The "real" truths Dan Brown uncovered?

Whether one allows for the chance that there may be among us descendents of Christ or not, I’d like to know why the Christian Church is so offended by such a theory. Wouldn’t such great-great-etc grandchildren of God be just the sort of loving and insightful and compassionate individuals this world obviously needs right now? And wouldn’t such a logical, grounded, biological “Second Coming” make it easier for even Darwinians and the most logic and scientifically based thinkers to accept and come to know God?

What is it about this concept that threatens the church so? Could it be that such people among us would carry more influence and command more respect than a manmade institution and this is why the possibility of their existence can’t be tolerated?

Thoughts anyone?

The primary reason is because it smacks in the face of our Religion. Jesus’ bride has always been and will be the Church! There is no female counter part for Christ as we men on earth enjoy! Everyone just cant ever seem to get around the Fact that Christ was much more than just a mundane man! He felt temptation of the Flesh but why in the snot dog does everyone seem to think He failed at every one of them? Jesus turned the scumbag Satan down just to hit it lucky with one woman? Come on you guys? Jesus could have had several women had He taken satan boys offer!

The logic of tossing it all away for just one is ludicrous! And not to mention… Either Christ was a man or He was the Son of God! If He was only a man… then the virgin birth and everything the Christian faith is hinged upon is a lie. If He is the Son of God He would have felt the presence of God looking over Him and would have been very mindful that Displeasing the Father in such a pittiful act of weakness that He would have completely negated His worthiness to Judge Us!

That and so many other things is why the Christians are getting angry over what may be indeed blaspheeming of the Lord!

Astral,

Why would Jesus taking a wife be a ‘failure’ as you put it?

A

I find it funny (wierd funny, not funny ‘haha’); how all of this seems to have happened.

When i first started posting in forums, some were all ‘jesus this and that’, and other guys are all ‘no proof of jesus yadda yadda.’ I don’t need a physical notion of Jesus; i came to spirituality through, among other things, the Gospel of Thomas; and there’s every possibility that what Thomas is describing is a single meditative event, a single exercise of midrash (if that’s how it goes.) It’s the Holy Spirit that’s at issue, and that just falls out of consciousness. Glomming onto the Holy Spirit, loving it up and down, however it appears to you, is opening the door to Christ/Krishna; you can’t loose. Now, not only was there a jesus but, he’s had heirs no less, some of whom are alive today no less.

This is where you take all of the secret groups there are and ever were, and put them in a pile and say, ‘sorry guys, i firmly believe that most people are good people, but you’ve taken an oath that makes a meaningful relationship impossible.’

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But if its not " funny ha ha " , and your not laughing , then your just finding it weird , so there would be no need to say you find it funny , just you find it weird . That would be like me saying I found it funny that you said that , even though I sat with a straight face looking at the screen when I read it , if there is no fun involved , its not funny . Not that Im having a go , I just find it funny { not funnny weird } , that people express themselves that way

Anyway , Dan Brown , bit strange is he not , those jumpers he wears are odd

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Astral, I believe Jesus may have had several wives but not as we understand the relationship. Between secular influences and the natural degeneration of Christianity into Christendom, it is no wonder why the idea seems so ludicrous.

Marriage, as I understand it, in the Christian sense, is the unity of opposites. This unity in relation to the earth can produce a child or a mutual help where these opposites through the blending of their energies, help each other to grow in their understanding of human purpose in relation to the Creator.

Consider the Gospel of Thomas:

This is taking a wife. Jesus will be blending energies with Mary so allowing her to unify her being complete as male so as to again sacrifice its self importance for the sake of the growing soul which is again female in relation to the Father. This is why you will read the mystics refer to the soul as “she”. It is passive (female) in relation to the Father (active - male).

The blending of essences and the sex energies or “marriage” at this level is not for the purpose of producing children but creating a beginning soul which Jesus could do for Mary. It has no secular societal meaning.

:smiley:
If you said you just found it weird, i’d’ve taken offence. :smiley:

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I dont believe there is any mystery , Jesus was celibate for the same reason Buddha was . It was his destiny you could say , as it was Buddhas , to sacrifice himself , only the christs sacrafice was greater seeing that he gave up his life .

You might think that Jesus was married because he would not have been taken seriously by the Jewish/Gentile community otherwise , since a single man in those days would have been commiting a sin in some ways .

He sought to reform Judaism , and being a celibate was one way to show the elders that he would not be ruled by them .

" He was oppressed, yet when he was afflicted he didn’t open his mouth. As a lamb that is led to the slaughter, and as a sheep that before its shearers is mute , so he didn’t open his mouth "

Isaiah 53:7

Psalms 22:18 -

" They divide My garments among them, And for My clothing they cast lots "

There was another good reason for Jesus not to have married of course . To fullfill prophecy .

Assuming he was as powerful as some say he is then he must have been able to tell the future to a fair extent . We are informed that he was aware of his crucifixion well before it happened , therefore he would have known that marriage was pointless , since he would only live until 32 . If you assume he was all that the bible says he was , then it is logical to assume he was celibate .

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Dan Brown has so many lies it’s pitiful.

Remember the “vote on Christs divinity at the council of Nicea”? Supossedly the vote was in favor of divinity, and a close one at that.

First, the vote was brought up becuase a heretic in the church doubted his divinity.

Second, out of 400 some voters, 2 voted against Christ’s divinity.

Sakyamuni Buddha Gautama was infact married to a princess Yasodhara and they had a son Rahula. Sakyamuni was born a prince of the Sakya clan hence his name Sakyamuni (Sage of the Sakyas). It was only after he was married and had a son that he went in search of enlightenment. He was a man who enlightened himself. The word Buddha means ‘awakened one’. We are all sleeping buddhas. That was his message. It was only after Buddha’s enlightenment (awakening) that he returned home to his father and to his wife and son whom he initiated as his disciples.

I don’t know if Jesus was married, but that is really besides the point. There is no reason that Jesus would need to be celibate in order to continue his mission. The only thing that I would say is that if indeed Jesus was married, he would have married someone who was also deeply spiritual as a reflection. It is perfectly healthy and normal to marry and have children and at the same time devote oneself to God.

As for making a woman male Nick, that would be speaking spiritually in terms of yin and yang. The body is yin (femine, earth) whereas the spiritual nature is yang (masculine, heaven). We all need to return to our yang nature in order to attain. Yet, men and woman here on earth have our roles to play in society. We don’t deviate from that in a sense harmonising with Mother nature and with God.

A

Ludicruous? That word has a ring to it that reminds me of another word:
Incubus.

Well, IMO, who ever started with the conception “failed” at celibacy.

So either an angel or a demon or some other being sexed Mary, or it was a human that did it, then JC was born[?]

Or was Hitler right?
Would it be more logical to guess that Jesus was half-Jew, half-Roman? Not half-human, half-God? If I had to bet money, I’d have to put my money on Hitler’s idea… JC was probably half-roman-soldier. Galalie had high roman occupation at that time, didn’t it?
Shoot, I can’t source the quote…

The taking of a wife as we do is a fleshy thing and for producing children! God had no such Mandate for Christ! And because God had no such mandate then it is unreasonable to expect Christ to do otherwise! Especially when it was never written about or mentioned in the Bible.

There is nothing I can see wrong morally with Christ taking a Wife in proper marriage as God defined it, but it would not have served God’s purpose for Christ! And we already know the trouble that would have caused on the back end! The descendants of Christ would become tyrants with their supposed authority! And that we do NOT need!

I will strike down your entire post with Christ’s comments!

Matthew 7
13 Enter ye in at the strait gate: for wide is the gate, and broad is the way, that leadeth to destruction, and many there be which go in thereat:

14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it.

That tells you right there that most people are evil. And that mankind is evil. There are also references in the bible that state you are a child of the devil until you come to God!

If you firmly believe that most people are good people when Christ said there is only ONE GOOD and that is GOD, then I would further wager you do not have the wisdom to have the rest of your post counted for profit!

If you show a flaw in any of your reasoning, is there not reason to doubt the rest?

I would like to know which book that passage comes from. There seems to be some of that funny stuff that what the last part of the Bible warns about!

Hi Astral

That quote was from the Gospel of Thomas:

gnosis.org/naghamm/gthlamb.html

Now you may doubt the GoT which is your choice. As one with an interest in esoteric Christianity, I see some of the ideas being presented as very old, deep, and containing a very profound psychology that I believe to be the essence of Christianity pertaining to re-birth.

If it were a fraud, it would be more wonderful and filled with all sorts of secular or political BS. It can only be understood from the perspective of re-birth which is why so many "experts’ cannot understand it. They read it from the wrong perspective.

I agree that we must be careful of charlatans and false prophets but it is our obligation as human beings to learn to discriminate and not hide under the bed. The Bible can just contain so much. We also have an obligation as well to grow into understanding the teaching rather than have it serve as a religious computer telling us right from wrong. It must begin to live in us so that we can understand it. As your quote from Mathew suggests, the gate is narrow and people will not find it but we have to worry first if we can find it.

Let me ask you something in relation to that post where you said:

How do you define evil? Wretched I can understand but “evil” seems exaggerated.

Paul describes himself quite well as the wretched man. When Jesus was on the cross he said to “Forgive them for they know not what they do.” He didn’t say let those evil bastards rot in hell.

Just because people are lost and turning in circles suggested in all the great traditions doesn’t make them evil. It just means that they cannot find themselves to begin the journey back to their origin. This is more worthy of compassion then name calling.

So I’m curious as to what makes you use the word “evil” in describing the human condition.

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I expect those interested would have known this , so I never mentioned it

I think its more reasonable that people remember Jesus as celibate . And remember also that there are , were prophecies Jesus had to fullfill . There was no place for a wife in the life of the Christ . Thats all there was to it

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Whaaa???!? I appreciate your feedback Astral but; please look at the quote and see that most are lost, not evil. Some things are evil, some people do evil things; the enemy is the evil, not the people.

But how you come to God is place specific. The universal lesson is that you cannot lord it over, you must be quiet to hear the truth, the strait way. I’ve recently read one third of an anthology on Hida myth; the story teller would end his story with a statement along the lines of ‘my backbone is strait.’

What do they mean by ‘strait?’ Might it refer to a shekhinah flow? An eddyless, egoless flow of some unknown fluid that drives the conscious aspect of being?

When i say good people, i mean well intentioned in their own context. I do agree that these people must actually do good to be saved; and that most well intentioned people end up doing nothing or doing bad.

Sure, sure. The way you turn lost into evil is an issue in that regard.

Many people are prone to traps of Satan. It is easy to stray from the path to salvation.

Lets leave it at that.

I just think its funny to see Christians, not even Catholics, get all riled up about a movie and book that weren’t even that good anyway.

Unless the churches are fighting for the sheeple… no thinking person’s opinion was swayed by the DaVinci code, it was utter tripe.

cheers,
gemty

You had mentioned that Jesus had been celibate for the same reasons that Buddha was. I was simply clarifying that Buddha had in fact been married, so by your own logic, Jesus might also have been married.

A