The God Theory

Or maybe you should tell me what ignorance means to you. sensing is not the same as knowing (at least by my definition).

the athiest chooses not to believe because it is more convinient for him to do that, so its his ´heart´ who is deciding, it is simply that his “heart” has another direction.

True, sensing is not the same as knowing. This is why I also used the phrase ‘or at least’. In order to be curious, one must at least ‘sense something’ and there is the knowledge of knowing that it does exist. That is knowing something. For example, a little boy sees a whale for the first time. He is in awe of it, senses its beauty and meaning to him (for me, real curiosity must hold those two characteristics) though he knows nothing of that whale. It is that which causes him to be so curious and want to learn about the whale, which eventually causes him to become a marine biologist. :laughing:

For me, the real definition of ignorance is not having studied and learned something. There are many people who have a great intelligence but they are ignorant of certain matters because they have not had the opportunity to learn.
The other connotation for ignorance may be in having learned a thing and yet still not knowing it, understanding it or living our lives according to it. But that to me is more in line with stupidity.

I wasn’t putting all atheists into the same category. I was only speaking of a particular kind there.
And there is your kind - the one who chooses not to believe because yes it is more convenient for him, more comfortable for him, not to - just as it is more convenient and comfortable for a particular type of ‘believer’ who chooses to believe without examining his beliefs and the validity or rationality of them. We all have our particular coccoons.

Perhaps for the atheist I was speaking of before, it has more to do with integrity and living in truth (heart) as he at least subjectively sees it, rather than getting sucked into what he sees as someone else’s silly dogma, doctrine and perspective, especially when he sees that that believer’s beliefs do not affect the world in any good way.

Well there you go to me ignorance is not knowing something. Which means that the less you know the more curious you will be and as such the greater need for “god” you will have. The bigger the ignorance at a social level you have the greater the need and thus believe in “god”. Ignorance =god since they are both directly proportional.

Therefore more convenient. Who said I am an athiest? I am a philosopher.

For myself, I wouldn’t use the term ‘convenience’ in reference to the atheist I described above. Do you really think that a person’s integrity has to do with convenience? Tell me something - when you personally are striving to maintain your integrity and live by a particular code, moral or otherwise, do you sense that as a convenience to yourself?

I’m not quite sure what you mean by the above - 'who said I am an atheist?..but if you are thinking that I thought you were an atheist, I wasn’t. This wasn’t about you - simply about atheists.

Unless your remark was meant to be facetious and to imply that as a philosopher, one could never believe in god…which is just plain silly…

As there is your kind implied, that my kind do it and thus i was a kind of atheist, but leaving that behind, define integrity before we even start discussing any further.

My definition of convenience- a reward that instigates a pleasure reward on the brain.

As there is your kind implied, that my kind do it and thus i was a kind of atheist, but leaving that behind, define integrity before we even start discussing any further.

My definition of convenience- a reward that instigates a pleasure reward on the brain.

Gah you win a prize for the most overused yet illogical argument. Hell even the definition wont go to belief town; belief in a thing with no proof is illogical, it’s logical to not countenance the existence of something you cannot prove, but that is not a belief per se. I’ve seen some great answers to this on various sites, I recommend you get out more. :slight_smile:

I aint an atheist but calling atheists believers is a terrible argument. Believers in what, lack of evidence? That’s just common or garden disbelief.

“Atheism: the lack of belief that deities exist.”

You can pervert that all you want but trying to make it a belief is torture on logic.

Believe in disbelief, what does that even mean. Semantically it makes little sense, it is a paradox. :unamused:

Are what you define as atheist open to the idea that deities exist?

Agnostic. I do sympathise with atheists though, when they are labelled with a belief system when all they are is those who don’t believe, through lack of conviction in the existence of deities. This creationist dogma that not believing makes you a believer is badly thought out. And although I too do not believe, I would and do get more hatred than atheists for not being as sure. It’s not atheism that is your biggest concern, or science or Satan, philosophy is where religion is ground up and subject to reason, your enemy isn’t Dawkins it’s Dennett et al.

At least philosophers aren’t arrogant about it…most of the time.

Then we are not talking about the same thing, if the person is not open to the posibility of something, what he believes in becomes his religion. Therefore his belief.

Actually 99.99999999% scientists aren’t either. And the other small amount of people, aren’t very good at philosophy, ie Hawking and Dawkins. :slight_smile:

Controversial claims sell books, God is dead, the God delusion, why the universe doesn’t need God, why I woke up in Atheism land, the catcher in the sky has forgotten his catchers mitt, plum chickens for dummards. And so on.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZCL4dXUtblg[/youtube]

A little light relief for the atheist believers! :wink:

Did you actually read anything I said?

Seems to me you skipped over my first post and then proceeded just to believe that you were right?

How does disbelief in something equal a belief in something?

Then we are not talking about the same thing, if the person is not open to the posibility of something, what he believes in becomes his religion. Therefore his belief.
[/quote]
Did you actually read anything I said?

Seems to me you skipped over my first post and then proceeded just to believe that you were right?

How does disbelief in something equal a belief in something?
[/quote]
Cause and effect, there most be a reason for them to disbeief, eg a belief, normally in science. which contrary to popular thought it is a kind of religion.

Now you wouldn’t happen to be creating that percentage off the top of your head would ya? [-X

Yeah they sure do, are those last two actual publications or did you just make em up?

Good Satan PBUH, you are actually attacking science. Where does science include belief in its dogma, if anything nothing can be theoretical unless it can be disproven. You definitely need to go back to the drawing board on this one.

There must be some kind of reason to disbelieve. No there must be some kind of reason to believe, you don’t reason on no evidence, hence you don’t form value judgements on nothing, hence you don’t believe based on reason.

Humour it is not logical Captain. :wink:

Although in any form of humour there is a grain of truth. :stuck_out_tongue: