How to become Ubermensch?

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuWwCUXGzWE[/youtube]

I know little of Tupac, but based on this, less it was an act he put on to sell, he was much too chivalrous be an ubermensch, he was more like a Robin Hood, the people’s champ.
Champion of women, presumably the poor, the untermensch.

Nah Im speculating Tupac Amaru is my old friend Lohlé, the Brazilian Machine. Only one who ever did could get me to enjoy a piece of duck.

Obviously all men who have lived so far have at most been tendencies possibly belonging to a greater totality of the Uebermensch. The Uebermensch would have things in common with Vladimir Putin, the greatest Russian, as well as with Travis Scott, the greatest American. The vast distance between the two gives you an idea of how much evolution is yet to be laboured before such “strange plants” as Nietzsche envisioned can be born.

Sure by woke standards the Superman would be psychopathic. He would be violent, and he would value everything in his own terms. But, being Dionysian, his heart is as great compared to ours as the human heart is compared to a monkeys; both examples I gave are men with Dionysian hearts. Cold blooded in self-control, but living for far greater things than such a frail thing as a basic selfish character could endure, much less enjoy.

If the ubermensch isn’t a psychopath, he’s at least an elitist, not a mere influential egalitarian.
Unlike the psychopath, the elitist has the capacity to intrinsically value others, but unlike the egalitarian, he doesn’t value them evenly.
He values the strongest, most intelligent and sentient the most.
To these people, which he considers himself to be a part of, belong most of the wealth and power, not to the riffraff.

I agree with all that.

By the way it was kind of depressing marking Travis Scott as the greatest American - Its not like I listen to the dude’s music, unfortunately there now is zero American music coming out that I listen to - its all depressive as hell. The last century, America was packed with great individuals, this century, I have only been impressed by Trump, and a bunch of people to do with him. I mentioned Scott because, of all the rap-figures that Ive seen this century, he is most “of one piece”, he seems to truly have a powerful heart. The music industry is trying to destroy him now to get another good tragedy to salivate over, and it seems he’s probably gonna fall for it.

All this, rap music, Tupac too, is what I see as belonging to a long process of physiological awakening to a more direct state, which Nietzsche describes in some of the quotes I gave earlier, and which is going to have to be part of human evolution. In that vein I see the whole of American music. An awakening to a more physiologically integrated state, and all drug (ab)use that accompanies the music industry is simply part of the chemical process that mankind and his evolution are. Its all an experiment.

As for great American minds, I very much appreciate Philip Meyer, author of “The Son” which is a devastatingly powerful and beautiful novel in which the American spirit is captured like in no other book Ive ever read. Of course Id rank my own philosopher friends very highly, as well. But yesterday I felt like making a point about the distances that yet have to be crossed before we have something like Dionysos in human form. Since Dionysos cant be seen separately of music and intoxication its inevitable that we consider the most intoxicating musical artists. And by that I mean, those who simply have the greatest intoxicating effect on the People. Not so much on me. Dionysos was hardly intoxicating only the philosophers.

I must say though that in as far as boldness of world-shaping actions are concerned, Donald Trump is supreme.
From “AsianGirlsLoveTrump” (the existence of this monicker says enough) : reddit.com/r/HillaryForPris … rump_wins/

Praise Kek.
The New Paganism is yet very very very young.

baytallaah.com/bookspdf/78.pdf

Page 123. Chapter Three. It is an enjoyable read for anyone interested in the subject.

I’m not into rap, I mostly listen to rock from the 80s, 90s and 00s, a bit of classical, country, electronic and experimental.
Mainstream music at least has never been worse, rock is all but dead, and rap, r&b, pop and country qualitatively peaked decades ago.
It’s funny we have greater access to music now than ever before in unrevised history, but the trade off is most of what we produce today is garbage.

America too peaked decades ago, it’s in decline now, it isn’t going anywhere but down.
If it doesn’t take the rest of the world with it on its way down, we will see Asia, particularly China supersede it, both materially, militarily, and perhaps even culturally.
At the very least it’ll be a more multipolar world, America will have to share dominancy.

Dionysus has always been with us, all the great artists were manifestations of him, or rather Dionysus was a manifestation of them.

Trump is an ubermensch, an elitist, not a right (libertarian), nor a leftwing (socialist) egalitarian, altho he makes a lot of promises to the people, he rarely delivers.
He’s rich, powerful, pretty smart, in an unrefined sort of way, but not very sentient, I don’t think.
He’s not a globalist, nor a nationalist, a real globalist would grant amnesty and citizenship to most illegals, a real nationalist would close the borders, but he wants to keep the borders open, without granting amnesty and citizenship, for the cheap labor.
A real globalist would push for world government, either by conquest or consent, a real nationalist would be noninterventionist, but Trump wants to continue playing war games.

Hillary’s not going to prison.
The Trumps, Clintons and Bushs are all in cahoots with the rest of the elite.

If paganism means elitism, and polytheism, it never really went away, just occulted itself, first masquerading as Abrahamism, then as right and leftwing egalitarianism.

i’m feeling like there’s a misleading comparison being drawn between ‘psychopath’ and ‘egalitarian’ here. a more accurate contrast to begin with would be that of the voluntary egoist and the involuntary egoist. this immediately eliminates the notion of egalitarianism as if it were some genuine, selfless concern for the altruistic well-being of people… as well as the logical extreme at the other end - the psychopath - who would be the opposite of this type. once these two extremes are done away with, you can center the examination on the highest kind of egoist and identify him as an ubermensch.

the reason why ‘psychopath’ can’t qualify here is because an ubermensch would personify both ends of the spectrum - the elitist and egalitarian ethos -, and each would fall under the rubric of his singular egoism. now what makes his actions appear ‘psychopathic’ is the severity of them… most often the immoral and/or amoral violent stuff. but when such action is done in the service of egalitarian aims, it confuses our typical formula; we are unable to imagine such a thing as a noble criminal, for example.

i mention novatore because in him there is a perfect conversion of both ends of the spectrum in a singular being, and as such he is incommunicable to both the elite and the plebian, neither of which are capable of comprehending the ubermensch.

but this kind of evaluation comes from an anarchist’s perspective. the wealthy/bourgeois are already excluded from being ubermenschean simply because they’ve done no work or suffering. without these, no character can be developed… and certainly not that paradoxical singularity of ego that expresses both extremes of the spectrum after the steady evolution of one’s character through periods of incredible struggle. again, the ubermensch must be a personification of a tremendously difficult balance struck between creative and destructive amoral impulses that he values because of their intoxicating effect. for the anarcho-egoist, it is only incidental that his criminal deeds might result in some kind of revolutionary progress, just as it is only incidental that abiding by the law might benefit the power of the oppressors. remember, the anarcho-egoist acts only for himself… and it is only because the intensity, scale and range of the effects of his actions have such excentrifugal forz that we label him ‘criminal’ or ‘hero’ after the fact, depending on which side of the spectrum we’re on. but this kind of ubermensch belongs to neither side and is disgusted by both the parasite bourgeois elite and the plebian underclasses that have been doing dialectical battle since the beginning of time. a novatore just happens to be passing happily through and is incomprehensible to everyone around him.

yeah but you gotta get that delicate synthesis of man’s best and worst qualities in a single person in order to have an ubermensch. trumpf is not an ubermensch, btw. if anything, he’s a testament to what has become of the concept in the 21rst century… one which emulates material wealth as the highest virtue and exalts the ‘bourgeois toads’ as novatore called em. you’ve got to do something more than get rich selling apartment buildings, man.

a better example would be mao or lenin. when what we like to think of as pathological is expressed in terrifying ways for ends that are in direct contradiction to the means. that’s the unique collision that startles our conscience. that’s the grand paradox that materializes in an ubermensch. anything short of that comes out of the homeowner’s edition of the will to power or some watered down shit ayn rand wrote.

Aren’t we sorta letting our imaginations run away with us…? Checking out ubermensch/overman images on google we seem to be stuck at the evil nazi superman with a moustache stage.

Or… the gay devil tire saleman.
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Yeah and you know what pisses me off about the American ‘superman’? The fact that he had no vices. I mean look at that dork Clark Kent. Uh gosh Lois I’m sorry… I didn’t mean to spill my coffee on you.

Such a man cannot be super. One would never invite a real ubermensch over for dinner with the family unless the whole family wuz Uber.

Of course Hank Reardon had to learn that the hard way. :laughing:

I get what you’re saying, everyone’s selfish, everyone just uses others.
Selfish individuals form selfish collectives only because each individual thinks they’ll get something out of it.
The rich form groups; bureaucracies, corporations, militaries, political parties and so on to more affectively use the poor, other rich groups, individuals and natural resources, and the poor form groups; cooperatives, unions, militias, political parties and so forth for the same reasons.
Usually the rich are more organized, but always fewer in number by definition.
And sometimes cultures, ethnicities, races, religions, the sexes and so on war against each other.
The ubermensch then are people possessing qualities (cunning, courage, charisma, conviction, ruthlessness) permitting them to successfully lead such groups to victory.
Yup, there’s a ton of truth to that, I don’t think it’s the whole truth and nothing but, that 100% of people are 100% selfish and amoral 100% of the time, but people are pretty selfish, and there’s nothing necessarily wrong with that, that’s just the way it is, what a billion years or so of evolution and the struggle for survival made us to be.

Whenever I play the “which three superpowers” game, I always choose - teleportation, wolverine’s regeneration, and mass persuasion. That’s world domination right there.

Basically, movement, longevity and charisma.

Dropping movement for I dunno, intelligence and an amazing memory, the most important traits for an overperson are still longevity and charisma. If no-one wants to kill you, you don’t ever get assassinated. Ok there will be the odd lone nutcase, but I’d take that over a government sanctioned hit-squad any day of the week.

Humanity’s real strength has always been its numbers. The Ubermensch would principly be a unifier.

About Trump, he did more than just, sell apartments.
He became president of the US.
That’s no small feat, even for a billionaire, otherwise every billionaire or UHNWI who ever ran for office would’ve won.
Trump hardly spent any of his own money on his campaign, most of the money he spent he raised.
Furthermore, more of his money came from small donations than Hillary.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/politics/2016-election/campaign-finance/

He’s completely full of shit, of course, but the willingness and ability to tell a compelling lie to further his interests is part of what makes the ubermensch, the ubermensch.
Has he said and done some dumb shit?
Not really, so far whatever he’s said and done has only alienated himself from half the population at worst, while compensatorily drawing the other half further to him.

I don’t like Trump, the only people he cares about are himself, his children and some of his wall street buddies, but I can dislike him, and still acknowledge his talent.
He’s a talented bullshit artist, you got to hand it to him, whatever he sets his mind on accomplishing, be it in real estate, reality tv or the presidency, he succeeds.
If his enemies have any sense, they won’t underestimate him a 2nd time.

Fucking A, basically Nightcrawler + Wolverine + Xavier = the ultimate ubermensch.

The only way you’re going to beat Trump is with substantive attacks on his policies.
Association fallacies, conspiracy theories or playing gotcha with gaffes he’s made isn’t going to cut it.
But most, or all democrats aren’t substantive people, they’re every bit as full of shit as he is.

Concerning Nightcrawler, Wolverine and Xavier; there’s only one ubermensch in the marvel universe…


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He can not be beat at this point, maybe, just may be Bloomberg, if Bloomberg & Co. can buy him out in an aggressive takeover.

Where the fuc is the OP now.

Its not about the rap itself, what I referred to 2pac for, its not that I imagine N would have loved his music. Its the awareness of tragic pathos with which he lived - the directness of his life.

Music I like is e.g. Bachs non Christian stuff, some hard dance music, Arab fuck music, Bizet, my own music, some specific popular songs which I’ve long exhausted, and some Coltrane, some other properly Dionysiac jazz, and just, here and there something turns up that I like. But I hardly ever listen to music anymore.

At the least, indeed.
More than that Im not willing to speculate.
Its like Bergson says now. The future isn’t reducible to the present.

Parts of him anyway and not just artists.
But the full fledged Dionysos has yet to appear - as a Nietzschean I have rather high standards for what human I would grant the title “Dionysos”.

I think he is so smart as to be able to appear not very sentient and at the same time completely reshape world-politics.
What he has done internationally is astonishing.
He has basically cleaned up all the hypocritical the filthiness of the American Empire. Unbelievable.

No, he is absolutely not paying any games. He has only made very few, and all deeply serious and efficient acts of war.
All previous American presidents have been utter rotten shit when it comes to war.
Causing millions of unnecessary deaths and dozens of ruined states with absolutely no benefit for anyone at all except some weapon manufacturers and oil producers.
Trump is so great it is truly hard to find a parallel.
He is alike Alexander the Great in greatness at war.

Not cahoots, negotiations.
Power works that way.
Only the very weak and naive expect it to be different.

All that is included. But I said the new paganism.

I am a religious fundamentalist of Odin. I do not relativize or anthropomorphize my Gods, I take them more literally than anything except my kin.

THOR governs this here river bend.

Could one say that Martin Luther King and Mohammed Ali were ubermensches?

The below hyperlink might bring everyone in here back down to Earth. lol

simplicable.com/new/ubermensch

Perhaps the real ones would be ones who were not out there trying to be ones and who would never recognize themselves as being ones or being great.
One who constantly speaks negatively in response to some insult or other who is not capable of rising above it all, and who self-aggrandizes and stretches the truth or does not speak it is certainly no ubermensch.