Would you like US style European presidential elections?
No? well maybe the ‘powers’ that be in the EU equally don’t want that. Perhaps if they wanted power, then they would want >more democracy< and US style presidential elections. Is it so hard to understand that this gives regional governments more power, and is running against the notion we all don’t want i.e. of a centralised European power. If we did have that then one country or another, or a main 2 or 3 will be seen as ruling all, and that would be a duality invoking a division. Secondly such a power could start trying to run the affairs of the world, even more so than it the richest zone already is.
Our presidential elections? We have a presidential system, EU from my understanding uses a kind of parliamentary system. The current chaos you see with Trump and the Anti-Trump Republicans, and Bernie and Clinton squaring off prior to the party conventions, is the closest we get to parlimemtry coalitions. People are wondering if Bernie will embrace Hillary, break off forming a leftist version of the tea party… nobody knows if the conservatives will remain republician, or bail ship… going to Hillary or the Libertarians. In previous coalitions, the “conservatives” were with the Republicans, practically meant the same thing. Civil War, certainly wasn’t thus way. Back in the 30s, certainly wasn’t this way.
Stuff shifts around… but once officials are elected it tends to turn stagnant. We don’t ever tell all of Congress because Bill Clinton lost a confidence vote that all the senators and represatives just lost their job and we are having new national elections on a whim. We built our system for long term stability and a strong executive capable of kicking ass. It explains why our election process is so very long.
You need to compare the EU to our older constitution, The Articles of Confederation. We had a lot of the same problems, but overcame them. It is central to our state rights vs federal outlook, for example… which you hint at … we realized our quasi-parliamentary system wasn’t working so switched to our current constitution.
I don’t think the EU can easily jump into thus, given the history of strong continental European executives tended to be emperors and tyrants with royal ambitions or perogatives, and half if Europe still have traits of these easier systems in vestigial forms… they can regenerate easily. We took our constitution building process very seriously, and committed to it. Its only recently with the left’s assault on it that the very fabric of our society is falling under threat. Without very strict observance and everyone getting what the constitution is about… in the US even uneducated laymen can do this to a extent, it falls into a tyranny and banana republic fast. Most presidential systems around the world don’t work for this very reason. I don’t think Europe is mature enough for this yet. Perhaps someday, but their general commitment to “Europe” isn’t the same as a American’s commitment is to “America”. 50 states are equal, is France and England really equal to some of the eastern states. How readily would you live there, or die for them? You gotta have these kind of instinctive commitments before you can have a US style presidential system. Look at Turkey with Erdogan for proof.
The US is different because it has always been one nation since independence. My complaint wasn’t about that, as that’s Americas business. My point was that people like this… [the anti ‘being in EU/Europe’ types]
are complaining about the EU not being democratic, and also complaining about the EU being too powerful [and undemocratic it the bilderburg type conspiracy sense]. A clear contradiction.
No, US hasn’t always been one nation. We had a civil war, and often mini America’s would be set up… like Texas or Oregon, independent nations desiring to join. Also some rogue states, like Deadwood, South Dakota, or the Mormons, or Burrs little fake nation, or Hawaii.
We also have some awkward semi constitutional somewhat sovereign states, to full dependencies that are self ruling with their own presidents and constitutions but officially unincorporated territory like Samoa or Saipan… which confuses me given we just sorts jerk around in regards to what court system they fall under… we are inconsistent, and UN keeps labeling them as colonial possessions even though they do pretty much whatever they care to, riding the US tax payer dime. Honestly, if ocean.levels rise, half the Pacific has treaties with us to immigrate. Guess the rest will just paddle to Australia.
I don’t think most Europeans grasp our system, especially these nuances. These whatever statelets have Max democracy, a practical free ride and half UN representation, but also can become American or immigrate on the drop of a hat. We get very little benefits in return other than some deep water naval bases to we can keep China from conquering Australia… which honestly at this point… I don’t care, let them.
Democracy can come in a absurd number of forms, near full autonomy minus foreign policy… taken care of by the dominate superpower on the planet who floods your little worthless island with jobs is likely the best. Very few responsibilities, all they do is bitch about local Nepotism, and how the US should step in to stop it (we generally don’t care, cause nobody bothers to look into such matters… as long as everyone on Saipan isn’t eating one another).
I doubt Europe can pull off US style centralization. We will see over the next few decades. Trump might speed things up by yanking most troops from Europe… Europe’s best chance us forming a common defense corps. That isn’t inherently democracy, but a state that large can’t have a unified state without such a force at it’s back and call. Its more or less a requirement on the way.
I did know most of that, but I take the point concerning nuances. Indeed I think it is better to be as much and varied as possible, and I think the non-democratic rulers of Europe agree, such that in fact in they aren’t attempting to be one country [-ish]. As things stand I don’t see that changing, but if the UK pulls out it may break up. Even if it does that, I think there will be similar or the same trade deals and ultimately nothing will change. That’s how I see the game atm.
China isn’t going to conquer Australia before e.g. Japan, and it wont be doing any of that unless it thinks it can pretty much take the world on, or defend itself to an impregnable degree. I expect it to continue being taken down the road of ‘involvement’ via investment, and resource/market sharing. So in the end there will be no-one with too much power perhaps?
You probably know that the EU has almost nothing to do with democracy. Someone who says that the EU “uses a kind of parliamentary system” just shows again nothing else than a huge ignorance, cluelessness. The president and the council of the EU are the only decision makers in the EU, and nobody has elected them. I hope that at least you know this, Amorphos.
You appear to have about as much knowledge on how the EU elections work as you do with German History… which is zilch.
The Parliament is directly elected. Now go wheel yourself off into the nursing home’s dining hall and wail against the Jacobites, and the good old days of the Prussian Legions and the Swatzika, to someone with dementia. You have a fantastic track record for being provably wrong and ass backwards on this site.
You know nothing at all; nothing about history, especially nothing about the European history. So you also know nothing about science, nothing about philosophy. You are the most clueless member of this forum; so it is no wonder that you are always telling lies. According to you Nigerians conquered the Roman empire, because this lie fis suitable for you and your stupid racist “ideology”. Now you are telling the lie of the “democratic” EU, that the EU “from” your “understanding ( ) uses a kind of parliamentary system”. That is ábsolutely ridiculous.
Try to tell your lies and fakes to another ILP member. I am not interested in them. And try to grow up, Turd Ferguson.
lol yes, but why attack former british colonies, when they have so many other targets? …and I doubt if they think they are quite ready to take on the world. that’s what happens, powers get big and then get too involved in the moneymaking to risk it all.
Arminius
I used the Farage video above… attacking the president of Europe, asking who are you. But that’s the whole point of the op, I think the Eu ‘club’ is purposefully not democratic, and if they wanted power, they would be democratic and have US style elections.
) uses a kind of parliamentary system”. That is ábsolutely ridiculous.
