Why did we stop inventing gods?

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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Arcturus Descending » Wed Oct 26, 2016 6:21 pm

Greatest I Am,

Hello, Mohamed Ali :evilfun:

As to defining perfect as in the perfection of nature.


So what would that be ~~ the perfection of nature?
Can nature be seen, in actuality, as being perfect?
It is perfect by my perception most of the time but can one call nature "perfect"? Nature is natural, it abides by natural law, though not always, I don't believe ~~but perfect?
Are hurricanes, tsunamis, tornadoes perfect? They are beautiful to behold but are things which are capable of causing great chaos and destruction perfect?
What is perfect?

I see nature as always creating for the best possible end, given all the conditions and environment where life starts. Any life.

So what you're saying here is that nature is sentient and ethical; that it ALSO has its own purpose in mind? :shock:

There is indeed what we would call intelligent structure to natural systems. If there was none, the structure would have likely gone extinct. I think there has to be if as we can see, natures creates for the best possible end.


But is that [really] so? Give me an example of this?
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If I thought that everything I did was determined by my circumstancse and my psychological condition, I would feel trapped.


What we take ourselves to be doing when we think about what is the case or how we should act is something that cannot be reconciled with a reductive naturalism, for reasons distinct from those that entail the irreducibility of consciousness. It is not merely the subjectivity of thought but its capacity to transcend subjectivity and to discover what is objectively the case that presents a problem....Thought and reasoning are correct or incorrect in virtue of something independent of the thinker's beliefs, and even independent of the community of thinkers to which he belongs.

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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Ierrellus » Thu Oct 27, 2016 1:49 pm

Greatest I am wrote:
Arcturus Descending wrote:
Ierrellus wrote:God "invented" us.


Like Eli Whitney "invented" the cotton gin?

I think that it's the other way around - we've been since forever inventing God or gods...and this will continue on til death do us part from this mad Earth.


Indeed. As it should be.

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DL

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The totality of all natural conditions spawns humans over millennia of evolutionary processes. Humans, then, being created, create gods.
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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby phyllo » Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:03 pm

So what would that be ~~ the perfection of nature?
Can nature be seen, in actuality, as being perfect?
It is perfect by my perception most of the time but can one call nature "perfect"? Nature is natural, it abides by natural law, though not always, I don't believe ~~but perfect?
Are hurricanes, tsunamis, tornadoes perfect? They are beautiful to behold but are things which are capable of causing great chaos and destruction perfect?
What is perfect?
Something is perfect when it is exactly as it ought to be. If you say that everything in nature happens as it ought, then nature is perfect. Others will disagree if they have different ideas on how things ought to be.
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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Ierrellus » Thu Oct 27, 2016 3:13 pm

Matter and energy are partners in a dance in which they change places and identities. Who here can say who or what causes this dance to be as it is? God is as good an answer as any other. After all what's in a name? Natural forces will act as they will regardless of what they are called. The problem seems to be our propensity to not see God as anything but human. Thus we color evolution with notions of teleology and anthropomorphism. There are social and political reasons for this way of seeing, reasons that have to do with control of some persons by others. In short, is God an Is or a Should Be?" Is the dance rigged? By us? By whom or what?
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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Meno_ » Thu Oct 27, 2016 4:15 pm

The dance is not rigged, it is but a misunderstood process of the energy of transformation, the realization of the relationship between the Ying and the Yang.



It is but a necessary but very rare form of a hidden anachronism, hiding the nemesis of each other, within their own fold.
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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Greatest I am » Tue Nov 01, 2016 11:27 pm

Arcturus Descending wrote:Greatest I Am,

Hello, Mohamed Ali :evilfun:

As to defining perfect as in the perfection of nature.


So what would that be ~~ the perfection of nature?
Can nature be seen, in actuality, as being perfect?
It is perfect by my perception most of the time but can one call nature "perfect"? Nature is natural, it abides by natural law, though not always, I don't believe ~~but perfect?
Are hurricanes, tsunamis, tornadoes perfect? They are beautiful to behold but are things which are capable of causing great chaos and destruction perfect?
What is perfect?

I see nature as always creating for the best possible end, given all the conditions and environment where life starts. Any life.

So what you're saying here is that nature is sentient and ethical; that it ALSO has its own purpose in mind? :shock:

There is indeed what we would call intelligent structure to natural systems. If there was none, the structure would have likely gone extinct. I think there has to be if as we can see, natures creates for the best possible end.


But is that [really] so? Give me an example of this?


Any life would be an example.

Look at your own birth.

Do you see the natural forces at work then as creating you for your best possible end or for some end that is less than you might accomplish?

"So what you're saying here is that nature is sentient and ethical; that it ALSO has its own purpose in mind? :shock:"

Nowhere do I indicate that nature has intelligence.

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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Greatest I am » Tue Nov 01, 2016 11:29 pm

Ierrellus wrote:[

Indeed. As it should be.

Regards
DL

It works both ways.
The totality of all natural conditions spawns humans over millennia of evolutionary processes. Humans, then, being created, create gods.[/quote]

Indeed. As it should be.

Regards
DL
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Re: Why did we stop inventing gods?

Postby Greatest I am » Tue Nov 01, 2016 11:33 pm

Ierrellus wrote:Matter and energy are partners in a dance in which they change places and identities. Who here can say who or what causes this dance to be as it is? God is as good an answer as any other. After all what's in a name? Natural forces will act as they will regardless of what they are called. The problem seems to be our propensity to not see God as anything but human. Thus we color evolution with notions of teleology and anthropomorphism. There are social and political reasons for this way of seeing, reasons that have to do with control of some persons by others. In short, is God an Is or a Should Be?" Is the dance rigged? By us? By whom or what?


To answer that we would just have to answer, --- do priests, preachers and imams lie to us.

The answer is obviously yes.

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DL
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