE
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby idioticidioms » Fri Jul 18, 2014 1:29 pm

zinnat13 wrote:
turtle wrote:we are all talking about the same thing...we just argue about what is real and what is supernatural...because we are driven to compete...
and some people don't know about nature...


The term supernatural is oxymoron.

Supernatural means that something is superior than nature.
But, the problem is that if anything is superior than nature, how it can ever exist or happen?
If anything can happen, than simply means that it natural.

Someone may argure that supernatural is that does not happen normally. But, even that does not the test of logic.
Cyclones and earh-quakes rarely happen but that rarity does not make then supernatural.
They are very much the part of the nature.

with love,
sanjay



(of a manifestation or event) attributed to some force beyond scientific understanding or the laws of nature.


you should really acquaint your self with words before making an ass of your self.

with love,
Chris Brown
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 2:07 pm

turtle wrote:
turtle wrote:we are all talking about the same thing...we just argue about what is real and what is supernatural...because we are driven to compete...
and some people don't know about nature...


atheists please try to attack this position------------GOD=NATURE


bring it on
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Jul 18, 2014 2:15 pm

If God is the essence of everything, Nature would be a manifestation of God, not a sum total.
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 2:21 pm

Ierrellus wrote:If God is the essence of everything, Nature would be a manifestation of God, not a sum total.


you could look at it either way...I like my way...you like your way....only opinions not the truth
but I think my way is more accurate because it only assumes what is known not what is believed...
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Jul 18, 2014 2:38 pm

How do you presume to believe that belief may or may not be what is known? I know God beyond belief.
Why would an atheist feel threatened by naturalistic philosophy? Don't they believe Nature is all there is?
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:14 pm

Ierrellus wrote:How do you presume to believe that belief may or may not be what is known? I know God beyond belief.
Why would an atheist feel threatened by naturalistic philosophy? Don't they believe Nature is all there is?


ier----all some atheists attack is the fathergod....they don't know anything else...
the reason I like my god------my god is a work in progress...my god is nature as we know it now....but tomorrow we will add on...
there is no telling what is out there.....there may be something very personal...but we don't know all about personal nature...
we don't even accept what human nature is and can be....this nature god is a work in progress ...it is a god that bridges the gap between atheist and theist...
we can argue about the science.....the facts .....but we can stop fighting and join forces if both sides will agree to the working hypothesis of god...
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:20 pm

I just underwent an operation. Family and friends were praying for me. The operation was a success; and, to everyone's astonishment, I have felt no pain. Two days later-- no pain from a large incision in my throat. Prayer works! God heals!
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:24 pm

Ierrellus wrote:I just underwent an operation. Family and friends were praying for me. The operation was a success; and, to everyone's astonishment, I have felt no pain. Two days later-- no pain from a large incision in my throat. Prayer works! God heals!


I am glad you came through good....what do you think of my last post...
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:28 pm

I don't think atheists will attack naturalism. Theists might; but I don't. I'm a Christian naturalist and see no problem with God=Nature. I just see God as more than that.
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:50 pm

Ierrellus wrote:I don't think atheists will attack naturalism. Theists might; but I don't. I'm a Christian naturalist and see no problem with God=Nature. I just see God as more than that.


well it is more than that... and we all may be surprised...you have bridged the gap but you still believe you are right and I am wrong..
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:52 pm

turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I don't think atheists will attack naturalism. Theists might; but I don't. I'm a Christian naturalist and see no problem with God=Nature. I just see God as more than that.


well it is more than that... and we all may be surprised...you have bridged the gap but you still believe you are right and I am wrong..

No, I don't see what you say as wrong. It's just incomplete for me; maybe not for you.
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:58 pm

Ierrellus wrote:
turtle wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:I don't think atheists will attack naturalism. Theists might; but I don't. I'm a Christian naturalist and see no problem with God=Nature. I just see God as more than that.


well it is more than that... and we all may be surprised...you have bridged the gap but you still believe you are right and I am wrong..

No, I don't see what you say as wrong. It's just incomplete for me; maybe not for you.


hey I think it is incomplete...it is a work that is not finished...and since it is not finished...how can we know for sure...we then must say...I don't know god
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby AutSider » Sat Jul 19, 2014 11:09 am

Sure, and if I say

DRAGONS = NATURE

That proves dragons exists, because nature obviously exists, right?

I'm really tired of addressing this particular argument, figure it out yourself.
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Sat Jul 19, 2014 11:25 am

Atheris wrote:Sure, and if I say

DRAGONS = NATURE

That proves dragons exists, because nature obviously exists, right?

I'm really tired of addressing this particular argument, figure it out yourself.


you are tired of the argument because you have nothing to say...you just don't get what I am saying or you haven't followed this thread
I am redefining god so that the atheist-theist debate can turn into a discussion...
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby AutSider » Sat Jul 19, 2014 12:11 pm

you are tired of the argument because you have nothing to say...you just don't get what I am saying or you haven't followed this thread
I am redefining god so that the atheist-theist debate can turn into a discussion...


You don't get my point at all. Concepts like "God" and "Dragon" are too deeply embedded in minds of most people to change their definitions now.

No matter how you try to redefine it, when you say "God" people will always think of an incredibly powerful and intelligent being that created the universe, they will NOT think of nature. You're just bringing further confusion to the discussion.

Just like it doesn't matter if you try to redefine the word "Dragon", as people have already learned to think of a flying, fire-breathing reptile (or the Chinese version), NOT nature.

Stop trying to change the definitions of old words, it's not going to happen, if you have a new concept, express it with a new word.

The LAST thing the theist-atheist debate needs is more confusion.
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Sat Jul 19, 2014 1:38 pm

Atheris wrote:
you are tired of the argument because you have nothing to say...you just don't get what I am saying or you haven't followed this thread
I am redefining god so that the atheist-theist debate can turn into a discussion...


You don't get my point at all. Concepts like "God" and "Dragon" are too deeply embedded in minds of most people to change their definitions now.

No matter how you try to redefine it, when you say "God" people will always think of an incredibly powerful and intelligent being that created the universe, they will NOT think of nature. You're just bringing further confusion to the discussion.

Just like it doesn't matter if you try to redefine the word "Dragon", as people have already learned to think of a flying, fire-breathing reptile (or the Chinese version), NOT nature.

Stop trying to change the definitions of old words, it's not going to happen, if you have a new concept, express it with a new word.

The LAST thing the theist-atheist debate needs is more confusion.


very good points....this will not be easy.....but we must redefine a lot of things....this will clear up confusion...
people have used the word god for centuries to mean what we don't know and try to control it....
so we do not know about the origin of the universe but we are working on it....it is a work in progress....it is part of the naturegod..
atheists need to hold on to attacking the persongod...they are not attacking what people are doing to each other...
we need to talk about secular humanism as being part of our nature ....part of the naturegod...you still don't get it...
I want to redefine the word god.....I want an agnostic god plus nature...we already know some about nature..
people want to hold on to the persongod as the authority....I don't like this....it is their heroin..it is not easy to give up an opiate..
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Sat Jul 19, 2014 2:24 pm

Our minds gravitate from the known into the unknown. It is this unknown that appears to be the problem here. Anyone can guess what the unknown entails. Science offers possibilities. Are you saying religion does not?
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Sat Jul 19, 2014 2:59 pm

Ierrellus wrote:Our minds gravitate from the known into the unknown. It is this unknown that appears to be the problem here. Anyone can guess what the unknown entails. Science offers possibilities. Are you saying religion does not?


religion does.....but religion means a lot of different ideas....some are hateful....some create false hopes in people.....
I see a lot of my fellow church people worshipping and praying to god but they totally forget the golden rule...
they focus on control of god to get good and avoid bad...they think they can do it without doing the ground work...
I just don't like those people that think they are superior beings because they believe in god...
homosexual problems in the church are causing serious problems for people....is having sex with someone of the same sex a sin...
what kind of a sin....how serious....maybe you would not get into heaven.....or maybe hell is the place for you..
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby Ierrellus » Sat Jul 19, 2014 3:09 pm

I lost a daughter over the argument about homosexuality. She said it was sin. I said it was a genetic fluke. I accused her of homophobia. She chose to delete me from her life. So, yes, I understand religious arrogance and also dislike it.
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby turtle » Sat Jul 19, 2014 3:17 pm

Ierrellus wrote:I lost a daughter over the argument about homosexuality. She said it was sin. I said it was a genetic fluke. I accused her of homophobia. She chose to delete me from her life. So, yes, I understand religious arrogance and also dislike it.


I just saw a video on twitter by kristy tv... interview with a gay man with a strong religious family....very moving
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Re: GOD=NATURE

Postby AutSider » Sat Jul 19, 2014 4:12 pm

people want to hold on to the persongod as the authority....I don't like this....it is their heroin..it is not easy to give up an opiate..


I agree with that, but what you want to do seems like trying to "cheat" them out of believing in God by just redefining the word. As I said, I don't think it's the best way to do it.

IMO this world needs more honesty and a direct approach to such issues, not a new definition of an already abstract concept.
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