Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

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Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:05 pm

http://abc13.com/news/weslayan-shooting ... i/1526983/

http://www.wsj.com/articles/houston-gun ... 1475017375

In a recent shooting in Houston, the suspect of Indian origin (half-indian?) was an educated struggling lawyer who went on a shooting spree while wearing a an old military uniform with Nazi emblems, and was in possession of Nazi memorabilia. What is the connection between Indians and Nazism? I highly doubt that the guy was a neo-Nazi; it is very likely that he himself was a victim of racism (name change), and his motives were, in part, out of financial frustration and confused identity, but nonetheless, it was suggested that India did support the Nazi ideology, and even took it to the next (esoteric) level.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esoteric_Nazism

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iSfP1XBrkIY

Based on what I know so far from the above, it seems to me that, historically, it was mainly an alliance of political convenience, and the sense of nationalism was the uniting factor. There were, indeed, some similarities, as India also believed in the caste system, rejected Islam/Christianity and embraced paganism, but I doubt that the Germans saw Indians (or Japanese) as Aryans. The Japanese, who were allies with Germany in WWII, also mystified nationalism, but on their own spiritualized Japanese level.
All in all, I see it as a matter of practicality, and the esoteric factor as a supporting metaphysical propaganda that is usually adopted and disseminated by the superstitious folk. Why would one have a need to resort to mysticism (mythology) to support own sense of nationalism other than that it does not have anything tangible to back it up with? Anyway, that's how I see it, the whole idea that one's sense of pride (national identity) to be imbued and supported by some historic supernatural aura is just full of hot air. That's just another way for nations to overcome their own sense of worthlessness and become special in their own right ( and I don't mean necessarily just India here).
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Fri Sep 30, 2016 6:41 pm

Some people feel worthless.
Why is that?
Is there something wrong with them?
Where is a sense of worth coming from?

Can we do things to destroy someone's sense of worth?
Can we push it?

Would it not be advisable to destroy our enemies' sense of worth?

Why does Pandora not like nationalism or national socialism for that matter?
Is it more due to her genetic inheritance or more ideological training?
Could Pandora have been raised to be a proud national socialist in the Third Reich?
Or would the desire to destroy the society she is part of always be too tempting?

Why are people still using these old 'your identity is just a social construct' tactics these days?
- Yeah, so is the worth of your life.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:12 pm

Is_Yde_opN wrote:Where is a sense of worth coming from?
Good question. This is the same question I ask.

Can we do things to destroy someone's sense of worth? Can we push it?
If one does not have an inherent sense of self-worth (tangible) to begin with, he will try to manufacture it, out of thin air. It's the same with nations.

Would it not be advisable to destroy our enemies' sense of worth?
Yes, but you're automatically assuming there IS a sense of self worth. Anyone can claim to have a sense of self worth (from whatever) and anyone can claim the victimhood status, when challenged.

Why does Pandora not like nationalism or national socialism for that matter?
Because I see a lot of unsubstantiated nationalism going on. Where does your pride come from, other than that you just are? Anyone can do that and people (nations) do.

Is it more due to her genetic inheritance or more ideological training?
It is due to what I see in politics. Does a small nation deserve to have the same pride (nationalism) just because it is? Just because it exists?

Could Pandora have been raised to be a proud national socialist in the Third Reich?
Or would the desire to destroy the society she is part of always be too tempting?

Very insinuating questions you ask, but ok. What I am asking - what are you preserving? What do you have that is worthwhile to preserve, other than what is? This is like preserving Panda bears - because they are one of the kind - in their natural habitat. Do you want to preserve something 'just because'? Because everyone wants to do that, everyone wants to be someone special and unique, no matter who or what they are.

Why are people still using these old 'your identity is just a social construct' tactics these days?
- Yeah, so is the worth of your life.
I didn't speak of identity as social construct, I questioned the source of national pride.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:34 pm

I'll give an example. One of the most nationalistic people that I've seen so far are Puerto Ricans - full of national pride, and they will let you know it. But what do they have to be proud of? Rum? Fried bananas? Their astronomical debt? Where does their sense of nationalism come from other than that they are, as they are?
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:38 pm

Pandora wrote:If one does not have an inherent sense of self-worth (tangible) to begin with, he will try to manufacture it, out of thin air. It's the same with nations.


Tangible? You mean like genetic, bodily self-preservation?
Like Ethno-nationalism is on a group level.
Like National Socialism in the Third Reich.
I do think that's a healthy root for self-worth, a sense of physical self-preservation.

So when it comes to manufacturing something, like Chomsky manufacturing his narratives, the question would be, why does the deracinated individual with no sense for his genetic inheritance have a sense of worth, how is that tangible?
Is it not the pinnacle (so far) of making your sense of worth up out of thin air. Indeed and it is very ironic that those who push for it came up with the angle of attack of the so called 'social construct'. "Your physicality, your genetic inheritance, is just a social construct because....drumroll....we can have an opinion about it." LOL
How could they ever make people believe this BS?
It must have been what they hoped for, what gave them comfort, an escape from their inheritance to manurefacture a new identity.

I didn't speak of identity as social construct, I questioned the source of national pride.


When it comes to any identity or group identity we can look for signs of being rooted in reality, in physicality and then there are also always goals, objectives, which are strived for, which define the identity.

Like -
"We are Americans and our identity is that all people are equal and that we can't wait to become like everybody else. Eh, I mean the world shall become like us, like everybody else."
"Hi I'm Bob and my identity is that I am not distinct from anybody else, and if I should discover that I am different from somebody else then it's my goal to eradicate this difference."
The pinnacle of identity...
It's now called globalism, which is obviously anti-any-nationalism.
Thin-air and self destructive.

In that sense, nationalism is a way to resist those globalist zealots of identity erasure. They are a suicide cult.
I like that frame.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:40 pm

Pandora wrote:I'll give an example. One of the most nationalistic people that I've seen so far are Puerto Ricans - full of national pride, and they will let you know it. But what do they have to be proud of? Rum? Fried bananas? Their astronomical debt? Where does their sense of nationalism come from other than that they are, as they are?


Why does the ant go on living?
What does it have to be proud of?
Why not just give up and float down the river?
Why?
Well, there really is no particular reason.
There are ants who have done that and they are now not around anymore.
So?
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Fixed Cross » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:49 pm

Why would one have a need to resort to mysticism (mythology) to support own sense of nationalism other than that it does not have anything tangible to back it up with? Anyway, that's how I see it, the whole idea that one's sense of pride (national identity) to be imbued and supported by some historic supernatural aura is just full of hot air. That's just another way for nations to overcome their own sense of worthlessness and become special in their own right ( and I don't mean necessarily just India here).

Great point.

Strong nations simply emanate mystique by their pure practical effectivity, often in the form of their bold intelligence.
The strong do what they can, the weak accept what they must.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Fri Sep 30, 2016 7:54 pm

So how do we know which (national) identity is better than any other identity?
We don't, not exactly anyway. But there are some attributes which give us a hint what might not work out so well.
Like not having enough offspring within an identity group. If you rely on new converts to your ideology and your in-group is dying then that's usually not a long-term plan for prosperity.
Kind of like a pyramid scheme.

That's just one example.

So why is a do-goody-good-mc-goody-two-shoes feeling proud about saving some starving children from some other identity group?
Why is she diverting resources to that end?
Because her identity tells her that it's good, morally good.
We shall see how that morality is going to work out.

Those god-damn evil colonialists!
LOL
Suicide pact again at work.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Fri Sep 30, 2016 10:19 pm

Is_Yde_opN wrote:So how do we know which (national) identity is better than any other identity?
Usually, the criteria has been a nation's achievements in science, medicine, architecture, literature, etc. I'm talking about actual tangible world-scale accomplishments - results.


So why is a do-goody-good-mc-goody-two-shoes feeling proud about saving some starving children from some other identity group?
Why is she diverting resources to that end?
Because her identity tells her that it's good, morally good.
We shall see how that morality is going to work out.

Those god-damn evil colonialists!
LOL
Suicide pact again at work.
It doesn't sound nationalistic, but many nations provide humanitarian assistance to select nations they plan to later use as allies against an enemy nation, or otherwise to indebt (or woo) them to their own interest. In the world of competing national interests, nobody's fool to believe that help is done for help's sake alone.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Fixed Cross » Fri Sep 30, 2016 11:48 pm

Is_Yde_opN wrote:So how do we know which (national) identity is better than any other identity?

Who is this "we"?

What are you , Jesus?
Do you assume all humans have the same values?

We don't, not exactly anyway. But there are some attributes which give us a hint what might not work out so well.
Like not having enough offspring within an identity group. If you rely on new converts to your ideology and your in-group is dying then that's usually not a long-term plan for prosperity.
Kind of like a pyramid scheme.

That's just one example.

Of your values.

So why is a do-goody-good-mc-goody-two-shoes feeling proud about saving some starving children from some other identity group?
Why is she diverting resources to that end?
Because her identity tells her that it's good, morally good.

Her values command it. She's powerful enough to attain her values, apparently. (no idea who you are referring to but it must be someone that had influence on you by executing her will as she saw fit)

We shall see how that morality is going to work out.

Probably itll work out by some one having food that wouldnt have had.

It doesnt seem very complicated I must say. Sometimes people think too much into things.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Fixed Cross » Fri Sep 30, 2016 11:54 pm

Pandora wrote:
Is_Yde_opN wrote:So how do we know which (national) identity is better than any other identity?
Usually, the criteria has been a nation's achievements in science, medicine, architecture, literature, etc. I'm talking about actual tangible world-scale accomplishments - results.

The problem is that nations that dont tend to cultivate science and literature, which are most nations really, dont tend to breed citizens that consider these things of value.

Furthermore, which type of medicine, and which style of architecture?

in terms of value-objectivity there is only the golden rule; he who has the gold, rules.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:04 am

Fixed Cross wrote:Strong nations simply emanate mystique by their pure practical effectivity, often in the form of their bold intelligence.

I don't think strong nations themselves need mysticism but they do seem to have that effect on lesser nations. It reminds me of a scene in Sand Pebbles in which Jake Holman explains Po-han how the engine works, who initially thinks the engine is full of spirits.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:08 am

Fixed Cross wrote:...in terms of value-objectivity there is only the golden rule; he who has the gold, rules.
It does take money for any advancement. Many people visit Europe to admire its architecture and art, not realizing just what was involved in making these things. The history behind these beautiful facades is anything but pretty.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Fixed Cross » Sat Oct 01, 2016 1:23 am

Pandora wrote:
Fixed Cross wrote:...in terms of value-objectivity there is only the golden rule; he who has the gold, rules.
It does take money for any advancement. Many people visit Europe to admire its architecture and art, not realizing just what was involved in making these things. The history behind these beautiful facades is anything but pretty.

That is Nietzsche in a nutshell; making the choice for man to toil to exalt his species quality, value of life, rather than to relax on the labor of his forefathers.
Today you cant build cathedrals because of minimum wages. That is in a sense for the best... except that the world still works on 10 cent per hour where it matters - in all the stuff we buy.

It is probably more rational to abolish minimum wage altogether and reset the labor-market, than to keep delegating misery abroad for our slightly price-reduced pleasures and the fat pockets of the middle men.

In general I think we should eliminate as many middle men as we can. Spontaneous, direct value transactions are 'magical' - they work to the benefit of both parties.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby The Golden Turd » Sat Oct 01, 2016 6:46 am

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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Fixed Cross » Sat Oct 01, 2016 6:53 am

Weirdest day in a while.

The degree to which people have hurt other people here is pretty steep, it creeps onto the surface some times. New Moon, unconditioned energy.



There is not ever an excuse for accusing someone of upholding an ideology that he doesn't. Value - law predicates mortal hatred on such things. It is this the ideologue is after - perhaps.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby The Golden Turd » Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:19 am

See the concepts by Colonel Du Picq "Elan" & "Esprite de Corps".

It more or less functions identically to nationalism, as it is a identification of "thisness" and "otherness" through expression of a historical construct, one that may or may not be correct, rarely is correct actually.

Everyone feels they can pursue and accept this spirit, till told/experienced otherwise. I tried out for the US Army Rangers, with plans of going Delta Force (absurdly loftly goals in hindsight), learned the histories.... When I was sent to my unit in Alaska, learned about that history, the very company of some 120 men was the unit that back in WW2 made the first US Parachuting jumps (US made the first earlier in WW1)....

Typically these unit histories sculpt a Esprite de Corps that looks very favorably, inspirationally, on a unit. It is a history without a counterculture, one of great bonds and great endeavors.

You never do really come across negative stories of shitheads getting busted for rape, burgulary, drugs, deserting, going AWOL.

Worst prior to Bergdahl for my unit was Hamburger Hill, they made a movie about it.

Now..... is that metaphysics? No. Is that history? Yes, it is historical writing, and it more often than not is factual within a military, but it is completely full of holes.... The unit history doesn't really try to expose the fullness of the experience of the past, if it did, it would be horrific and disgusting. Those people we're less educated generally, more brutal and far less considerate about the little realizations about our inheritance from them.

Nazis are a extreme case, it is a philosophy, nation, and ideology completely vanquished, only Nazis Corps tolerated with general respect is Rommels' Afrika Corps, and that is because Rommel didn't follow the dictates of Social Nationalism at all. He could of ideally of been a Charles DuGaulle rewriting history for a new Germany focused on him had he lived and the assassination of hitler of been a success.

It wasn't. Instead, every aspect of that God forsaken Nietzschean Empire was ripped from the earth brutally and thrown into the fire. Our emphasis on the worst aspects of the Nazis is likewise a inversion of Du Picq's principles. It is likewise not a accurate retelling, because while we are quick to lionize armies, the threat they posed, there is no unit history of heroes in it. Why? Those units were killed off in the war. Those unit histories aren't told.

Soviets didn't die off, they merely had a revolution, do we got a bunch of elder Russians around to call bullshit on propaganda. Nazis nearly were wiped out.

Reason why this even matters in the first place, is because the Romans instituted the idea of keeping legions, from Scipio Africanus till the 6/7th Centuries AD in the East, with unit histories and standardized names and some unique customs. Units that performed well lasted, those that didn't were disbanded. After a few centuries, some legions became infamous. No matter where you moved them, how sharp the retirement and influx of new recruits, they retained this, as if all the new guts deserved it.

I'm proud of bring part of a elite unit that trained all the paratroopers during WW2. I did not fight during WW2. Only one man in my town from my unit has that claim, and that is a sad looking manniquin in my towns museum, he died the night before D Day, likely a spear through the chest after parachuting in..... I remember stories of guys saying that happened, and one smuck happened to be from the same town as me, and his family made a life size dummy of him in uniform, with medals, some of which he couldn't possibly of earned, as they were from later battles..... Unless he was a zombie.

Nazis have really no modern unit to look to, nor a need to specifically affiliate.... cause it is all gone. It isn't a Esprite de Corps, as there is no corps, merely a concept. That concept is as divorced from historic reality as anyone needs it to be.

Remember how I said it doesn't record bad events or countercultures? Why? It serves the training needs, or that if Elan, of modern units. Nazis today are the opposite, they are a counter culture, usually with no specific place. Some have compounds, for Zoots it was hilarious, he placed his in space.


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Why? It was Utopic, a Salve, but he needed the telelogy, a purpose to give meaning to his terrible life choices.... but it also had to exist in a specific space and time to be reasonable to him on a pragmatic level. He created his own myth, one that would justify himself while acknowledging in a unconscious way how fucked he was. He hoped space nazis would fix it all, other times it was socialist liberals fixing everything for him.

For the esoteric nazis, like Sauwelios, who quotes them, they have a concrete place, they restarted their cycle at their new compounds, are trying to create new ideologues, new personalities. It is the beginnings of creating a viable history others in the future can look back on and point to and continue. That was the entire concept behind Jack London's "The Iron Heel", the story told of a futuristic Marxist uprising, that ultimately was crushed.... but as your reading the story, you see notes on the side, and realize these are notes from 700 years after that rebellion, and the Marxist lost, they are identifying with the story, it is a recovered historic text, documenting the struggles of a unsuccessful proletariat rebellion that while being a miserable failure, was utterly crushed, did eventually lay the seeds for a much later success.

This neither proves nor disproves the Marxists were right or wrong, or the Nazis or anyone else following these patterns. It is the side effect of the Philosophy of History, how we have learned to write unit and national histories. This started very early, looking back in particular:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucius_ ... Piso_Frugi

He wrote it on the national level. Prior to this, Romans wrote of great deeds of Roman heros, but not national defended of propaganda. This can be compartmentalized large and small.

When you completely smash and take away a history to a extinguished people, and that is what the Nazis very much are, defeated bona fide Nietzscheans, people who wish to associate with them can do so be paraphenalia, dressing like them, or adopting mere aspects of ideas or customs.

How well would some Indian do in the Reich? Very poorly. The Nazis we're killing off German Jews who were 99.99999% German, white Slavs, Gypsies who's largely turned Caucasian from countless generations living west..... No brown person would of made it long under Hitler's silly Nordic Ideals..... because you know, they've done so very much for civilizations progress! They hardly did shit, other than topple the western Roman Empire after allying with the Huns (anything would of knocked Rome out after that), and being one of many warrior groups expanding during the middle ages, neither the best nor fiercest, or even the most successful. They are a lame duck people, neither impressive nor embarrassing, but in Hitler's crazy ass head, they became the master race. Hitler also believed they invaded Greece, and therefore Greek Art was Nordic Art, and they invaded India, so therefore India was also Nordic, which is a absurdity instantly dismissed by noting the very vast dissimularities between Sami people living in Finland and Tamil culturally and racially.... but in many modern nazus eyes, Aryan is Aryan. Never mind England subjugated India, and Hitler loved the English as a fellow Master Race people for doing this.

Why?

Take you pick.

Literally, it is a take your pick situation, every silly fucking neonazis group will take their pick. Their intellectuals will read Hitler, then Nietzsche, then random Nazis writers, then post war Neo Nazis..... and they will peace it together, so they will take Sauwelios hairbrained understanding of the Varna System (you could change your caste in the real system, and inheritance wasn't assured, a son of a brahmin wasn't necessarily a brahmin, had to prove himself worthy) and this will lead to Zoots imagining Governor Zinnati, leader of the Aryans People of the Confederacy of the great colonies of Jupiter, under the Nazi Flag, Veiling the long dead ghost of hitler, cause only white people have the spiritual nature of..... doing whatever the crazy fucking shit he is idealizing.

It is all fucking bullshit in the end.

I can say a few things about the real Nazis

1) They wouldnt of liked most of the misfits calling themselves Neo-Nazis today.
2) The Nazis were far worst than we give them credit for, and I don't think we understand yet the full extent if what they did. We simply forgotten much of it, in many cases even the outlines are list, something for future archaeologists to uncover.
3) They werealso far better and more human than we give them credit for, and likely more diversified in their views. We don't get to think about Nazis Plumbers or Nazis Bakers or Nazis Florists, Hairstylists, waiting in the deli line, helping a old woman across the street, sitting in the bath enjoying the moonlight, looking out the window at the rain, saving a comrade in battle, or a civilian, or doing good deeds. They too were human, our historycraft largely ignores these issues, not merely because the Allies are prejudiced, or that the victors write the history books, but because of far older trends we've inherited in writing history. We only desire to read certain kinds of histories, and those histories have to make emotive sense to us in modern contexts...... as much as we preserve these traditions, we constantly enforce our psychological limitations on the craft of history. They outcome is systematic and contrived, but says a lot about human psychology. It would be a mistake to think this lawyer us completely nuts.... admittedly, a brown person in a Nazis Uniform shooting people down, while holding the same degree Carleas has is wacky, but in a sense, we all rationalize the world along similar cognitive give and takes. Pandora the Feminist is hardly immune to this, I've seen you trek out into some questionable territory yourself, many have here, we do it without grasping how looney we are.

One of my reasons for disliking liberals- that psychological drive to react to bad circumstance by adopting new radical positions and ideology.

The ability to build myths generally isn't associated with such phenomena, that is oftentimes slower, incremental, borrowing themes. What thus Indian was doing wasn't a metaphysics, but a excuse to behave abhorently, serial killers kill every day somewhere without having to borrow themes, they are quite content to be their own disturbed selves. This lawyer was a intellectual, he was clearly attracted to the culture the Nro-Nazis had. Hiw well was he accepted into it? Likely not at all, but he made himself fit in the narrative. I'm sure at New Bern, they are putting a image of a brown man up on the wall now and clapping, that's how ahistoric our world generally is. I'm usually in too much shock from too much study of the past, seeing some of the statements around here, that I increasingly don't bother. I started building the foundations of a new school of Philosophy of History dedicated to thus task on my new website, been working on it a lot, will release the link in late winter, early spring. It really us becoming a really bad problem on the bet, Prismatic is only the latest of many to pull bad history stunts on this site and others, it is becoming like a plague of locust.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby The Golden Turd » Sat Oct 01, 2016 8:41 am

There is not ever an excuse for accusing someone of upholding an ideology that he doesn't. Value - law predicates mortal hatred on such things. It is this the ideologue is after - perhaps.


False, you make similar mistakes about linguistics as I've seen Faust make.

Language doesn't make identity, and neither is behaviorism. And idea, when we say "we are doing so and so" isn't listed to self stylized descriptions, but the verbs others observe.

The doer is only one consciousness in the crowd, if everyone is agast while the one doer is at peace, it means either the doer has a far, far better understanding of what is going on that anyone else, is a true mastermind if the situation.... or he is a delusional fuckup who doesn't quite grasp just what has gone wrong.

A judge or lawyer dies not have to rely on the defendants definition of rape to find then guilty, and his ability to refute culpability, or feel shane, guilt, or remorse doesn't make him any less of a rapist. His ability to forget the events that occurred, convince himself of his lies, proclaim himself a Superman doesn't change it either.

We are human, we are capable of inductive and deductive reasoning, knowledge is social in ways that it isn't internal, who we are likewise divides on that basis. A horrible fucking shithead desiring only positive propaganda while doing foul deeds doesn't have a moral right to hide away in the unstable syllogisms that moral relativity is constructed from, they don't have the right to construct their own world within a shared language, and preach it, without counter or criticism. If parallels are found and asserted, it it can be shown your behavior more closely resembles these other systems, that you have a history of lying, that your a closeted adherent of another system, and ate abusing others unsuspecting trust, than it is fully right to call it out, actually is a duty in philosophy to unmask such deceitful frauds. You can't just say like Anakin Skywalker right before he burnt up in the volcano like a idiot "From my perspective the Jedi are the badguys".... the human modes of reasoning are so much broader than that, and our capacity to detect shit should be widespread, mutually supporting and integrated too. We shouldn't let dainty frauds dance all over the truth, especially dainty little self appointed Neo-Nazis Godmen demanding respect where non is deserved, claiming superiority without merit. The The perspective of a worthless Nietzschean doesn't matter, in the Stoic concept of the term, but a man who stives to uncover and speak in defence of the truth, as a halbringer of what actually is, is worthy.

I've seen far too many deciets played on thus forum by the Nietzscheans. It isn't enough to say it us your perspective and so in a way your right, or to claim legitimacy because more fools back you. That is all quickly washed away in a torrent of disillusionment. The truth needs to stand on better merits.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:17 pm

Pandora wrote:Usually, the criteria has been a nation's achievements in science, medicine, architecture, literature, etc. I'm talking about actual tangible world-scale accomplishments - results.


So when European Americans went to the moon, or built all the infrastructure in the last century then that would be something that the average American could feel proud of. But the average Japanese would have no reason to feel proud about it.
Although it was arguably the rivalry of other nations, of other groups, other people which pushed them.

Now, in a globalist mindset with muh humanity preaching, suddenly everybody gets to feel proud of the accomplishments of muh hymanity, no matter what they actually enabled or hindered.

Civic nationalism is not that dissimilar from globalism. It inevitably leads to the latter because if it’s all about ideas and laws and everybody is an exchangeable cog then why really have borders in the long run?

The actual crucial element about nationalism is the body thus ethno-nationalism it is.
The Puerto Rican either likes himself and wants to preserve himself and his potential or he wants it to be washed away and be appeased by some feel good ideas and consumerism.

Ideas and books mean nothing when the quality of people who were able to read and understand them have disappeared. Either the biology is preserved or it’s all gone in the long run, whatever it is.


nobody's fool to believe that help is done for help's sake alone.


Sure but just because I expect something in return doesn’t mean that I get that in return. And what if what I get in return is just a fuzzy feeling? Giving it away for a good feeling is not something new and not something only found among a do-goody-mc-good kind of people.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Sat Oct 01, 2016 12:22 pm

looking for new converts (no, not me) wrote:Who is this "we"?

What are you , Jesus?
Do you assume all humans have the same values?


Relax, Jewsus.
Jesus was half goyim, half Jew.
You are similar but less goyim than him.

I can tell by your obsession with Jesus, the cross (feel free to tell me why that is such a big thing with Jews, I’m curious) and shit, actual shit.

And to answer your attention seeking question, No, I don’t assume all people have the same values. At the same time, this doesn’t mean that values are arbitrary or that values or the act of valuing is valuable in itself. That’s a sign of trying to forget reality.


Of your values.


Yes, my values. You do not have to adopt my values, in fact, I would have to check my values and priorities if you were to do so. Just to make sure it’s not me who….
You know what I mean.

I see why an apostle of value ontology wouldn’t have an issue with turning into dust.
Not essentially. Because the dust would still value itself.
So why not.


Her values command it. She's powerful enough to attain her values, apparently. (no idea who you are referring to but it must be someone that had influence on you by executing her will as she saw fit)


I am referring to your mommy.
Jewsus’ Cross, take your time and tell me about her.

Quit being so banal. Yes, yes, all values the same, blabla.
I don’t care about what you come up with to feel good about yourself.
Or how to appeal to others who need something, anything, to feel good about themselves.


Probably itll work out by some one having food that wouldnt have had.

It doesnt seem very complicated I must say. Sometimes people think too much into things.


You really shouldn’t care about what I wrote, nor think about it.
Sometimes people think too much into things.

But to be frankish, I really do hope you find new apostles on ILP. Convert all of them if you can.
I'm curious how this narcissistic-supply pyramid scheme is going to work out.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pandora » Sat Oct 01, 2016 9:41 pm

Is_Yde_opN wrote:
Pandora wrote:Usually, the criteria has been a nation's achievements in science, medicine, architecture, literature, etc. I'm talking about actual tangible world-scale accomplishments - results.
So when European Americans went to the moon, or built all the infrastructure in the last century then that would be something that the average American could feel proud of. But the average Japanese would have no reason to feel proud about it.
As I recall, it was the Little Boy and the Fat Man that effectively put an end to Japanese pride.
The actual crucial element about nationalism is the body thus ethno-nationalism it is.
The Puerto Rican either likes himself and wants to preserve himself and his potential or he wants it to be washed away and be appeased by some feel good ideas and consumerism.
Puerto Rican is a mixed-race identity to begin with and it seems to be combining the two ideas quite well, so what are they preserving? Their own biological/ethnical mixture and the feel-good philosophy?
Ideas and books mean nothing when the quality of people who were able to read and understand them have disappeared. Either the biology is preserved or it’s all gone in the long run, whatever it is.
Unfortunately, biology is not enough. I have noticed that many purebreds are unable to catch up and adapt to the changing word, and so fall behind the times. These are the traditionalists who want to live like they've always have but are stuck behind advancing times, and so are quickly used and gobbled up. I would also like to point out that many empires, like Persian and Ottoman Empire, were essentially of mixed race, from servants/soldiers, even to royalty itself.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dev%C5%9Firme
Why did Christians (Europeans), overseen and united by the Vatican, lose their battles against the Ottomans? Because of greed, betrayal and bickering among themselves. They could not efficiently unite against a common enemy because everyone was too busy thinking about himself - just as it is now. So what has changed?
Intrinsically, nothing has changed. Everyone is still thinking about their own self-interests. Now, consider that it was centuries back that Europeans had a problem uniting together. There was no globalist anti-white propaganda back then that one could blame it on - only people themselves. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottoman_wars_in_Europe
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Is_Yde_opN » Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:29 am

Pandora wrote:As I recall, it was the Little Boy and the Fat Man that effectively put an end to Japanese pride.


It did?
The Japanese have been for a long time and still are one of the most Ethno-conscious people among the industrialised states.
The atomic bombs did nothing compared to the muh-freedom, muh-equality philosophy which became particularly toxic after the 1960s in the USA.


Puerto Rican is a mixed-race identity to begin with and it seems to be combining the two ideas quite well, so what are they preserving? Their own biological/ethnical mixture and the feel-good philosophy?


So? They can’t preserve their mixed-race state of affairs?
Europeans can’t choose to remain ethnically Europeans because everybody came from of Africa?
(Hy)-Man can’t choose to preserve who he is because he was not always man, but came from a lineage of primates?

Next you gonna tell me preservation doesn’t work because things always change anyway?
It’s not sensible to let go of what we have just for the sake of new possibility, especially if it’s not with a high probability of working out better. That’s in itself not a viable strategy in reality.

Now, what could work out well is exploiting the current social fabric. Like the brat who squanders the resources of his family on a whim and who, if it doesn’t work out, will plead for a safety net because ‘shit happens’. Or the one who exploits society as a whole with that mindset. That’s a net cost on society overall but a free trial run for the brat.
That way I can be all open to possibilities and whimsical dreams.

Any society who wants to preserve itself, as in survive, will have to put the responsibility, the costs, for failure on those who failed in some way or form.


As for your Ottoman's - I can't cooperate with somebody for a shared goal?
You mean like the victim groups in globalist America who choose not to cooperate with each other, I mean, with their 'oppressors' who they demand gibsmedat from.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pezerocles » Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:50 am

The world just needs to remember to be cool.

Why?

Because life is precious.

And also, only bad people ever need panic. If you want, the definition of bad people can be: "people who, in seeking knowledge or power, do not measure first themselves."

This doesn't mean that nazi shit will be tolerated. This, never.

But maybe, just maybe, to keep stepping on the wretched is not the best way to deal. That's why Fixed Cross is taking a distance: he likes stepping on things but appreciates life much more than he likes that. So he asked me, cause I can talk to wretched souls. Satan is all about them.

They just have to renounce their fucking cowardice.
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby MagsJ » Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:55 am

All are free to post here.. as long as they comply with ILP posting protocol, so no turf wars please.
The possibility of anything we can imagine existing is endless and infinite

I haven't got the time to spend the time reading something that is telling me nothing, as I will never be able to get that time back, and I may need it for something at some point in time. Wait! What?

--MagsJ
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Re: Esoteric Nazism (Nationalism)

Postby Pezerocles » Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:14 am

Well, you know, nazi turf encroaches on us all. That's all I'm trying to say.

After all, I'm just a gangster having fun.
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