Ok let’s assume that there is a god. Why did he give us free will? Was it only so that he could judge us? What other possibilities can there be to as why he gave us free will?
Showing us how to not sin and showing us how not to want what is hurtful, would be better then judging us.
Freewill is the ability to choose one vs the other, and it is also the source of “general relativity”.
God wanting to judge us for little things like swearing–vs the “Fact” that he made the entire universe, doesn’t that seem not to fit together?
If I was all-wise, and that powerful, would I be so petty as to test and tourture what I already created [and I programmed it to now want to be tourtured]?
God is a bullshit monotheistic quick-fix stamp that stemmed from Monarch and patriarch thoughts and cultures.
Ideas of one supriem being ruling everything:
- Failed in earthly government.
- Failed in reality.
Alrite before i put foward my theory which im pretty sure has a flaw in it because i haven’t had a chance to get the other side of it. If there is a god does he know EVERYTHING? (Lets assume there is a god for this one to)
Here’s my take on it:
If this god hadn’t given man a free will, then the people who go to hell would’ve been fated to go there, and so god would be malevolent. Free will has to be added to the mix in order to “get god off” this charge.
(It should be abundantly clear to anyone who looks at it objectively that the heaven/hell “partitioning criterion” (faith) we see in the abrahamic religions is stupid and ridiculous.)
God is not looking for robots? … and, something more in the manner that He can interact with? What sense of appreciation would there be, if there was no choice in the matter?
God did not give us free will. We have always had the ability to choose. Thats why I choose not to believe in God.
Who says we got free will at all.
I have to agree with Iacchus- He wanted being with free will simply because there would be greater depth and enjoyment from interacting with us. The moral rights and wrongs that result from creatures honestly choosing to behave a certain way seem to have greater depth and meaning.
I concur. If He did not give us free will, than he will never know that the people who reside with him in heaven are good people. Why would He want to make us as drones? This makes things insignificant and boring.
In order for god to create free will, he has to create something outside his control or something independent of himself. How is this logically possible ? Either there are spiritual-metaphyiscal elements of the universe that god can’t control (hence other gods) or he is fooling himself kind of like: I drink a coke then make believe I forget and say to myself I am still on a diet.
Then an all powerful god has problems of BOREDOM ? He can’t invent a universe that is much more interesting then judging people for their crappy choices, most of which are made out of confusion and despair ? How on earth can a god have fun with SUCH A STUPID GAME ? Come on, any of us can imagine and enjoy much better things, hell even good music is more satisfying, imagine what a god, creator of the laws of physics could do.
And why shouldn’t God be the embodiment of free will itself and everything be a manifestation of that? Or, do you have a hard time believing God should have a choice in the matter?
Will there be free will in Heaven, or will we be drones? Didn’t free will corrupt Paradise on Earth and cause most of the suffering down here?
If it’s free-will which is responsible for human suffering and not God, as many Christians claim, then I cant see how it could exist in Heaven, so I guess we will be robots. Unless God can somehow create a state where there is free will and no suffering. But if he can, then why didn’t he create that state on earth? Why make us suffer unnecessarily?
Nice way of looking at it.
Presumably in this “Heaven” place god will keep such a tight grip on things that no-one will be able to do an evil deeds, even if they wanted to.
So…we will have free will but we wont be able to act on it? Unless God agrees with it. Some freewill.
But if God can give us free will yet stop us doing evil deeds why doesn’t he do it here then?
What kind of god would that be, if he couldn’t choose ? He invented the choices and the very structure of all reality. Otherwise he is not the whole story and there are other items of reality independent of him. But then the typical response is that he is mysterious. Ok, so how can I know how he thinks ? What if he decides to send all good people to hell and all the evil to heaven ? How can I know ? But you must trust, but if he doesn’t follow logic how can I know and be sure ? Then why does it seem that logic can be used for some parts of religion but not others ? where is the line that divides ? Why do suicide bombers use logic different from jews ? whose religion is right ?
directly from God :
34766 LUKE 7 : I TELL YOU THE TRUTH, RELIGION IS ALL LIES.
Restrain us from doing evil? Perhaps. But only because this is what we desire. I do understand that one can’t escape one’s ruling love when they pass on.
If you look at how life evolved on earth, it’s all relative in its relationship with the sun. So, why shouldn’t man’s relationship with God be similar?
Cultural relativism affirms that all truths are equal. If it says that this is an absolute truth it falls into a contradiction, but if it affirms that all truths SEEM equivalent and the truth is UNKNOWN, then relativism is a perfect position.
If the debate is about relative truth and absolute truth then it boils down to what kind of relativism you are talking about. If a person says “the truth is that all positions are equal”, then he is affirming a strong relativistic position and is actually affirming another “absolute truth”. A weaker relativistic position is:
“all positions seen from the outside SEEM equivalent, I am not sure which position is the truth, or even if a truth exists, but as far as I know and can tell, they all seem the same. I DON’T KNOW”.
Now this position is not contradictory because the person does not know, is unsure. It is different from the moral problems, in this case anyone accepts a set of moral values that seem good enough and you live by those.
Lets put it in practice and say there is a muslim and a christian. The muslim will say that christianity is a false religion and the christian will say the same about Islam. Now seen from the outside they both seem to be 100% sure of themselves. Now I doubt that 100 % security exists, but they are sure of themselves. Now if I don’t know, all I can say is that each one declares to have had a supernatural revelation, so from the outside they seem equivalent. Who is right ? I can’t tell, the most I can say is that if one day I have a supernatural revelation that will convince me of one position or the other, then I too will affirm which one is true. I could also have a supernatural revelation that we are all living inside a computer simulation of an alien race. Then that would become the truth. Truth is not necessarily absolute truth, but just what seems to be true even after a supernatural revelation. I don’t think absolute truth is of this universe, we can always doubt everything, even that we are alive and thinking correctly.
Does the sun (that which is constant) shine fiercly in the desert? Or, does it behave any differently than what is “normal” for it to behave? In other words both good and bad can come about in such a manner.