Chemtrails

[lizbethrose]

You wake up and it's beautifully sunny and clear for the first time in weeks--maybe even months! It's so clear, you can see the vapor trails left by high flying jets going to and from your local airport.

You go to work, expecting to leave work to bask in the late afternoon sun. Unfortunately, the weather where you live is totally unpredictable and you leave work to face another cloudy, grey day.

Is there a reason for this other than the weather? You decide there is--you decide to call the vapor trails you'd seen earlier 'chem trails' left by low flying aircraft spraying some sort of chemical over your city in order to change the weather from sunny and blue to cloudy and grey.

Please tell me, with all honesty, why you don't think your thread is nonsense and why it shouldn't be treated as such.

[SIATD v2]

Fruck. Off. And. Die.

But I love you all really and MagsJ is the bestest person ever whom I idolise till my dying days

[tentative]

Lizbeth,

You just had to open this can of worms, didn't you?

OK. As I understand the chemtrail theories, either the government or the Illuminati are deliberately spraying chemicals into the atmosphere to make us unsuspecting fools more docile, reduce our mental capacities, or... a combination of other nasty dire consequences leaving us helpless compliant slaves to those who would control us. It's another conspiracy theory that conveniently dovetails into the over-arching "they're out to get us" grand theory.

FWIW, we do 'spray' chemicals into the atmosphere. But it is unlikely that it is a directed sinister plot. Every airplane in the sky, from Cessna 180's to the biggest jumbo jets, use some form of hydrocarbon fuel that produces both observable particulates as well as 'invisible' gases. How these elements react with atmospheric moisture to form contrails, clouds, or just a general haziness can be explained, but only after-the-fact. We don't have the capacity to accurately track evaporation of sea water, or the specific measurements of the necessary particulates that allow molecules of moisture to coelesce into visible atmospheric conditions. So we can and do see visible reactions of human-made flitting about in the atmosphere. Any good meteorologist will readily concede that we can't predict EVERYTHING about atmospheric conditions because there simply aren't enough monitoring abilities available.

<edit> The comment that preceded my post confirms the impossibilty of any rational discussion, doesn't it?

BUT... The issue is making the jump from seeing the atmospheric conditions to assigning malovent intentions to unknown controllers. In this, you might as well talk to the wall. The people who are convinced that 'they're out to get us' cannot be swayed. They KNOW what we don't know, and build all the elaborate explanations necessary to support their theories - just like any other conspiracy theory, and any refutation is met with the usual put downs of being 'blind' to the evidence, not doing proper research that 'proves' their claims, etc. The chemtrail conspiracy people are pursuaded and nothing will change their minds.

Let this one go. It's curious, but no more curious than the dozens of other conspiracy theories.

[SIATD v2]

Lizbeth,

You just had to open this can of worms, didn't you?

OK. As I understand the chemtrail theories [load of stuff that proves tentative hasn't a clue about this, summed up with obligatory dig at 'conspiracy theories' as though they all had the exact same epistemic value]

No wonder, with people like the two of you having made up the population of the world's most powerful country for the last several decades, that the world is so screwed...

[tentative]

SIATD barks,

....[load of stuff that proves tentative hasn't a clue about this, summed up with obligatory dig at 'conspiracy theories' as though they all had the exact same epistemic value]

And there is the 'obligatory' dismissal! Thank you for proving my point. Good job!

[Gobbo]

If it isn't the two most intellectually worthless people on the forum.

Hey guys. You'll have to excuse me for not responding to pure ignorance. Time to go buy some weed legally in an outdoor ceremony - Canada Day here.

[SIATD v2]

SIATD barks,

....[load of stuff that proves tentative hasn't a clue about this, summed up with obligatory dig at 'conspiracy theories' as though they all had the exact same epistemic value]

And there is the 'obligatory' dismissal! Thank you for proving my point. Good job!

All you've proved is that when you stereotype people and their beliefs they tell you to get bent. That has nothing to do with whether what they believe is a 'conspiracy theory' or not.

Actually, why the fuck am I bothering? You're just here to reassure the other retards.

[tentative]

SIATD barks,

....[load of stuff that proves tentative hasn't a clue about this, summed up with obligatory dig at 'conspiracy theories' as though they all had the exact same epistemic value]

And there is the 'obligatory' dismissal! Thank you for proving my point. Good job!

All you've proved is that when you stereotype people and their beliefs they tell you to get bent. That has nothing to do with whether what they believe is a 'conspiracy theory' or not.

Actually, why the fuck am I bothering? You're just here to reassure the other retards.

Uhhhh... I didn't mention anyone in particular nor at no point did I suggest that any conspiracy theorist agrees with every conspiracy theory. But apparently you must identify in some way with that group or your comments both to Lizbeth and myself would have no meaning? You seem to have 'outed' yourself or are extremely thinned skinned about the subject of conspiracy theorists. But it's not for me to speculate. I'm just here to reassure the other re... Are you suggesting that anyone who might disagree with conspiracy theorists are retards?

[MagsJ]

I am locking this thread up - if anyone wishes it to be reopened then pm me to state a case as to why it should be...

[PavlovianModel146]

You wake up and it's beautifully sunny and clear for the first time in weeks--maybe even months! It's so clear, you can see the vapor trails left by high flying jets going to and from your local airport.

You go to work, expecting to leave work to bask in the late afternoon sun. Unfortunately, the weather where you live is totally unpredictable and you leave work to face another cloudy, grey day.

Is there a reason for this other than the weather? You decide there is--you decide to call the vapor trails you'd seen earlier 'chem trails' left by low flying aircraft spraying some sort of chemical over your city in order to change the weather from sunny and blue to cloudy and grey.

Please tell me, with all honesty, why you don't think your thread is nonsense and why it shouldn't be treated as such.

This is a thread designed to insult via parody and sarcasm a thread made by another member...

This started in SS, MagsJ, if it's cool with you I am giving LizBethRose a Warning for the creation of this thread. I want to check it with you first, because the parody thread is in your house. If you are fine with a Warning (2nd) and 24 Hour Ban please feel free to do it in my absence.

[PavlovianModel146]

If it isn't the two most intellectually worthless people on the forum.

Hey guys. You'll have to excuse me for not responding to pure ignorance. Time to go buy some weed legally in an outdoor ceremony - Canada Day here.

That should also be a Warning, in my opinion, third. Your Forum, your call, though, MagsJ.

[PavlovianModel146]

For reasons discussed via PM, I would be inclined to excuse Lizbethrose's infraction on a one-time basis on the grounds that this thread was not created for overtly hostile reasons. I have suggested that Lizbethrose either forward the PM to MagsJ, or permit me to forward the PM to MagsJ, but given the intent of Private Messaging, I am not going to do so without Lizbethrose's go-ahead.

In any event, Gobbo's comments in this thread obviously spawned from his anger over the thread's creation for what he probably (as did I) believed to be hostile, malicious and sarcastic reasons. Despite the blatancy of Gobbo's comment, if I am to excuse LizBethRose's creation of this thread, I'd almost have to excuse Gobbo's comment because you wouldn't have the latter without the former.

This is my new recommendation. I have already stated that this is MagsJ's house, so she will deal with this issue as she deems appropriate. I normally wouldn't even chime in here in Mundane Babble, except this is an on-going issue from Social Sciences.

[MagsJ]

No further action will be taken on my part, but any repeat performances will be dealt with appropriately, as (as Pav has previously stated) this hounding each other from forum to forum and thread to thread is not going unnoticed.