This is funny. I think I have created the atheist’s ontological argument. Or at least I’ve found it, I don’t know whether somebody else has thought it up or not. Here goes,
Even believers can agree that God is perfect, but if God is perfect, then wouldn’t he be perfectly efficient?
Yes God is efficient. Everything occuring in the universe is lawful and by necessity.
A being’s efficiency is tied to his aims, I should think.
If god is efficient, then he does everything in the most efficient way, yes? Then, wouldn’t he create the universe exactly the way he wants it (whichever way that is) in the beginning by arranging the atoms so that they line up right? Wouldn’t he create a pre-determined universe?
Then it would be boring for Him…
Just imagine… no surprises… everithing is pre-determined, pre-arranged…
boring…
But He created us, who have freedom of choice. We have choice do we love Him back or not.
This world is for living for those, who want to enjoy without Him…
and this world is for leaving for those, who want in full love give enjoyment to Him.
From the perspective of supporting life, the universe is extremely inefficient. To have a highly efficient universe, all matter/energy would have to be devoted to maintenance of sentience. Instead, only a very tiny fraction of the matter/energy is devoted to maintenance of sentience. Astonomical amounts of energy simply radiate into deep space.
There is nothing wrong with astronomical amounts of energy being radiated into deep space, because God is unlimited in resources. However, a common antitheistic argument concerns much waste in the processes of life on earth. Some imagine that these processes could have been done more efficiently and with much less violence and suffering. A statement that life processes could have been designed with much less violence and suffering involved implies that the laws of nature would permit something much better, but, by misfortune of chance, the better did not happen. The fact that the laws of nature provide for something much better demonstrates that violence and suffering are not a result of God’s inability to do any better, but they are a result of a corruption of creation.
Unless one of the things he wanted was to be surprised, from time to time. 
NO! NO! NO! God is NOT efficient. Why did it take him SIX days to create the earth when he is supposed to be all powerful. Then because he was so knackered he took the day off to recuperate. I mean is this efficiency???..I think not.
Yes. “Efficient” and “perfect” are both forms of subjective opinion about conditions which may vary from A to B.
What is “perfect” for one being will often be “imperfect” for another.
Depends which “God” you’re talkin’ about.
It only stands to reason that the bible “God” is not as fantastic as he is cracked up to be. So, if there was a being some dudes mannaged to contact, who’s falt is it that claims about all-mighty-perfection were made?
If some person got charged with higher energy, then he’d be so loaded that he may just flip out & make huge, exagorated claims.
Nothing is “perfect” universally.
[Bible]“God” may be perfect for himself, but “he” is obviously not “perfect” for you. What would suite you best would be your version of “his” “perfection”.
“Perfection” and “efficiency” are relativistic.
I think that the huge, huge creationist claims are just arrogance, but there are obviously many non-physical beings doing many things in the universes.
Read Daniel San… R.E.A.D.
This topic is a paradox unto itself. Your perceptions apart from Gods are incomplete!
Who here has the Knowledge of God so that they may weigh God in the scales and know His worth?
Who here has the Understanding to perceive the smallest of particles and energy and thus strike a mighty blow against the fabric of Creation?
None of you!
If you think your smart enough to gauge the Omnipotence and Omniscience of an Almighty God then you have already begun with a sore foot!
I suppose you work 24/7 and that’s what you mean by efficiency, but I can’t see anything up to earth creation so far from your side. Or, perhaps, I’m just not that well-informed, huh?
There are so many fundamental, stupidities, with the notion of god that to see it as a rational explanation of real events is moronic. The use of religion is social!
The bible is a rulebook for life, but though its suggestions may be beneficial, its writers make no attempt to find out why.
Interesting… you didn’t create that argument though, David Hume made a similar contention. Just thought I’d give an empiricist bro some recognition.
Efficiency is determined by the purpose of Creation as a whole and how divine plan provides for it. From this perspective I believe God is extremely efficient
Thanks, theonefroberg. You’re cool.
Nick_A
No matter what you contend god’s purpose to be, he could have done it in one step if he is truly omnieverything.
Unless he is homerian, and has a personality and wants to be surprised and all that. Which is bull.
tz18
This is not the place to go into it, but it may not be as simple as you suggest. All I am saying is that you cannot define efficiency without understanding the goal.
But God's having a personality and specific, non-general aims is exactly what the very great bulk of theistic believers would contend. Who's concept of God are you trying to argue with here? I've never thought the deistic approach was very defendable, and this is one of the reasons why.
Why thank you. You’re not so un-cool yourself.
How do you propose we do this?
Oh, and here’s another Spinoza argument that kind of messes with your system, Nick. I’ve already argued on another thread (along the same lines as Spinoza did) that “purposes” or final causes are equivalent with wanting something. So the final cause of the universe would be what God “wants” for the universe.
To want something means to lack something. Thus, for God to want something to mean that God is missing something in the first place. But God must be perfect, so God can’t be lacking anything. Hence, God can’t be wanting anything for the universe, and there is no final purpose to the universe.