Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Arminius » Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:06 am

Kriswest wrote:Hmm, so you would rather see beaten and abused kids live hellish lives just because you happen to believe women should birth. You seem to think that all people are capable of being loving caring parents. I would rather see thousands of aborted fetuses then one abused unloved unwanted child or a dead child.

A reproduction rate of 1 is not high and not low. It is exactly in the balance - at least statistically. The current reproduction rate is about 1.17, and demographically the difference (0.17) between 1 and 1.17 is a very big difference. Anyway, my argument is not as much a quantitative one as it is a qualitative one.

You say that parents with many children abuse their children, thus you say that (for example) African parents abuse their children. I don't know whether you are right, although, statistically, one can say that the more children parents have the more the children are at risk of being abused - but that is merely a statistical statement, thus often but not always true. If everyone has merely one child, thus a couple two children, then everything is fine. Currently every human on this planet has statistically 1.17 children, thus a couple statistically 2.34 children. The African reproduction rate is about five to seven times higher than the European reproduction rate. If you are right, Kriswest, then you should demand the reduction of the African reproduction rate. And if that will happen, then the global reproduction rate will be soon less than 1. But that is not my argument. My argument is that it is very unfair and thus it should not be allowed that the Africans and the West and Central Asians have the children but almost no money and power while the others have the money and the power but almost no children. That will lead us into a rael hell on Earth. You knwo what I mean?

There is a very deep correlation between the reproduction (biological and demographical), the production (economical), the wealth (economical, social), the power (economical, social, political), and the intelligence. If the reproduction rate is high, than the others are low; if the reproduction rate is low, than the others are high. Those who say that this correlation doesn't exist are liars.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Wandering_Lands » Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:06 am

Kriswest wrote:Rofl, Ok just how does PP do eugenics? You do realize they treat both financially poor male and female patients with sexual diseases or problems, they don't just do abortions.


I think you should look into this.

Racist Eugenicist Statements by Margaret Sanger: http://blackquillandink.com/wp-content/ ... quotes.pdf
The Mother of Planned Parenthood: http://www.toomanyaborted.com/sanger/

With that, and many more that you can search for yourself, I think that the very fact that they target poor people is evidence for my case.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Arminius » Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:08 am

ravencry4all wrote:I simply hate to do this, but you give me no other choice!
Arminius!
"There is no argument in your post.
Your declaration does not make it so.
Like this:
Feminism seems NOT to go hand in hand with state eugenics.
That is my counter-argument!"

You say that there is no argument and that you have a counter argument to that not existing argument. That's funny. :lol:
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Thu Jan 08, 2015 1:36 am

Wandering_Lands wrote:
Kriswest wrote:Rofl, Ok just how does PP do eugenics? You do realize they treat both financially poor male and female patients with sexual diseases or problems, they don't just do abortions.


I think you should look into this.

Racist Eugenicist Statements by Margaret Sanger: http://blackquillandink.com/wp-content/ ... quotes.pdf
The Mother of Planned Parenthood: http://www.toomanyaborted.com/sanger/

With that, and many more that you can search for yourself, I think that the very fact that they target poor people is evidence for my case.

I am familiar with the Sanger and the rest. A seed is not the plant.
PP, if truly centered for such, is doing a really crappy job of it.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Wandering_Lands » Thu Jan 08, 2015 2:29 am

Kriswest wrote:PP, if truly centered for such, is doing a really crappy job of it.


It's just one of many organizations and people trying to manipulate society through all facets as possible. But then again, I do want to get too deep into it; it would drift away from the topic of this thread.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Thu Jan 08, 2015 2:42 am

You do realize that such has been going on since the beginning. It works, it doesn't work. If you breed to a mindless piece of twaddle, its on you no one else.
I will be bitchy, cranky, sweet, happy, kind, pain in the ass all at random times from now on. I am embracing my mentalpause until further notice. Viva lack of total control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is not a test,,, this is my life right now. Have a good day and please buckle up for safety reasons,, All those in high chairs, go in the back of the room.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Jr Wells » Thu Jan 08, 2015 8:24 am

James S Saint wrote:
Kriswest wrote:Hmm, so you would rather see beaten and abused kids live hellish lives just because you happen to believe women should birth. You seem to think that all people are capable of being loving caring parents. I would rather see thousands of aborted fetuses then one abused unloved unwanted child or a dead child.

I suspect, like me, he would rather the real problem be addressed rather than the problem being used as an excuse/scapegoat for sake of subtly state controlled eugenics.

Firstly: Kriswest, in the USA
Whites = 72% (of total population)
Blacks = 13% (of total population)
% of abortions by whites = 52% (of total abortions)
% of abortions by blacks = 41% (of total abortions)

This is statistically important to consider.

Secondly: Well stated James
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:20 pm

The statistics tell me that females are deciding to not be mother or be pregnant. I note your statistics leaves out ages, regions, urban, suburban, education levels, religions and political affiliation, etc.. Your statistics is the same as taking one chapter out of a book and declaring it the whole story.
I will be bitchy, cranky, sweet, happy, kind, pain in the ass all at random times from now on. I am embracing my mentalpause until further notice. Viva lack of total control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is not a test,,, this is my life right now. Have a good day and please buckle up for safety reasons,, All those in high chairs, go in the back of the room.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Wandering_Lands » Thu Jan 08, 2015 2:33 pm

Kriswest wrote:You do realize that such has been going on since the beginning. It works, it doesn't work. If you breed to a mindless piece of twaddle, its on you no one else.


Sure. :D
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Dan~ » Thu Jan 08, 2015 11:31 pm

At first I had wondered if it was true that white women were disgenic and anti-family.
Not 100% of them, but even 10% is well over millions of women.
They were selected and bred for looks, not for intelligence or for strength.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Jr Wells » Fri Jan 09, 2015 12:09 am

Kriswest wrote:The statistics tell me that females are deciding to not be mother or be pregnant. I note your statistics leaves out ages, regions, urban, suburban, education levels, religions and political affiliation, etc.. Your statistics is the same as taking one chapter out of a book and declaring it the whole story.

Note that I did not just give abortion statistics, I gave them relative to population statistics for all of the USA. These are damning statistics irrespective of age, regions, education, religion, political... as it encompasses all of these.

We could say, the lower the education the higher the abortion rate... and blacks are more uneducated. This does not alter the fact that "overall" abortion rates are related to skin color. In fact, this makes the situation even worse.

There is substance within the OP that needs to be examined and not simply dismissed. I am not saying that the OP is true but instead I am saying it needs to be examined within a critical framework. Dismissing statistical realities does not fit within a critical framework. At the moment you hold on to a strong opinion that cannot be validated.

Edit: "In 2004, the rates of abortion by ethnicity in the U.S. were 50 abortions per 1,000 black women, 28 abortions per 1,000 Hispanic women, and 11 abortions per 1,000 white women"
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Lev Muishkin » Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:01 am

Abortion is a matter of education and poverty.
I imagine if you were to examine populations outside the US, you would find education and poverty would show a greater co-relation.

Because the US has a significant race prejudice and bias, the numbers look like a race issue.

For example...

http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/home ... d.19138671

Scotland is not so racially diverse, yet has a high rate of abortion in teens.

When the figures are not completely obsessed by and buried by race, the obvious and widespread correlation are more obvious.
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http://nyfamilylife.org/wp-content/uplo ... tients.pdf
Last edited by Lev Muishkin on Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:07 am

50 out of 1000 oh my, 950 women kept their babies, 50 did not. 950,,,,,50.... hmmm. If I was going to cull a herd that 50 is not worth doing.
You are very wrong about ethnicity being that important, all must be looked at in order to gather a true picture. Your argument is blinded by a fervent belief. Statistics are notoriously biased and only part of the overall. Preachers, politicians, leaders pound on their favored statistics, they never say crap about anything that might detract from their goal.
I will be bitchy, cranky, sweet, happy, kind, pain in the ass all at random times from now on. I am embracing my mentalpause until further notice. Viva lack of total control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is not a test,,, this is my life right now. Have a good day and please buckle up for safety reasons,, All those in high chairs, go in the back of the room.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Lev Muishkin » Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:14 am

Jr Wells wrote:
Kriswest wrote:The statistics tell me that females are deciding to not be mother or be pregnant. I note your statistics leaves out ages, regions, urban, suburban, education levels, religions and political affiliation, etc.. Your statistics is the same as taking one chapter out of a book and declaring it the whole story.

Note that I did not just give abortion statistics, I gave them relative to population statistics for all of the USA. These are damning statistics irrespective of age, regions, education, religion, political... as it encompasses all of these.

We could say, the lower the education the higher the abortion rate... and blacks are more uneducated. This does not alter the fact that "overall" abortion rates are related to skin color. In fact, this makes the situation even worse.

There is substance within the OP that needs to be examined and not simply dismissed. I am not saying that the OP is true but instead I am saying it needs to be examined within a critical framework. Dismissing statistical realities does not fit within a critical framework. At the moment you hold on to a strong opinion that cannot be validated.

Edit: "In 2004, the rates of abortion by ethnicity in the U.S. were 50 abortions per 1,000 black women, 28 abortions per 1,000 Hispanic women, and 11 abortions per 1,000 white women"


Rates are causally related to poverty and education, not colour.

Because there is a Correlation between colour and poverty and education, this is why you THINK it is something to do with colour.

See previous post.

"Science is entirely Faith Based.... Obama is Muslim....Evil is the opposition to life (e-v-i-l <=> l-i-v-e ... and not by accident). Without evil there could be no life.", James S. Saint.
"The Holocaust was the fault of the Jews; The Holocaust was not genocide", Kriswest
"A Tortoise is a Turtle", Wizard
" Hitler didn't create the Nazis. In reality, the Judists did ... for a purpose of their own. Hitler was merely one they chose to head it up after they discovered the Judist betrayal in WW1, their "Judas Iscariot";James S Saint.
These just keep getting funnier.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Lev Muishkin » Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:18 am

Kriswest wrote:50 out of 1000 oh my, 950 women kept their babies, 50 did not. 950,,,,,50.... hmmm. If I was going to cull a herd that 50 is not worth doing.
You are very wrong about ethnicity being that important, all must be looked at in order to gather a true picture. Your argument is blinded by a fervent belief. Statistics are notoriously biased and only part of the overall. Preachers, politicians, leaders pound on their favored statistics, they never say crap about anything that might detract from their goal.


True.

~There is a far more obvious problem with what is implied here.
The fact is that no one is forced to have an abortion, so the idea that the government is somehow conspiring to kill off black is absurd.
For sure there are structural problems which ensure that black people tend to continue to be poor and poorly educated, but that is a different question.

"Science is entirely Faith Based.... Obama is Muslim....Evil is the opposition to life (e-v-i-l <=> l-i-v-e ... and not by accident). Without evil there could be no life.", James S. Saint.
"The Holocaust was the fault of the Jews; The Holocaust was not genocide", Kriswest
"A Tortoise is a Turtle", Wizard
" Hitler didn't create the Nazis. In reality, the Judists did ... for a purpose of their own. Hitler was merely one they chose to head it up after they discovered the Judist betrayal in WW1, their "Judas Iscariot";James S Saint.
These just keep getting funnier.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Jr Wells » Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:18 am

Kriswest wrote:50 out of 1000 oh my, 950 women kept their babies, 50 did not. 950,,,,,50.... hmmm. If I was going to cull a herd that 50 is not worth doing.
You are very wrong about ethnicity being that important, all must be looked at in order to gather a true picture. Your argument is blinded by a fervent belief. Statistics are notoriously biased and only part of the overall. Preachers, politicians, leaders pound on their favored statistics, they never say crap about anything that might detract from their goal.

Kriswest, you clearly did not read my post.
Last edited by Jr Wells on Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Jr Wells » Fri Jan 09, 2015 1:19 am

Lev Muishkin wrote:
Jr Wells wrote:
Kriswest wrote:The statistics tell me that females are deciding to not be mother or be pregnant. I note your statistics leaves out ages, regions, urban, suburban, education levels, religions and political affiliation, etc.. Your statistics is the same as taking one chapter out of a book and declaring it the whole story.

Note that I did not just give abortion statistics, I gave them relative to population statistics for all of the USA. These are damning statistics irrespective of age, regions, education, religion, political... as it encompasses all of these.

We could say, the lower the education the higher the abortion rate... and blacks are more uneducated. This does not alter the fact that "overall" abortion rates are related to skin color. In fact, this makes the situation even worse.

There is substance within the OP that needs to be examined and not simply dismissed. I am not saying that the OP is true but instead I am saying it needs to be examined within a critical framework. Dismissing statistical realities does not fit within a critical framework. At the moment you hold on to a strong opinion that cannot be validated.

Edit: "In 2004, the rates of abortion by ethnicity in the U.S. were 50 abortions per 1,000 black women, 28 abortions per 1,000 Hispanic women, and 11 abortions per 1,000 white women"


Rates are causally related to poverty and education, not colour.

Because there is a Correlation between colour and poverty and education, this is why you THINK it is something to do with colour.

See previous post.


Lev, you clearly did not read my post.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Fri Jan 09, 2015 2:06 am

Jr Wells wrote:
Kriswest wrote:50 out of 1000 oh my, 950 women kept their babies, 50 did not. 950,,,,,50.... hmmm. If I was going to cull a herd that 50 is not worth doing.
You are very wrong about ethnicity being that important, all must be looked at in order to gather a true picture. Your argument is blinded by a fervent belief. Statistics are notoriously biased and only part of the overall. Preachers, politicians, leaders pound on their favored statistics, they never say crap about anything that might detract from their goal.

Kriswest, you clearly did not read my post.

Clearly I did. You have an agenda and refuse to see any other possible. Why not look at why the babies were not aborted, since they vastly outnumber the aborted. Why not take a look at that side of your statistics. It does show that women want their progeny and as far as I know there is no program forcing women to choose sexual partners... oh wait,,, Hollywood does that doesn't it..
I will be bitchy, cranky, sweet, happy, kind, pain in the ass all at random times from now on. I am embracing my mentalpause until further notice. Viva lack of total control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is not a test,,, this is my life right now. Have a good day and please buckle up for safety reasons,, All those in high chairs, go in the back of the room.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Jr Wells » Fri Jan 09, 2015 2:22 am

Kriswest wrote:
Jr Wells wrote:
Kriswest wrote:50 out of 1000 oh my, 950 women kept their babies, 50 did not. 950,,,,,50.... hmmm. If I was going to cull a herd that 50 is not worth doing.
You are very wrong about ethnicity being that important, all must be looked at in order to gather a true picture. Your argument is blinded by a fervent belief. Statistics are notoriously biased and only part of the overall. Preachers, politicians, leaders pound on their favored statistics, they never say crap about anything that might detract from their goal.

Kriswest, you clearly did not read my post.

Clearly I did. You have an agenda and refuse to see any other possible. Why not look at why the babies were not aborted, since they vastly outnumber the aborted. Why not take a look at that side of your statistics. It does show that women want their progeny and as far as I know there is no program forcing women to choose sexual partners... oh wait,,, Hollywood does that doesn't it..

Kriswest, you clearly did not read my post. You are reacting to what is in your own head.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby A Shieldmaiden » Fri Jan 09, 2015 3:12 am


Perpetualburn
wrote:

Is it true that if a woman gives her child up for adoption after giving birth she's not obligated to pay child support to the new family, but a man is obligated to pay child support even if he doesn't want to have the child with her after she gets pregnant(and eventually gives birth)?


To become a man means to go on your own, in other words, take some responsibility in controlling your own life.

Wear a condom.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby James S Saint » Fri Jan 09, 2015 3:57 am

A Shieldmaiden wrote:To become a man means to go on your own, in other words, take some responsibility in controlling your own life.

Wear a condom.

Soooo ... emmm ... what does becoming a "woman" mean? :-k
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Fri Jan 09, 2015 12:23 pm

Jr Wells wrote:
Kriswest wrote:
Jr Wells wrote:Kriswest, you clearly did not read my post.

Clearly I did. You have an agenda and refuse to see any other possible. Why not look at why the babies were not aborted, since they vastly outnumber the aborted. Why not take a look at that side of your statistics. It does show that women want their progeny and as far as I know there is no program forcing women to choose sexual partners... oh wait,,, Hollywood does that doesn't it..

Kriswest, you clearly did not read my post. You are reacting to what is in your own head.

Again, I have read your post/s. To keep saying I have not read your post/s does not refute what I say. It does say that you can not give a reply.
I will be bitchy, cranky, sweet, happy, kind, pain in the ass all at random times from now on. I am embracing my mentalpause until further notice. Viva lack of total control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is not a test,,, this is my life right now. Have a good day and please buckle up for safety reasons,, All those in high chairs, go in the back of the room.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby phoneutria » Fri Jan 09, 2015 2:47 pm

perpetualburn wrote:Is it true that if a woman gives her child up for adoption after giving birth she's not obligated to pay child support to the new family, but a man is obligated to pay child support even if he doesn't want to have the child with her after she gets pregnant(and eventually gives birth)?


Child support law exists for the child's sake, not for the mother's sake.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby perpetualburn » Fri Jan 09, 2015 7:31 pm

phoneutria wrote:
perpetualburn wrote:Is it true that if a woman gives her child up for adoption after giving birth she's not obligated to pay child support to the new family, but a man is obligated to pay child support even if he doesn't want to have the child with her after she gets pregnant(and eventually gives birth)?


Child support law exists for the child's sake, not for the mother's sake.


Is that why there's almost zero accountability for how a recipient of child support spends her(in most cases) money? And how do they determine who is the better parent in a custody battle again? Do you think child support laws are "fair"? Why is it so much easier for a woman to milk the system?

And regarding my first question. I believe if a woman wants to give up her child for adoption the father has to be on board or else he would become the guardian... She just can't give up the child without his consent. And if they both want to give up their child for adoption they're both giving up their parental rights.
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Re: Feminism, Abortion, And State Eugenics

Postby Kriswest » Fri Jan 09, 2015 8:25 pm

In the US. A father named is not required. Genetic testing of paternity is not required. Father's rights are not recognized unless his name is on the certificate and signed or testing proves positive.
Back in 78 my Dad received full custody of us. Mom took all the money and Dad took us. My Dad wanted it that way and I am glad.
I will be bitchy, cranky, sweet, happy, kind, pain in the ass all at random times from now on. I am embracing my mentalpause until further notice. Viva lack of total control!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! This is not a test,,, this is my life right now. Have a good day and please buckle up for safety reasons,, All those in high chairs, go in the back of the room.
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