Holy shit, COULD it happen HERE?

All soooooo true.

Right vs. Left
Shame vs. Guilt
Corporate oligarchy vs. Statist bureaucracy
Advertising vs. Hollywood
Materialism vs. Goodism
Classical vs. Romantic
Pretends to be strong vs. Pretends to be weak
Willng to fuck over millions of people for a corporation vs. Willing to deny the fucking over of millions because of a dream
Shallow cardboard heroes vs. Jesus figure heroes
Cocaine vs. Marijuana - that is two different delusions, one a cold much ado about nothing narcissism and the other a stinky passive ‘love’ neurosis
Worship dead lefties vs. Worship dead lefties - yup they both do
OT Christians vs. Mindfullness trainers
Fantasies have the feel of infomercials and Bruce Will movie trailers vs. Fantasies with the feel of movie of the week tearjerkers and, as a guily pleasure, Bruce Willis movie trailers.

Both will go to war to support soldiers put in danger to make someone a buck.
Both have political correctnesses and both are stupid enough to think the Left invented the only one
Both have their own version of self-hatred and they hate the other’s version.
One shames their kids, the other guilt trips them
They are both addicted to being seen as the two options
Neither one can see through the BS of pharma’s war on emotions
Both are addicted to their digital devices and distraction
Neither one can deal with diversity and will pound everyone into boxes, though they have different boxes
Both Incapable of seeing their own contribution to the idiocy and suffering
Both easily manipulated by the sharks WHO COULD NOT GIVE A SHIT ABOUT EITHER RIGHT OR LEFT VALUES
and love when you guys pick one side
like Fixed Cross
and present yourselves like victims
which both sides do.

Frack them both

You two should have a nice little chat about Jews and Israel, now that things have a cuddly base.

Sure, I can relate to that. There were always misgivings on my part regarding the extent to which my mentors [sacred or profane] reflected the Whole Truth about right and wrong, good and bad behaviors. But to the best of my recollection that revolved more around perfecting “one of us” rather than in critiquing “one of them”.

But that simply reflects the manner in which I construe your “I” and my “I” here – re moral and political value judgments – as profoundly problematic identities embedded existentially in experiences that might have overlapped in some respect but were entirely different in other ways.

In other words, dasein as I understand it on this thread: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=176529

But, most crucially of all, I recall that either through God or political ideology, I felt this strong psychological sense of being grounded in a narrative/agenda that gave my life a true sense of meaning and purpose.

But: it was the wholly unique experience I had with John and Mary, coupled with my immersion, intellectually, in existentialism, that set into motion a frame of mind that began to crumble/crumple more and more with each passing year.

You, apparently, were never quite as embedded in that sort of “comfort and consolation”.

I, on the other hand, managed, to the best of my recollection, to buy into objectivism hook, line and sinker back then. The flavor mattered less than the fact that one way or another I was hooked. And, let me tell you, when you lose that feeling by tumbling down into the hole that I’m in now, it is still always there to remind you of what you no longer have access to. At least not here and now.

So, sure, there is always the possibility that this “psychological bent” is still propelling me. I’m no less “hooked” on nihilism derived [perhaps subconsciously] from the manner in which I have hooked myself on being in the hole I’m in.

It’s all [still] just a way to convince myself that I understand the world around me “better” than others who don’t think like me.

I would never deny that.

Well, the “degree” to which you have accomplished this seems beyond my reach here and now. I can never really be certain that any particular thing that I think [re the is/ought world] is not somehow just embedded in the constellation of existential variables that predisposed me to believe this instead of that. Only those who are down in this hole with me might come to grips with the ambiguity, the ambivalence and the sheer uncertainty in which “I” is now fractured and fragmented.

And yet somehow in this way…

…your own particular “I” has landed on more stable ground. But how could I ever really even begin to grasp how you accomplished this given [no doubt] the extent to which your own experiences simply do not overlap mine.

From an earlier post, here is my own “history” in a nutshell:

I grew up in the belly of the working class beast. I worked in shipyards and steel mills. I was drafted into the Army and spent a calamitous year in Vietnam. After being discharged I matriculated into college [in the tumultuous 70s] and for the next 6 years there was practically nothing I did not try at least once. I then spent nearly 25 years in a veritable alphabet soup of radical political organizations. I was married, divorced and raised my daughter as a single parent.

How many other folks here even come close to this? So, of course the manner in which they construe “I” out in the is/ought world will no doubt be very, very different from mine.

Slavery working or not working depends on what can be calculated. If you employ slaves in order to prosper and then through slavery you do in fact prosper how has it not worked for you?

And back then there were any number of folks able to make what they construed to be reasonable arguments [moral arguments] for embracing slavery. Some even rooted in God and religion.

My point here revolves around the assumption – and that’s all it is – that while my own political prejudices here and now are embedded in the personal belief that enslaving other human beings is wrong [as a political prejudice] I have no way in which to demonstrate philosophically that slavery is necessarily wrong; and that all rational and virtuous men and women are therefore obligated to reject it.

Same with fascism. Same with all other conflicting goods.

No, my point here always involves making a distinction between whatever any particular individual might think about capital punishment [as an existential contraption, as a political prejudice] and that which philosophers are able to establish as the moral obligation of all rational human beings.

If philosophy is thought by many to be the search for wisdom, what then are the wise men and the wise women to make of capital punishment as a moral issue? What argument, analysis, assessment etc., works best here?

As opposed to those who are hired to create a device that actually will work successfully in executing the prisoner.

How are these different things?

Then we are back once again to the fact that in this regard, you have somehow managed to feel less fractured and fragmented than I have. Still, on the other hand, with respect to the hardcore moral and political objectivists among us, you seem closer to me than to them.

It works, sure. But only to the extent that I am still able to find some measure of fulfillment [pleasure, satisfaction] in the food I eat, the music I listen to, the movies I watch, the exchanges I sustain etc.

But all of that unfolds in a world construed by me to be essentially meaningless on this side of the grave; and with the grave itself [oblivion] getting closer and closer and closer.

As for this…

…I can only take it one day at a time. As an existentialist. As someone still able to assume that each day can bring a new experience, relationship and source of information and knowledge.

Assuming of course that any of this is not only what it ever could have been in a wholly determine universe.

No, I want someone to describe to me how, out in the world of conflicting goods, their own experiences have allowed them to create a sense of self less fragmented and fractured than my own experiences have left me.

You have made that attempt and I appreciate it. As have others.

And, sure, who knows: Down the road I might come upon a frame of mind that startles me such that I actually begin to imagine it as a path up out of the hole I’m in now.

After all, what else is there here but to keep on keeping on?

Here we go…

thedailybeast.com/armed-tru … t?ref=home

Still, is Trump just the anomoly here or is he the start of a whole new [and sustained] chapter in American politics?

On the other hand, it’s hard to imagine a really calamitous lurch to the right until something on the order of an economic collapse begins to unfold. Or some catastrophic war.

K: type in state polls about trump and notice that in every single
state in America, that his polls numbers have dropped since
may 2017 to I think, June 2018… and that includes states that
are reliably red… in every single state in the United States…

so, no, America at large doesn’t “love” IQ45………and his overall
numbers are and have been pretty fixed at 51% negative and 40%
positive… it might fluctuate from month to month, but it usually
hangs around 51% negative… and I might remind you that IQ45 lost
the popular vote by almost 3 million votes… so, he isn’t even very popular,
little less loved…

Kropotkin

Peter, the fact that you still trust the fictional polls says it all. The polls are run by the leftists, thus they’re false. Duh!

K: but I thought the leftist ran Hollywood, or maybe that was the jews,
but Jews seem to be awfully busy running running the world’s economic
system to be involved in some petty movie industry………but wait, I remember
reading about how Shira law was taking over in the United States and how entire cities
was under Shira law and if you weren’t muslim you didn’t go into those area’s but if
Muslims were taking over the United States, what happened to the Jews?
I thought it was the Jews who were taking over the United States…
and I thought it was the liberal elites were were taking over, but wait…
are the liberal elites Jewish or Muslim? I forgot… Maybe the big wall charts you
have that keep track of who is running the world today will tell me who I am
suppose to be against today… Is it the Jews, the liberal, the liberal elitist, the Muslims
or perhaps it the blacks who seem to be taking over… and they are clearly
muslim because anyone who is black is clearly muslim like Obama… who was born
in Kenya or some other foreign nation like Hawaii…or maybe, maybe
it is really the aliens from space how are hiding behind the Jews or was it the liberal elites?
into really running the world and I wonder how the Jews or muslims or whoever is
who think they are running the world is getting their orders from the space aliens who is actually
in charge leaving the Jews or the liberal elite or the muslims to think they are in charge
when it is really the space aliens who are in charge…because we all know
that the moon landings were faked, oh, wait, faked, that is why we have fake news
today because the moon landings were faked in 1969 and that directly lead to
the fake news we are having today… I saw some very suspious activity
in the sky tonight and I am pretty sure it was the jew/liberal/liberal elite/
muslim getting their orders from the space aliens who use lights in the sky to
transmit their orders to earth…

it is all very, very worrisome… I lay in bed at night and wonder how anybody
can sleep when it is so obvious that the space aliens have
taken the polls and turn it against the single greatest man in the history of the
world… Donald, I AM GOD, trump…I heard that Trump can walk on water
but it is the space aliens who control the media, or was it the jews, was it
the libeal elite, anyway, whoever ran the media that keep this wonderful news
from us… how DONALD, I AM GOD, TRUMP can walk on water…it is the aliens
and their fake news that keeps us from hearing about this…the answer is right
in front of you if you weren’t a commie loving, nigger loving, jew loving, space alien loving
traitor to america… it is clear to the rest of us REAL AMERICANS that its the jews,
liberals, liberal elitist, muslim, space aliens that is keeping america down from
from learning the truth about the man who can walk on water…

if only you would become wise and smart like me, you would know the truth…
says wendydarling……

from a Jew loving, nigger loving, liberal elite loving, muslim loving, space alien loving,
unamerican traitor failure…so sad…

Peter you’re not supposed to say the n-word.

K: I am too old to give a shit anymore…
beside in the new Amerika, you got keep everyone down except the old white folks
who own everything, like the Cock brothers and the Waltons…
besides I was just joking and you have my thought and prayers because
I am the victim here anyway and I was misquoted and the media is the enemy
because they are forcing us to go to war with whoever we are fighting with these days,
I can’t remember, Iran or North Korea…………. or whoever and its very important in
the new Amerika that we blame everyone else but ourselves… so I am blaming the
Jew/communist/liberal/liberal elitist/ space alien/niggers/muslims who
are taking away my high tech job and forcing me to live on welfare, if they
only left the country, I could live like a millionaire and be bff with Oprah……

If only…

your space alien loving denigrated white person…

Now my point in this exercise was fairly simple…

to get people to be outraged……

we have become numb to the damage and hurt that the lies
of the right have done…………

my point is to get some outrage… why aren’t you mad?
why aren’t you outraged?

for most people, they just don’t care anymore………
they hide their head and hope the drama will go away…
while they watch their TV shows about Hollywood stars…
instead of getting off their asses and doing something about
the fucking mess the world is in… but to do something,
you first of all, have to become outraged… and I don’t see the outrage…

I had mentioned that my political philosophy has changed… I
now see that the left must fight to protect people rights and lives and their interest
as hard as the right does to take away those rights and lives and interest ……

the left has been far too passive and has allowed the right to walk all over them…
I am fighting back, today with words, and if necessary, tomorrow with fists…….

I say to the left, fight with the same intensity and if necessary, the same violence…
only not to take away the rights of people, but to give the people the rights back……

we can no long afford to be mister nice guy while the right destroys this country…….

not only could it happen here, IT ALREADY DID… you just haven’t seen it yet…

and we must fight for our lives because that is what is at risk here, our lives…….

now some might say, we must not lower ourselves to fight down at their level…

I say, screw that… do what it takes to save America from becoming
Taliban west………the other side is willing to lie, steal, cheat and yes, kill
to give to the economic overlords our hard earn money, every tax cut the
wealthy get, it is less money for everyone else……… and we must fight that,
by every means necessary… fight for your country as if the Nazi’s have landed
in Washington D.C. because they have………. what will you do to save your country
from those who will try to throw anyone who is not the white/wealthy club
into jail………. so, once again, are you outraged?

I wished to god you were…… because we need outrage and anger, to fight
those who will put us into prison for not being “real” American’s…………

be outraged… for the love of god, that is the only hope for America,
is for American’s to become outraged at what is happening because it is
happening right now, right here………………

but put your outrage where it belongs, aimed at the right and fight,
fight back with every resource at your disposal… and remember, we
are not fighting with the Marquis of Queensbury rules… we are fighting for our lives,
our liberty, our rights, don’t fight fair, because the other side isn’t fighting fair…
they will do whatever it takes and so should you…

Kropotkin

Didn’t know that you are married to Maxine Waters Peter Waters, yes, as she said, fight dirty, be violent, yes that’s you Peter…any means Peter.

K: class warfare against the middle class and the working poor
as been on since Raygun was in office… it is time to fight back…
this war has been going on for a long time, it is time the middle class
and the working poor fight back……… I am Irish… when you get
into a fight with me, I don’t take prisoners, I don’t accept
surrender, I don’t fight nice,… it is a fight to the death…
I will kick you until you stop moving and then kick you a few more
times… bring it on…

:violence-rambo:

This is just as absurd, divisive, hysterical, paranoid and reactionary as the republicans who feared the US would become an Islamocommunist dictatorship under Obama.

Total nonsense.

Why are so many Americans so divisive?
It seems everytime the republicans get in, democrats are screaming: its the end of the world, and everytime the democrats get in, republicans are shouting: the sky is falling.
Hate to toot our own horn, but we don’t have this sort of sensationalist attitude in Canada.
You’re already a demi-fascunist two party dictatorship, like we are, so really what does it matter?

Globalism…one party regime, fascist, dictatorship…sounds worse. At least Trump is trying to save our sovereignty. Have you been arrested or fined for using the wrong pronouns yet? Canada is even crazier.

I will deal with facts and only facts showing how
the middle class is getting squeezed…

IN 1970, the middle class held 62% of the aggregated wealth
in the country and the upper class held 29%

in 2014, the middle class held 43% of the aggregated wealth
and the upper class held 49%…

the % of middle class has fallen from 61% in 1971
to 50% in 2015

and the upper class has risen from 14% in 1971 to
21% in 2015…

the number of union member has fallen by 2.9 million
since 1983…

the rate of union membership has gone from 20.19% in 1983
to 11.1 % in 2015…

wage stagnation is very well known: since the early 1970’s the
hourly inflation-adjusted wages received by the typical worker as only
grown by 0.2% which means wages has not kept up with inflation…
so the average worker has lost ground since the 70’s in regards to
income…

the average amount of dept by the middle class in 1992 was
32,200 and by 2014, 84,000 dollars…

the amount of net worth of the middle class has plunged…
from 2007/ 120,000 to 2010 the net worth being 77,000

people living in poverty has risen from 11.3% in 2000 to
15.1% in 2010

in 1971 the middle class was the majority amount of wage
earners, in 2010, the number of middel class earners were
121.8 million people, or roughly a third

so what do these facts show us?

that the upper class has engaged with a war with the middle
class and the upper class has been winning that war…

these are facts, not guesses, not hysterical,
not paranoid, but facts showing that the war on the middle class
since Raygun has been in effect and has been working…

we also know that the United States has greatly increased
its income inequality over the last 20 years…

you cannot argue with facts…

Kropotkin

and we know that this happens regardless of which party is in the White House or who dominates Congress. We know that Obama, the potentially most liberal President in recent years, immediately brought as his financial team the very people responsible for the policies and practices that led to the financial crisis. This income gap thing no longer, if it ever did, have anything to do with this party or that party. Both parties are beholden to and in love with Wall St. Whatever they whisper to the spouses when going to sleep at night. Not one of them has the guts, so let’s not presume interest, to go public with qualms about the power of corporations and Wall st. and bankers while they are Presidents.

I agree, I was taking the piss, as the Brits say, Canada is messed up too.

Peter the Koch brothers are upset with Trump and are going to bankroll other people this time around. Should be interesting to see how that pans out.