are you saying jesus is just alright, ierrellus?
Holiness simply means being whole, not being separated or having warring parts. Atonement means at-one-ment. See NT James on what it means to be holy.
See Jesus for the way the truth and the life. Again, we were created whole , but forgot who we are. Sin means missing the mark. Jesus is the reminder. There was no plan to cause sin in order to warrant a redeemer. The mark was there from the beginnings of creation; it was the Word.
Can you point me to where in the scriptures Christ is supposed to have said that?
I think that that is open to interpretation.
Arc,
What interpretation would you give of that sentence? My interpretations of Scripture are based mainly on"A Course in Miracles", which is Christianity with a Buddhist flavor. I would ask if you see the Bible as the ultimate authority on who or what Christ was or if there are accurate insights on being spiritual to be found in Buddhism, Confucianism, Hinduism or even in the holism understood by many indigenous people? “The letter of the Scripture is death”.–Paul. I can’t locate readily the quote you ask for, but can only wonder why you need it.
Ierrellus
Arc,
“You can be as I am”. I am hard put to give this an interpretation because I do not know what came before or what came after it. That is why I asked you to point to where in the scripture it came from. I am not saying that you do this but many tend to give the interpretation that serves them best when it comes to scripture.
Is that necessarily what was “intended” though? Can you give me the scripture where you took that from?
You said: Jesus is a way to be followed, not a person to be worshiped."
That is why I asked you if you believe that Christ is divine, the Son of God.
You said: Of course I believe that.
That being said, one who truly believes that Christ is, literally, the Son of God, which would necessarily make him Divine, would worship Christ.
Okay, so you did not mean it literally speaking, right?
You may say, figuratively speaking, that you are a son of God but how can you say that you are Divine? We are human beings. If we believe that God or Christ was/is divine, how can you put yourself on the same level? You are human.
For those who are led by the Spirit of God are the children of God.
Romans 8:14
Do you take this to mean that one automatically becomes Divine as God is?
Can you put that in a nutshell?
No I do not. The bible was written by infallible human beings and I do not think of it as the inspired word of God. That is not to say that I would throw the baby out with the bathwater. There is a lot of wisdom and common sense within it.
Define spiritual? Does that include moral and ethical?
We all gravitate toward and are moved by what speaks within us to follow insofar as the above goes.
It sure is or it can be.
My belief system is just that–a belief system. I cannot convey to you the experiences that prompt these beliefs, that is, unless you have had similar experiences. I believe that to follow the Tao that is the truth, the way and the life is to be like Jesus who claimed to his disciples “If you have seen me, you have seen the Father.” A Course in Miracles" teaches that we are born blessed, but have forgotten who we are." For me that makes more sense than allowing one to be poisoned in order to have an antidote, which is what the theory of original sin is all about.
Literally, my beliefs are lies.
I believe that in another post you expressed a belief in spiritual experiences , but could not bring yourself to label them god experiences. Example, the awe you feel sometimes in Nature. These are the same thing. If we can recognize Nature’s propensity to produce a spiritual experience, we may get beyond the myths of sin and redemption that hold us at odds with with the natural life cycles and ecosystems. Nature did not fall with the fall of man because there was no fall of man in the beginning.
Divine is a title and judgement given to someone or about someone.
One cannot declare themselves divine.
Who declared you divine?
Regards
DL
This last is an outright lie.
Jesus was chosen before the world was even created. A remedy is not invented before the disseise is unless one knows that he has built in and planed for the sin/disease to be born.
If you have to lie, do not make it such an obvious lie, especially as you sing that Adam’s sin was a happy fault and necessary to god’s plan as he had to have a job for his immoral messiah and immoral people who will follow such a vile god, like you.
Regards
DL
I Am,
Welcome to the mythology that has kept man and nature at odds for millions of years and proffers our extinction.
I agree that our religions have dumbed us down to what nature demands of us to the point of us imperilling ourselves during this global extinction event.
We have become poor stewards or our eco system and it is letting us know that in spades.
That is what thinking that using an immoral concept like scapegoating a Jesus type has helped do to us.
Regards
DL
Mea culpa—I meant thousands of years not millions. Just defensive because you agree with me about religion and Nature then attack my beliefs,
Getting and spending we lay waste our powers
Little we see in Nature that is ours.==Wordsworth.
Throughout history dominion has come to mean exploitation–because we can.
This is the way the world will end,
Not with a bang, but a whimper.–T. S. Eliot
Was the Fall of Man in the Garden of Eden a fall into mind and responsibility or a fall into sin and culpability? The latter taints the creation of the human psyche with a fatal flaw. The former agrees with creative evolution.
I agree with the Jewish interpretation that Christianity reversed, — sort of, as they have conflicted their beliefs.
Jews saw Original virtue while Christians, on the one hand call Eden where man produced Original sin, while on the other hand they preach and sing that Adam’s sin was a happy fault and necessary to god’s plan.
Jews smart, Christians conflicted and stupid.
In older times Christians could do apologetics around the necessary sin, but todays apologist have been dumbed down to where they cannot and I will not show them how.
Regards
DL
Apologies.
I am prolific and feisty and sometime err.
I spend way to much time fighting the religious and it has likely effected my attitude with non-believers as well.
I will have to try harder to remember to keep my bully side in check with those on my side.
My sieve of a memory does not help.
Regards
DL
The notion of creative evolution can see a coming together of religious and scientific viewpoints. Einstein commented that he did not doubt God did it, but wanted to understand how it was done. Science and religion do not have to be enemies.
Trends in naturalist/science thinking have come and gone in history within religions but both religions and science now both have a god of the gaps and no, supernatural religions and natural science do not mix.
We either live in a natural world or a supernatural controlled world and the two thinking systems will always be in opposition.
Religions are dying and given the immoral natures of most of them, especially the mainstream ones like Christianity and Islam, so the sooner we are rid of them the better.
youtube.com/watch?v=BRHefbIgKxk&t=91s
Regards
DL
Ierrellus,
What do YOU mean by Divine and why do you call yourself Divine?
Can I please have your response according to what you think and feel and not the thoughts and feelings of whoever wrote A Course in Miracles (is it?) et cetera.
You were an English teacher I remember so you can handle this well.
By being divine I simply mean I am an integral part of all that exists. My belonging here is beyond questioning. I see nature as divine in the same sense; however, I see most humans as in conflict with nature which is a conflict to the death. Most think nature needs to be revised to suit our wants.
“Things are in the saddle and ride mankind”,–Emerson.
Greatest I am
Jesus was chosen to do what to your way of thinking?
So, are you saying here that God did this?
There is a difference between a lie and an honest opinion. He is as entitled to his beliefs as you are to yours, Greatest I Am. They are all beliefs as none can be proven.
Has anyone ever told you that you ought to bring your attitude down a few notches? What you said to Ierrellus was pretty insulting.
God cannot possibly plan things for free agents.