Why does God appear no different from a non-existent God?

[V-OutOfTheWilderness]

Why is how the world came into existence so important with respect to a present day belief in a God?

That's a damn good question. Also, why is it so important to some that the earth is only 6 thousand yrs old?

I suppose the answer to both questions is that it's in the Bible. And people go crazy on the Bible. Even Isaac Newton went crazy on the Bible.

That's because they consider the Bible The Word of God. They have no real footing for believing that. There's no actual evidence that the Bible is the word of God. They just believe it out of thin air.

And that's why they go Bible crazy, and the creation is so important. And why we have "The Creation Museum" here in Kentucky. Where they have exhibits of people riding dinosaurs ... like in the Fred Flintstone cartoon. They take the Fred Flintstone cartoon literally ... like they do the Bible also. They've gone Bible crazy. Like the Flat Earth Society ...

[Selah7+]

That makes no sense. You say God did not create the world and us, but we came to be by accident. First the Big Bang, then the slime out of sea, then into crawling things, then apes, then men. That makes sense to you? That's hilarious! Where did all of this matter come from? You see the mind of men? We need to reason within ourselves by our own understanding of things that exist and are clearly seen, but leave God out of the equation. Trust that there is someone greater than you, and only by His grace and mercy do you exist and are loved.

It appears that I've lost track of this conversation. Who said :

"God did not create the world and us, but we came to be by accident. First the Big Bang, then the slime out of sea, then into crawling things, then apes, then men."?

There's lots of creation accounts. I have a book of 25 of them. Humans can't resist trying to explain how everything including us came into being. But none of us today were there. So we're forced to imagine it. And some come up with more catching stories, than others. And the Big Bang story is one of them.

And then we have the Big Bible story. Big Bible? Big Bang? What's the difference? They're both stories. At least the Big Bang is based upon physical evidence (the expanding universe) ... while Big Bible seems to be a children's story ... a fairytale style story.

But no creation account makes sense .... don't expect them to.

Mutcer brought up the evolution statement, so I was responding to what we were taught in school as young children. The Big Bang is based on evidence? I see.

[BUFFALO]

The Big Bang is supported by a very large body of scientific evidence from the fields of cosmology and particle physics.

[Bodhimalik]

I do believe you've answered your own queston with your question.

[Selah7+]

The Big Bang is supported by a very large body of scientific evidence from the fields of cosmology and particle physics.

Oh, that evidence. Where did the particles come from?

[Selah7+]

Trust that there is someone greater than you, and only by His grace and mercy do you exist and are loved.[/quote]

If everything we know of came from God, then where did God come from?[/quote]

He IS. God always was from eternity past...to present...to eternity future...forever. Does any human understand this? I don't. What human with a finite mind can understand eternity? What is 'out there' beyond the known universe out in space? More space? Then what. How did God come to be? He didn't, He always was and IS. No one can possibly answer this in their human understanding. That is where faith comes in. Without faith in a good, loving God, we have no hope for the future...we are lost forever. No one wants to end up like that - terrifying! But to know that God loves you enough to die in your place so that you can live forever - what is better than that? See, that was my question, "how can anyone know for sure?" I wanted to know, but didn't think I could know.

[BUFFALO]

The Big Bang is supported by a very large body of scientific evidence from the fields of cosmology and particle physics.

Oh, that evidence. Where did the particles come from?

I know that you think you know. But I also know that you don't and neither do I.

[Selah7+]

The Big Bang is supported by a very large body of scientific evidence from the fields of cosmology and particle physics.

Oh, that evidence. Where did the particles come from?

I know that you think you know. But I also know that you don't and neither do I.

Oh, but I do know. God spoke and it was. So, do you believe the scriptures that you quoted to me actually happened? What do you think?

[BUFFALO]

I know that you think you know. But I also know that you don't and neither do I.

Oh, but I do know. God spoke and it was. So, do you believe the scriptures that you quoted to me actually happened? What do you think?

Scripture holds no authority for me. And I'm sorry you went back on your word. Pity. Could have been the first step on a path to enlightenment for you.

[Selah7+]

I know that you think you know. But I also know that you don't and neither do I.

Oh, but I do know. God spoke and it was. So, do you believe the scriptures that you quoted to me actually happened? What do you think?

Scripture holds no authority for me. And I'm sorry you went back on your word. Pity. Could have been the first step on a path to enlightenment for you.

It doesn't, then why would you use a reference that holds "no authority" in your view, in a discourse to try to prove your case? No worries, Buff, I'm in Good hands.

[V-OutOfTheWilderness]

God spoke and it was.

How could you know such a thing? How could anyone know? No human was there when God supposedly "spoke everything" into existence. So it's all hearsay.

So you speak of things you can't possibly actually know anything about.

[BUFFALO]

Oh, but I do know. God spoke and it was. So, do you believe the scriptures that you quoted to me actually happened? What do you think?

Scripture holds no authority for me. And I'm sorry you went back on your word. Pity. Could have been the first step on a path to enlightenment for you.

It doesn't, then why would you use a reference that holds "no authority" in your view, in a discourse to try to prove your case? No worries, Buff, I'm in Good hands.

I am obviously using a reference that holds authority for you. And I assure you that I too am in very good hands: my own.

Allow me to quote some scripture for which I have much greater respect:

"The way is not in the sky. The way is in the heart."
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without. "
"No one saves us but ourselves. No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path." -- The Buddha: Siddhartha Gautama, Hindu Prince, founder of Buddhism. (563-483 B.C.)

[monkey man]

Nice quote Buffalo, this is a genuine question and not a sarcastic one.
What is the meaning of the quote?

[BUFFALO]

Nice quote Buffalo, this is a genuine question and not a sarcastic one.
What is the meaning of the quote?

Which question is genuine?

The meaning of the quote is to show that there are extant scriptures that contradict those that Selah7 holds as authority.

Not to mention that the words of Buddha appear to contain actual wisdom (in my opinion).

[V-OutOfTheWilderness]

"The way is not in the sky. The way is in the heart."
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without. "
"No one saves us but ourselves. No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path." -- The Buddha: Siddhartha Gautama, Hindu Prince, founder of Buddhism. (563-483 B.C.)

Great quote Buff.

A Buddhist master walked up to a hot dog stand, threw down a $10 and said "Give me one with everything."

He took his dog and started to walk away and then remembered the $10 and said, "What about my change?"

The hot dog vender was sharp, and quick to point out that, "Change comes from within."

[Bodhimalik]

Why is how the world came into existence so important with respect to a present day belief in a God?

That's a damn good question. Also, why is it so important to some that the earth is only 6 thousand yrs old?

I suppose the answer to both questions is that it's in the Bible. And people go crazy on the Bible. Even Isaac Newton went crazy on the Bible.

That's because they consider the Bible The Word of God. They have no real footing for believing that. There's no actual evidence that the Bible is the word of God. They just believe it out of thin air.

And that's why they go Bible crazy, and the creation is so important. And why we have "The Creation Museum" here in Kentucky. Where they have exhibits of people riding dinosaurs ... like in the Fred Flintstone cartoon. They take the Fred Flintstone cartoon literally ... like they do the Bible also. They've gone Bible crazy. Like the Flat Earth Society ...

I am new here and I have a question. How do you guys get the quote to appear with a yellow background?

[BUFFALO]

"The way is not in the sky. The way is in the heart."
"Peace comes from within. Do not seek it without. "
"No one saves us but ourselves. No one can and no one may. We ourselves must walk the path." -- The Buddha: Siddhartha Gautama, Hindu Prince, founder of Buddhism. (563-483 B.C.)

Great quote Buff.
A Buddhist master walked up to a hot dog stand, threw down a $10 and said "Give me one with everything."
He took his dog and started to walk away and then remembered the $10 and said, "What about my change?"
The hot dog vender was sharp, and quick to point out that, "Change comes from within."

You win! I'll put that one in my archive. But while we're at it:

[monkey man]

Thank you Buff. I was having trouble understanding the context in which it was used. It now makes sesne.

[omar]

Seh...seh...Seventh round...

--- Why does an existent God appear indistinguishable from a non-existent God?
O- Because we are stupid.

--- God cannot be seen. A non-existent God cannot be seen.
O- A-hah, a-hah. A multi-verse looks exactly the same as a single, regular, ordinary uni-verse. Why is that Mutcer?

--- God cannot be proven to exist. A non-existent God cannot be proven to exist.
God never does anything to show he exists. A non-existent God never does anything to show he exists.
etc.
O- See my point on the multi vs uni-verse.

[Selah7+]

Proverbs 1:1-7: The proverbs of Solomon, son of David, King of Israel:

To know wisdom and instruction,
to understand words of insight,
to receive instruction in wise dealing, in righteousness, justice, and equity;
to give prudence to the simple,
knowledge and discretion to the youth -
Let the wise hear and increase in learning,
and the one who understands obtain guidance,
to understand a proverb and a saying,
the words of the wise and their riddles.

The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge;
fools despise wisdom and instruction.

[Selah7+]

Buffalo:

Siddhartha is dead...so are the founders of all other "religions", because we are all corrupted by sin and therefore death came into the world. Jesus is the Way, the Truth and the Life, no man comes to God the Father, except through the Son. Buddhism leads to the way of destruction - the second death. No other can offer eternal life with a Living God in the glory of heaven except through faith in Jesus the Christ. You reject the wisdom of God to your own peril. Instead you trust in a false god and the folly of your own human understanding. It is a dangerous thing to trust in yourself for salvation...it is not possible.

[BUFFALO]

"What is the appropriate behavior for a man or a woman in the midst of this world, where each person is clinging to his piece of debris? What's the proper salutation between people as they pass each other in this flood? " - Siddhartha Gautama, Indian Hindu Prince and founder of Buddhism. Born 563 B.C. Died 483 B.C.

[Uccisore]

Why does an existent God appear indistinguishable from a non-existent God?

God cannot be seen. A non-existent God cannot be seen.
God cannot be proven to exist. A non-existent God cannot be proven to exist.
God never does anything to show he exists. A non-existent God never does anything to show he exists.
etc.

The reason God appears indistinguishable from a non-existent God is that atheists have postulated God's non-existence in a universe in which God exists.

[James S Saint]

"What is the appropriate behavior for a man or a woman in the midst of this world, where each person is clinging to his piece of debris? What's the proper salutation between people as they pass each other in this flood? " - Siddhartha Gautama, Indian Hindu Prince and founder of Buddhism. Born 563 B.C. Died 483 B.C.

Tethered by reality;

There is the ongoing cause of all that is.
There is the order and chaos brought about by that cause.
There is the adversary to every life.
And there is you.. an instance of life.

The rest is just noise…

_______________

Amongst all the noise there are many entities great and small, all vying for attention and ultimate influence – “God wannabes”. Some are mindless formations propagating through their circumstances. Some are forms of life, temporarily struggling to survive, not really knowing why and certainly not how, but merely presuming a purpose, need, and desire. Most all merely adding their bit to the noise.

Don't sweat the noise.

[Mutcer]

Why does an existent God appear indistinguishable from a non-existent God?

God cannot be seen. A non-existent God cannot be seen.
God cannot be proven to exist. A non-existent God cannot be proven to exist.
God never does anything to show he exists. A non-existent God never does anything to show he exists.
etc.

The reason God appears indistinguishable from a non-existent God is that atheists have postulated God's non-existence in a universe in which God exists.

How does it serve God's agenda to appear no different than if there were no God?