Economy Misunderstood

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Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Sat Jun 04, 2011 5:55 pm

From:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/05/memori ... se-20.html


Intelligence Attractive ? You must be crazy, much better simple (especially girls) as simple as possible, no mind at all, essentially dead, even better, nothing is my friend...

Kill Intelligence.


Now, go on and read the following, you will be under the dictatorship of my free will forcing you to put the words and ideas together as I chose in your mind, I will control your mind and the content of your thought for a few minutes, abide, be my slave.


Economy Misunderstood

I am a bit like those ex-christians that believed, all of their lives in a kind of religion, a kind of objective, external reality, rules and models of reality shared and believed by everyone, or most, or anyways some kind of objective truth, rules that we should abide to, an aggregation and serialization of results (just like in religions, be good and you will be rewarded, etc.), but then discover it was all a lie, a huge deception, there is nothing only crap in people, outside of people and everywhere, no god exists, no nothing, the world is totally meaningless, has nothing to say to us and we have nothing to say to it, there is nothing that has to be communicated to us, no metaphysical or spritual truth, no beauty, no value, a total void, zero, empty, undefined, barren, boring, no need for any communication, you simply live, life is a bitch, eat drink and be merry and then you die, end of story.

Only in my case I kind of believed in the Economy, the system, it progresses, Capitalism goes forward, it is for the better good, it defeated Communism, etc. Nothing further from the truth, no religion has ever been more false than this one.

Economy only exists in terms of people interacting and mostly fighting, it is a constantly unstable system and will be unstable forever, there is no aggregate value being produced, no lasting result only power struggles, some win, some lose, always changing and never really producing lasting collective results. Except in the form of technical advancements that optimize many processes and imply less labor needed, no matter what, this is probably the only real collective aggregated value being produce. We are producing "the end of labor" and "the end of labor needed" more than anything else, and this is in fact the great deception of Economy, as all of the economists want yuo to believe that it has rules that favor "society" or that well run economies genertte "wealth for everyone and jobs" etc.

They want you to believe that there are structural and objective advances by an economic system applying competition, innovation, productivity. But this is the lie, this ideology just serves to concentrate money and power in fewer and fewer hands, and no economists will ever tell you the truth: the modern economy is only producing one product really well and really fast, the end of labor, the elimination of labor, the end of the need of people in general for them to do anything at all. The modern economy is generating leisure time by the boatloads, is eliminating the need of people in all endeavors, and ever more and ever faster by optimizations, technical advances, software, robots, internet, globalization having factories anywhere in the world being able to export to anywhere else etc.

Economy exists only in terms of exchanges and interactions between people, if you are not interacting and exchanging then the economy slows down or halts, the process slows down, fewer and fewer people can earn money and live and "work" (which is the exchange), in a sense, the interactions, transactions and exchanges must be forced, or are forced sometimes by fundamental necessities (but minimally in this case as this is the primary sector of the economy - agriculture). The economy doesn't really produce "products", it produces transactions between people, interactions between people and imaginary values of mostly placeholders (ipads, movies, education, you name it) that serve as an excuse to interact. But this interaction and exchange between people is always simply a fight, a status challenge, what is exchanged is simply an excuse for the interaction, what is exchanged often has no value, only a temporary invented value that serves the purpose of being an excuse and placeholer for an exchange and interaction between people, so that they can get "the money flowing", the process going, constantly going, constantly exchanging.

But we have a strange short circuit happening today: on one hand the placeholders and excuses - objects of interaction are evaporating into the abstract world of information, a combination of bits that can easily be transfered anywhere at any price and mostly for free (the internet and all kinds of "Information Products" (music, video, tv shows, books, blogs, forums) as we now live in the "Information Economy"), but this free information doesn't really imply much exchange in real money anymore. But the information generated, in free form mostly is increasing ever more, thanks to the Technological Economy creating EXCESS CAPACITY, in the form of technical advances making this exchange cost less and less and also by all the free "hobby factories" generating this information for free by free labor (everyone generating their own information so easily, blog, videos, you name it).

But there is a reason why it seems that the future items of exchange are destined to evaporate into the abstract, light weight material of bits, as opposed to heavy real products like cars and boats and houses: because it is very easy to generate these "products", they cost almost nothing, there are very few inhibitions and interdictions to their flow across the world and mostly the energy needed to produce them and transfer them is infinitely smaller that the energy needed to produce cars, houses, boats, real products based on a real material world.

But if you want to create "Jobs" you better get people building real heavy things like Skyscrapers, Rockets to Mars, etc.

So just this development makes it seem as if we are headed towards an abstract virtual world, a virtual reality where only the information exchanges count, where emotions and reactions are all tied into how we react and interact with this information, and each information reflecting a person behind it and having varying degrees of emotional interaction with the information and person behind it. It only takes a few steps to go from here to a modifed mind, modifying the neural networks of brains and them interacting in any new way.

People sometimes say that they believe that "there is more to reality, the world, life than meets the eye": No it is the other way around, there is not even that that meets the eye, not even that exists or is reality, reality and life is less than what meets the eye, is essentially nothing at all, hence the justification to invent modified minds and invent and lie and create any reality, world or anything you like: it is all fake and a lie anyways, there is absolutely nothing at all, no necessities, no obligations, no interdictions or inhibitions (although we are full of subtle interdictions and inhibitions, the greatest inhibition being the "suspension of belief" in the form of the mental variable C, which means the degree to which you are convinced something is real, and this is usually higher than 0 and less that 100, so normal reality would be about 80, you are convinced by 80 % that your reality is "real", but by 10 % that a fake reality is "real": but a totally fake and made up reality can be assigned a C of 95 or 100 if you are good enough at it, hence, you demonstrate that there is nothing outside of what you create for as reality).

By the way, I could write about how "Love" better understood as "Infatuation" could be essentially much more pornographic and dirty than sex: Infatuation is much more involving, some forms of infatuation can get quite extreme and totalizing and emotional. Sex, even the most intense could effectively imply much less emotional involvement,is mechnical, but anyways...

Now, go on San Jose Mommy, let your little lucy and bobby copy all this for their homework, the teacher will give them an A and a GOLD star, let them play outside in the backyard, go on mommy, let them find some mental contraption representing a new mind universe interaction, here is a new one, they can try to figure it out, they can run around together in the backyard, imagining and playing with all of this, oh, what fun:


ShshHSHShhdhehdhruuJJE))======$)%))&666

Wow, who knows what that is. It must be a very complex block diagram where emotions are converted into sensory information, the organization of reality in those minds must be so different from anything we can even come close to thinking, there is a feeling to thought generator or something like that, mutliple memories, 20 dimensional time coordinates, who knows what else...

Quo vadis ? baby ...
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby Lucis Trust » Sat Jun 04, 2011 6:33 pm

I think we should have free food, shelter and healthcare, that'll slow our brains and economy down, then we won't need these superfluous interactions, or is that what humanity is, a kind of superfluous interaction? Would having food in our bellies slow us down, or speed us up? Maybe it has nothing to do with capitalism, maybe it's something more fundamental, maybe it lies at the core of what humanity is, a black hole, a vacuous abyss that siphons the real world, the world of substance and harmony.

Our brains are on overdrive, each and every letter I type to you has no value or solidity whatsover. This forum may as well not exist, it is a conduit for our wrestless souls. Maybe that's why people turn to religion, it acts as a conduit to divert the hungry mind away from the earth. The belly can be filled but the mind keeps on going, it never ceases. Religion says to us, it's ok, it's ok, God loves you, everything will be ok, paradise is at hand, maybe we need that, and maybe it's absence is the true source of our insanity?

Everything in nature is designed to rest at some point, but not us, we just keep on trodding along. Don't worry though, the elite are working on solutions 1. Cause ww3 and wipe out 98% of us wtih cancer viruses and the like, or, 2. What they're doing at CERN. I think they created a particle or something that weighs as much as a star, it could wipe us out, why are they doing that, well, they just have to, that's what fucking humans do. We will destroy, eat away, there is no ataraxia unless you're on herion or religion. No contentment, that's what we do, we have given birth to shiva, we have come to destroy planet earth and prepare the way for super bios. Only super bios could survive a thing like humanity, cleanse the world of the old bios and prepare for the new, yup, i can see it coming, haha, ahahahaha, we're all doomed, doomed I tell you!

The black hole particle is the emobiment of humanity, it is our offspring, it is God.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:30 pm

From:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/05/memori ... se-20.html

Like when a person jogs or does physical exercise or activity thinking that he is doing something "good" for himself (but mostly good metaphysically, for an imaginary metaphysical reference system that doesn't exist, if not only in the minds of people communicating with themselves or others and trying to convince themselves), like the mommy growing her kids and putting so much effort in it, all those people working and trying to construct something, trying to achieve, trying to do the right things, the right actions, so that they may be judged by god (but mostly a reflection of other people's judgment that takes god's place, or is god really taking other people's judgments place ? but especially your own as god's?). Always trying to fight for the "right thing" (undefined by definition), effort, dedication, belief, construction, always struggling and fighting and especially making believe you are winning, that all the sequence of "one damn thing after another", the story of your life the "history of your life", somehow is adding up, is achieving is constructing, and you doing the right things feeling smug and comparing yourself always (even if you don't notice, even if only vaguely in the background) to everyone else that does the wrong things, or even slightly wrong things, so you feel superior, better, you think you are winning (or even slightly winning), you think you can win. Always some activity that is a closure, some "1) start - 2) activity - 3) end", some delimitation, especially in time, something done, some sequence having value, as a product, as an achievment, no matter how small, it is supposed to make you feel a little better.

Nothing further from the truth, all you do is zero, mostly and many times negative, worthless, is probably all the bad things possible and all the wrong things, you will be punished anyways.

Hey mommy, how I love the idea that god hates us all so much, he hates our guts, he is so different from what we think: when we die, he says to each of us, to everyone, no matter how good or bad you were, no matter what (and therein lies his absolute power and genius) you suck, you got it all wrong, he punishes all unconditionally and sends them to his paradise that consists of infinite pain forever but is in reality extreme pleasure because he uses a different logic from us. Jesus speaks to little childen, this is the task I have been given by my boss, as I am Jesus.

Now go on, contradict me, prove me wrong if you are able.

The world is a total void, has nothing and no meaning and no worth in it, is a dead, irrelevant, indifferent entity, is so valueless that only an extremely modified brain - mind could hope to give it some value. Therefore stick wild electrical signals in the ball of meat that is the brain, pour crazy wild chemicals inside it, put it into a nuclear reactor, soke it up with neutrons, extreme magnetic fields, let it go wild, let it all out, be crazy, let the brain be what it should be, a complete free and wild contraption visiting the most far out insane places ever, go on mommy. Do it, you can do it, just do it.

Will you be my mommy ? I think I need one, and a spanking being as I have been a bad little boy on blogs and forums, a blog - hog, but that is ok, we have EXCESS CAPACITY, they sell hard disks having Terabytes of data of storage at supermarkets, can you imagine how many cool sounding blocks of text I could write with all of that free memory ?

Now tell little lucy and bobby to copy this new block of text for their homework for Monday, it is a nice A+ and BLUE star. But if you want, you can use it for your "work", show it to your boss, as a special "research document" you invented, or give it to your husband to give it to his boss, they will give you or him a raise for this and the other huge piece of crap I wrote before, actually you would have finally given them a clue on what on earth they should produce in their fairy tale, imaginary, quirk jobs and corporations, being that most corporations today don't have the slightest idea what to do with those few employees left "working".

Quo Vadis ? baby ...
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby Lucis Trust » Sat Jun 04, 2011 10:57 pm

Oh, I know this guy, he's that peak oil guy, isn't he? I just assumed it was you.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Sun Jun 05, 2011 9:53 am

QUOTE(old6598 @ Jun 04, 2011, 09:18 AM) *

Kill Intelligence.

What about imagination?

http://brainmeta.com/forum/index.php?sh ... 324&st=150


Yeah, kill that too. Kill everything, just kill, just do it, I don't care if I "contradict" myself.


EXCESS CAPACITY SUFFOCATED

The system posesses or generates so much excess capacity in al productive endeavors that it needs to burn, waste and trash as much excess capacity possible, and must suffocate and kill, repress its productive potential that is hundreds of times greater than what is used otherwise it would rapidly reach COMMUNISM ACHIEVED and an INFINITE RESOURCE SOCIETY.

I always hear someone say there is more computer power in your PC than used for the space program to go to the moon. And I would like to add, and what have we achieved with all of this computer power, what has been achieved and produced ? Nothing at all, a turd of an economic system with capitalist hogs stuffing themselves with trillions of dollars of profits, a lot of people idle and frustrated with no jobs in sight, no common goals, no serialization or accumulation of labor results, only local specific egotistical slobs working for themselves and their own profit not connecting the specific to the general, but the economists always aggregate all of the specifics in generalized numbers to tell us how we all suck, how we must increase "competitiveness", "productivity", "competition", "innovation", you name it, they are allowed to use large scale general concepts to hose the weak and poor and workers, but the workers are not allowed to use large scale generalized concepts to demand that all of the excess capacity, computer power and other excess capacity, technology, know how, manpower, you name it be used for collective aggregated results like Rockets to Mars, Skyscrapers, Total Automated Factories, Cheap Rents, Free Salaries, Hobby Factories, High Speed Trains, a complete BUS system all across the USA, etc. you name it, what could benefit everyone is a never ending list of items.

Why not demand that all the computer power and technological advances be used for the general collective good ? because everyone has been brainwashed to be a puny hog, think of their own private profit, never connect the specific with the general, that is the job of economists who then punish entire nations like Greece and Spain and who knows who's next with their Macro Economic Models that always leads to hose the weak and poor and workers.

One good thing the economy does is large scale consumption, we need ever more consumption, kill nature, nature is a tool in our hands, we use it and try to consume and waste as much as possible, that should be the goal. But it is not enough, we need large scale collective projects like Rockets to Mars and Skyscrapers to try to discharge the huge excess capacity the economy has within itself.

But we need shallow people, we need people that are simply reactions to actions, that are always ready to change in order to increase consumption which is then transactions and exchanges of money between people, we need a simple, always ready to buy the new gadget economy, buy the new IPAD, change the car tomorrow, hire and fire, change jobs, house, buy new furniture, always change, go with the flow: this is why the USA is the highest consumer economy, people are simple and shallow (not like the europeans that are critical, "deep", don't buy into things easily, a stiff economy, eurosclerotic) and are used to buy and throw away, always following the next fashion, new cars, what is important is the light weight structure of the economy, always change, but especially don't think, keep the factories operating at full capacity ever more, ever more change, consumption ever more gadgets, buy and trash forever,in fact the USA has light weight homes, wood, easy to build fast to build easy to hose, change, easy to go someplace else, a fluid econmy, with change as the name of the game.

Even in language, when we use generalized, large scale concepts we need to "reach a conclusion" a general conclusion that is supposed to paint a picture of eveything, like when you say, "energy is running out", that becomes the large scale narrative of all reality, or the end result of your life "I failed in saving that marriage", large scale concepts that are supposed to paint the entire picture of reality: nothing further from the truth all of those concepts are just tricks of the mind, there are no large scale concepts, they are just a sequence of symbols that provoke feelings and are supposed to be "Important", but they are just as important as that stain on your shirt. And if you analyze anything for enough time, any possible sequence of symbols as a combination of words can be true, wait a long enough time and any words put together in anyway at all will have been concluded and generated.

Automatic for the people, when you turn around the corner and you see a new house built, that is automatic results generated, labor that is parallel in time to you and creates free results for others to enjoy, everything is mostly automatic, just think of it and it has been done, performed, all automatic, the new car done, made, finished, now enjoy, the amplification of results, anything can appear and be instantly. That is excess capacity.

I can't understand those turds that think that it isn't ok to be anonymous on the internet, you are free to say whatever, who cares who you are, of course in real life you would never talk about much of this crap, who cares.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Sun Jun 05, 2011 11:58 am

We are always only Will Power denied, our Will Power denied sometimes more sometimes less, but only this forever, like that pretty car you wanted but couldn't buy, a degree of Will Power denied, a path of high and low denial of your Will Power. Will Power is such a crappy non elegant concept, and yet that is all we are.
Last edited by nameta9 on Mon Jun 06, 2011 10:43 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Mon Jun 06, 2011 10:42 am

On Resource Scarcity Myths and Other Myths


I find it fascinating that Kunstler's Peak Oil theory, and his entire ideological construction is based on a single point of failure, just like he points out, correctly, that oil (but it would be more correct to say energy) is the single point of failure of the USA economy: and namely how much energy is available to propel vehicles. If this amount is greater than his fairy tale estimate by a substantial amount, well their goes his Peak Oil theory and his entire ideological construction (cool to see how just one small number can demolish years of texts and debates by thousands of people).

It seems like just the total reserves of shale gas worldwide could propel a billion cars worldwide for another 100 years if you only used that gas, let alone using all the combinations of energy that could be used to propel cars like ethanol, diesel, electricity, etc. So I fanthom that you can safely say that Kunstler's Peak Oil scenario, if it is ever going to happen (and that is a big if, considering that technology is always going forward, even if slowly and no matter what anyone thinks) will happen at least more than 100 years from now.

On the fact that people think that there is "something else" to life and reality, "something deeper"; "something more than meets the eye", and then they associate it with all kinds of feelings, emotions, and "beauty they see", all kinds of cheap idealisms and "feel good" thoughts and sensations, etc. I respond, FALSE, there is nothing at all not even what meets the eye or what you feel, actually, what you feel is a sign of weakness, is vulnerability, is you being defeated by MATTER that has you under its thumb. We are only simply a puny "fight", a "contrast", "an opposition to our will power and how we react", a reaction to the opposition to what you want, but you are driven by your instincts and impulses so it is not really you anyways (but then again where or who are you ? another infinite recursion of intractable - impossible metaphysical "problems" (are they even problems ?)).

We are the deep end of of reality, we are the only thing that is deep and reality is as deep as we think we are (which is zero, no depth, we are just a simple "Action - Reaction Machine", a one transistor circuit, go figure). We are the deep end of "deep", reality has nothing deeper than us, us pretending to be deep. The only thing "deeper" than us could be Modified Minds and Instant Singularities, wildly Modified, and they can become as deep as ever, infinitely "deep".

The myth of progress, that you could learn the rules and patterns of reality and control it, improve it, the myth that experiences were accumulative, added up, that you were going forward, and especially the Technological - Scientific Myth (not to even mention the Economic Myth of Capitalism and Free Markets) of increasing knowledge, all the models, the pristine pure (platonic, nay, somewhat metaphysical models), all the Math and Equations especially had a deep, implied intentionality of use, that you were in control that you didn't depend on the fact that "The World Is Your Enemy", "That it is Independent From You", that we are just the next reaction to action in terms of the fight, the simple reaction to your Will Power contrasted and opposed. And also we always fool ourselves that we are in control when in all truth all of our existence deeply depends on just that one photon not going wrong in your body, that quirk photon provoking an ictus and immediate death, a sudden heart attack, whatever.

We are simply Will Power Fighting, the impulse to do or get or achieve what you want and external reality opposing this, but especially external reality in terms of other people's Will Power opposing you, and you knowing that they have an impulse that is the same as yours, but only opposed to yours (hence you aren't even justified Metaphysically in wanting to satisfy your impulses, you know they are quirks, arbitrary trash and quirks just like all of life and existence).

Also, I probably make a lot of mistakes and wrong analysis, but who cares, I could care less, all I write and have written is trash, just dump it, who cares, I have no problem in "contradicting" myself, I actually like to contradict myself and trash myself, I am always wrong (sounds so cool), always, that is my greatest satisfaction, to know you are always wrong, as in "The Mind is Always Wrong".

So on work - labor - activity (whatever it is delimited as): the fact that work is just a reflection of exchanges, which is really an excuse for an interaction between people (as probably people don't have to interact and exchange anything and could live in total isolation forever, never seeing another soul and be 100 % happy, as in Man is the "Infinitely Programmable Machine"), as this creates money transfers. But an infinite amount of excuses for interactions and transactions between people can be invented and created, hence work may be infinite anyways and never run out.

So this contradicts my theory of "Work Ending": but maybe because I belong to a generation where work was tied into something material and physical (agriculture, manufacturing, things you can touch and see like Rockets to Mars and Skyscrapers), something that was necessary, and maybe it is I that can't wrap my head around the idea that real work never existed (or may have existed in the past but is destined to disappear into abstractions and fluff), but always was a proxy for human interaction and exchange, human transactions and hence a cultural construction, an invention from the outset.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Mon Jun 06, 2011 1:12 pm

Some Perversions

Of course there really are no perversions, there are only entities or behaviors, patterns that are compared to others and seem completely the opposite of what you were used to or expected, different, wrong, or unrelated, whatever. Also, language and thought is always an equation of concepts based on previous concepts, that are simply mixed and matched in a different combination, something new (or perceived as new ?) is related and defined and associated with some combination of old things (when did new words, entities and concepts appear anyways ? aren't they all old ? when did the first new one come out ? uh oh, another infinite recursion).

But, on the fact that economy today is more and more based on inventions and less on necessities, but especially how the necessities are tied into the inventions, how something arbitrary and ridiculous can become "Important" and economically tied into real money and necessities (the arbitrary mix of real and fluff, what is payed for and what not), like Facebook (most people thought that website was really "stupid" when it came out, now it is all fashionable, cool, and really important, or cell phones with cameras in them, etc.) is really tied into the fact that there are fewer and fewer real jobs to do in terms of basic necessities, real economic circuits in which to employ so many people so you must keep on inventing new ones, ever more, ever newer, an excuse for an interaction between people, an excuse for a transaction and money exchange.

But there is a real reason for all of this: the ruling class must always create new sectors, new fashions, something that pushes people to buy, change, always new and change, and new companies hiring young (especially young, since they believe easily in the BS of the importance of their "jobs", etc., but even more importantly firing the old, now obsolete workers, planned obsolescence, and you pay the kids a lot less and fired old guys now feel that they have failed their game at life and career, they are now total failures they didn't "study hard enough" or "innovate hard enough", whatever), so as to create instabilities, large flows of money into new things like that idiotic website of groupon, etc. You can expect virtually anything, no matter how far out, really anything at all, as long as it creates cash flow. This is based on the fact that Man is the Infinitely Programmable Machine.

The ruling class knows how to hide the hidden agenda, they always describe something as new and important with some kind of objective, structural description, that is very hard to see behind: you know, we are "competing" with South Korea (their students study 12 hours a day), or we have to implement websites and Internet Commerce to "cut costs", and so on, a never ending sophisticated list of descriptions of things that seem so "logical", so "natural", so "advanced", so "correct", who on earth is ever going to challenge any of this ? who on earth will even ever doubt any of this ?

By the way, on those two examples, a service economy doesn't "compete" with anyone or anything anymore, it is actually quite a closed loop process, that South Korean students study 12 hours a day is not related to and totally irrelevant to anything at all in the USA (but then in South Korea, they say to their kids that they are not "creative "and "innovative like the Silicon Valley kids", they just "study - memorize and don't invent", go figure, you can never get it right, you are always wrong no matter what you do) as is the concept of competition since 70 % of the USA economy is not even in manufacturing (it is fluff and consumption when it is not health care, fixing up so many busted bodies, or busting new bodies in other countries as in defense), etc. Cutting costs by websites is just a fancy way to close real stores and hose as many workers as possible and dealing over that work to virtual "hobby factories" of people maintaining those websites for free in their basement or bedroom.

But some oddball sectors you can expect to flourish: porn (websites, contacts, whatever, this sector can get really carried away, all kinds of new combinations, behaviors, paid or not paid for what or not, real or fake, in between, what new kinds of behaviors "families" or "families busted", so many possible economic circuits), groupon like crap and similar, anything that intercepts money flows, and so on and so forth. And all of this possibly destroying the old fashion "family" model, or straining all of the old social models in all kinds of ways, etc.

But most of this will be based on the death of the old fashion 9 to 5 job (as that is seen as freeloading even if you work really hard in those 8 hours, since what really counts is the "time at work" not what is produced, which today is a big fat zero, only status challenges and relationships, only money flows back and forth across all kinds of actors for any reasons at all, backed up by nothing at all).

I like the way the young kids think they are inventing something really cool and new in the "new startups", they know better, they are the future of the economy, so it was with google (but the old altavista was way better but designed by old farts, so that had to go), they now feel important (the old farts don't "understand" are "obsolete", "they can't keep up with technology, etc."), they buy into the idea of being the new economy, the new sectors, the new inventors, whatever. And they really believe it all, they don't know that they are being taken for a ride by the capitalists that have this all planned out, just to hose them all a few years down the line (except for the few super rich, which will be created on purpose, to feed the myth, to show that the system really works, that innovation creates winner, when it is all set up and a lie, but a lie that no one even knows how to challenge). And the cycle will repeat, creative destruction.

We need Rockets to Mars, Skyscrapers, Cheap Rents, Free Salaries and Hobby factories.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Mon Jun 06, 2011 2:21 pm

I read how at "Stanford", some kids wrote Facebook APPS and got rich, or something like that. This is a case where:

1) Money flows into places where rich people already are (how convenient, what ever happened to the poor slob in the garage that makes an APP making him rich ? not reading much of those (but the Apple APPS seem to have really produced some of these honestly through Free Work (Hobby Factories anyone ?))). But the powers that be will invent the Winners, they will invent them, they will be created "by design", by the powers that be, very subtly, without anyone ever noticing how it is rigged, so you can get really confused, what is the cause and what is the effect, is it a subtle "command language" (where the command to do something is hidden in what is said but you don't notice)?

2) You can't really tell how many "connections" (as in people connections, maybe someone telling the ad companies to pay those particular kids a lot more money, you know (who knows?)) there were between the ad companies bringing the kids "Millions" or if it was all so casual. This also by design, prove it that it wasn't the pure chance - luck and especially "skills" of the oh, so precious young kids inventing oh, so precious APPS for such an old fashion and boring sector that was once called advertisement, better known as TV commercials since the 1950s and in the last 50 years.

3) How to keep on feeding the myth, the kids invented something "new", they are in new "Venture Capital" Startup Land, all so new and cool and so important. But this also is all by design, is planned, there are probably many subtle connections behind the scenes, what is important is to feed the myth, put on the show, and let everyone believe it, see it works, if you design new APPS you will win big time, etc.

By the way, a whole lot of sectors are rigged, a whole lot of money flows occur "by design", it is hard to prove and pinpoint them down, but so it is. I guess they all need a spiritual and ethical justification for Inequality, there is a "good objective reason" why that guy has "more cash", "he deserved it", etc.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:15 pm

The deepest pain / pleasure ever is often mostly the imagined pain / pleasure of others (family ties, what happens to "loved" ones, etc.), strange as you can't touch what others feel or sense, it is a religion, you have to believe, it is a faith, a denotation, an indirection, a symbol, abstraction. And yet almost all we do is so strongly tied to others, their judgment, their assumed pain/pleasure that you are provoking (or you imagine provoked, and our own as reflected), in all senses and endeavors, that is why the debates, the communication, all of work - working for others, as others see and measure you and what you do just like you measure others, social interactions and transactions. Of course none of it is real, it is just strongly programmed in our mind to make believe that others are real, but you can unprogram this and be a simple robot like, and free from any measurements. And just force all you want, just your Free Will dominates all 100 %. Pretty hard, but not for modified minds. We "worship" others and their reactions to our communication, we are abstract - religious machines from the outset, automatically.

Others are so, so important, terrorists kill themselves for others, for an imaginary common world where we are all together (nothing further from the truth) and we waste man hours on end being all involved in debates and others, and so forth and so on. Nothing further from the truth, there is nothing, no one exists (and even if others exist, who cares ? why care ? why have this religion ? break all the rules, we are free), we are just a machine made up of independent parts that have been programmed to sense and communicate and assume others, strange but not so strange, animals use instincts. Anyways whatever, this must be deprogrammed real fast.

Anyways, more than a command language we have an assignment language, in the 1960s no one talked about innovation and competition as today, so all the talk is just subtly programming people and assigning how reality must be. All language ends up being a programming language, how societies are programmed.

Of course I want Rockets and Skyscrapers (they are all just artistic choices and preferences in the end as opposed to start ups and facebook) and China may be the ones really making these it seems, or at least I want more of these so as everyone gains in having a constructive acivity that adds up. But even my model is arbitrary, all models are just inventions, none is better than any others, so. All models are false and have zero value. I love to contradict myself.

Of course by criticizing other models and all it seems that I don't want to be "measured" and judged, you are right, and I want to measure and judge all according to my model, but being that all models are wrong or inventions, I just want my Will Power to dominate.

So they null themselves, the fight of models zero themselves.
Last edited by nameta9 on Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:19 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby Lucis Trust » Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:18 pm

I agree with everything you said 9, are you going to form your own political party, what's your plan, how do we go about robbing the rich, cheap rents, food that isn't overpriced, etc, fuck peak oil, i want the leisure the capitalists have coveted from us.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby Lucis Trust » Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:21 pm

Peak oil, overpopulation, resource depletion/scarcity, capitalism, libertarianism, fuck it, it's all the same shiite, an excuse for not giving me cheap, quality food and cheap, quality housing. 1% of the population, because of machines, do the important work of feeding us, because food is overpriced, we have to produce tremendous quantities of garbage to purchase this food, which the rich and middle class consume, it's fucking absurd, let's start a socialist revolution, but let's get it right this time, neh?
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby turtle » Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:32 pm

Lucis Trust wrote:Peak oil, overpopulation, resource depletion/scarcity, capitalism, libertarianism, fuck it, it's all the same shiite, an excuse for not giving me cheap, quality food and cheap, quality housing. 1% of the population, because of machines, do the important work of feeding us, because food is overpriced, we have to produce tremendous quantities of garbage to purchase this food, which the rich and middle class consume, it's fucking absurd, let's start a socialist revolution, but let's get it right this time, neh?

what problem do you have with the middle class....
will your socialist revolution be non-violent....
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby Lucis Trust » Mon Jun 06, 2011 5:40 pm

We're all in this together for the most part, middle and lower classes alike. Food is overpriced, because of machines and fossil fuels, it costs so little to feed us, yet we must spend so much to consume it. This forces us to work hard producing garbage we don't need to earn enough money to eat. We need cheap, quality food, this endless competition and production is pointless, our lives will always be a struggle, the rich want to kill us off instead, with their taxes, their cancer viruses, their chemtrails, their wars. We need a robin hood economy, we need a sophocratic party that will demand justice. It doesn't have to be violent, we'll use the democratic process. Nevermind nameta's nihilism. He identifies the problem but not the solution.

Nevermind socialism, though. What we need is something more... philosophical.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 7:58 am

You can think yourself into problems and out of problems, you can't think yourself into problems and you can't think yourself out of problems, etc. Thought is the problem, thought creates all kinds of fake problems, you just have to exist, no action and reaction, no feeling, no nothing, and all of your problems are solved, and in fact I prefer NOTHING from anything else, nothing is my friend, I prefer nothing. NOTHING is the answer. Isn't pyschoanalysis a method of trying "to think yourself out of problems" ? And the same way you think yourself into problems, just use the same path to think yourself out of problems (or any path will do, thought is just a path that thinks it is reaching targets and associates them to satisfaction, conclusions, feelings, whatever, but it is a process never reaching any (imaginary) target and never even starting or ending, just a process without any goal or any direction, a total failure and a clunker of a device: kill the device, KILL THOUGHT), after all just invert the direction, it is all just a sequence of symbols and meanings which are just denotations, abstractions, non existing. If thought creates the problem, then change thought. The structure of thought: modified minds will do away with thought, even though it seems so totalizing and the absolute reference system of all of our existence, but thought is just a one transistor circuit, a one bit universe: we need trillion bit universes and circuits.

Our mind creates problems because it creates targets, imaginary targets to reach, wants change, wants something different, but why want anything different ? Why assign something better or worse when reality is all the same, only how we are programmed creates the difference, but the program (how a configuration of Matter is associated to feelings, happiness or sadness, to achievement, to what others assign it as being and how they feel (although you can't ever really know or touch what they feel, and they may all be fake robots anyways, go figure)) is a quirk, arbitrary, is meaningless and has no value, only our hardwired pain/pleasure circuits give meanings to things, but that circuit is just a design, just one of a trillion possible designs: change the design and you have changed everything and can potentially achieve everything.

Think yourself into a new problem, and think yourself out of a problem. I prefer NOTHING.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 10:41 am

Uh, ooh spelling correction. Guess were the error was game again!

In the first paragraph of this thread.

"I am a bit like those ex-christians that believed, all of their lives in a kind of religion, a kind of objective, external reality, rules and models of reality shared and believed by everyone, or most, or anyways some kind of objective truth, rules that we should abide to, an aggregation and serialization of results (just like in religions, be good and you will be rewarded, etc.), but then discover it was all a lie, a huge deception, there is nothing only crap in people, outside of people and everywhere, no god exists, no nothing, the world is totally meaningless, has nothing to say to us and we have nothing to say to it, there is nothing that has to be communicated to us, no metaphysical or spiritual truth, no beauty, no value, a total void, zero, empty, undefined, barren, boring, no need for any communication, you simply live, life is a bitch, eat drink and be merry and then you die, end of story.

Only in my case I kind of believed in the Economy, the system, it progresses, Capitalism goes forward, it is for the better good, it defeated Communism, etc. Nothing further from the truth, no religion has ever been more false than this one.

Economy only exists in terms of people interacting and mostly fighting, it is a constantly unstable system and will be unstable forever, there is no aggregate value being produced, no lasting result only power struggles, some win, some lose, always changing and never really producing lasting collective results. Except in the form of technical advancements that optimize many processes and imply less labor needed, no matter what, this is probably the only real collective aggregated value being produce. We are producing "the end of labor" and "the end of labor needed" more than anything else, and this is in fact the great deception of Economy, as all of the economists want you to believe that it has rules that favor "society" or that well run economies generate "wealth for everyone and jobs" etc. "

on another note from:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/06/the-cr ... alism.html

Kunstler doesn't like tatoos, but that is just a "statement", someone wants to make a statement, wants to oppose something, but oppose especially a contrasting Will Power, another mind that is supposed to judge and be "critical" and contrast this. But the object generating the contrast is really not important, it is the fascination with the actual fact that Will Powers contrast that is interesting and always repeating, and the contrasting minds find interesting and obsessive and constantly intriguing: and the contrasting Will Powers will study and debate and analyze and all sorts of things over the object of the contrast, will be fascinated and studying this object, in this case the tatoos, forever, when the real fascination is only with the fact that contradictions exists, that we are always contradicting each other, and we are trying to study it away, we are trying to figure it out by studying the object of contention, when that is just a place holder, an excuse for that which really fascinates us forever and forces us to think and debate and contrast others: and namely that we are contradiction, fight, A against B, and this is Metaphysical in nature, cannot be thought away, cannot be analyzed away or studied or debated away, you can't think yourself out of the rigid prison of a universe that is contradictory in nature, where the real principle of the universe is the principle of contradiction, everything is itself and not itself simultaneously and not...

You can't think yourself out of problems no matter how hard you try. You can always think yourself out of any problem since all problems exist only within the reference system of thought itself (thought being a monolithic - totalizing slab). You can think yourself into all kinds of problems but you can't think yourself out of any problems. You can't think yourself into any problems, but you can think yourself out of all problems. How I love to contradict myself, now go on, contradict me, tell me I am wrong.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Tue Jun 07, 2011 1:22 pm

From:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/06/the-cr ... alism.html

Whatever happened to "Progress" ?

It used to be that people looked forward towards the future for better, improved, more possibilities, all kinds of possible improvements. And in fact the word "Scientist" was held in great respect, they were the high priests planning the future, bringing forth progress and a better future. Then, somewhere down the line, all kinds of reactionary Right Wing Thugs, Environmentalists who are so totally obsessed with that huge pile of crap they call "Nature" and so completely obsessed with that other boogie man called "overpopulation", capitalists and puny small businesses - entrepreneurs, and just plain dumb folks, ignorant, craps, you name it simply decided TO KILL THE FUTURE. And plan for a new dark ages, nay, a new stone age as Kunstler's World made by Hand (better known as Ape world of Man returning to Ape condition because he was a scaredy cat of the future, what total punks all of these people be!).

No more Rockets to Mars (we need trillions of these!), No more Skyscrapers (we need trillions of these! and remember to emphasize BIG numbers, to make a point, to make a statement, to make it clear that you are talking about BIG THINGS, change you can believe in BIG TIME), No more Cheap Rents and Free Salaries (we need trillions of these for thousands of trillions of people, all of them being Scientists and Technicians and Engineers, all of them with wildly Modified brains and Minds, and Mental Contraptions), No more Pride, Ambition, Goals, Collective Goals, Unity of Intent, MIND OVER MATTER, Super Consumption (to KILL AND DEMOLISH ALL AND EVERY POSSIBLE TRACE OF NATURE!) a kind of Super Nationalism, adoration and Worship for the Symbol and Symbols, (and of each of these we need trillions of these and as Intensity goes trillions of times more intense than the puny intensity of everyday life), etc.

On this website and so, so many others there is this huge constant thread of Overpopulation, we are "Too Many", and all kinds of Racisms, We against them, etc. On overpopulation, there is nothing further from the truth, we can host thousands of trillions if the greens and tree huggers and environmentalists weren't such selfish - egotistical slobs that want to hog it all up for themselves, not even noticing how selfish - egotistical and criminal they really are, all along thinking that they are right and correct and good, etc. What morons! the whole deal of overpopulation is a subtle device the rich and capitalists imposed to get a war going between poor people, to create resource "contention" when in fact there are no resource contentions, only rich and ruling class and capitalists that have set things up by design, that have planned this war between people from the outset, but everyone keeps on buying into overpopulation, there is not enough for everyone, etc.

And if people misbehave, they will be programmed accordingly, they will have some of their neural circuits changed (by computers, not by Man as Man is not reliable, too much of a slave to impulses and his Free Will and his never ending internal contradictions, unsatisfactions, confusions) and we must decompose that entity called Free Will in people so as people no longer contrast and fight each other. They become one unit, one monolithic block of Matter Saturating the Entire Universe with the "Power of Symbol Over Matter", "Symbol Over the Laws of Physics"...

Now go little Ryan, go on little Betty, copy this all and bring it to your teacher, another A+ and GOLD star, go on San Jose Mommy, check it out, bring it to your Boss (or your husbands, or whoever supports you), you will get another raise, they will like it a lot, finally some direction in a world that has lost all possible directions.

And check out this Mental Contraption that fell from the Sun in Betty and Ryan's backyard:

QII(//WII(//WOOO///////&&GJJJHKKK/////TTELLELLL=======

Whaow, what on earth is going on in there, honey bunch ? Wowo, that is really far out, I see all kinds of Mass to Thought converters, Aggregators to disaggregators, units to independence limit machines, wow, so much to discover and play around with. Betty and Ryan are going to have a ball today!

Quo Vadis ? baby ...
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Wed Jun 08, 2011 8:55 am

From:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/06/the-cr ... alism.html

From Slut:

"In my own hippie youth, we dyed our hair purple and walked around in sheer blouses with no bras, and painted fake flower tattoos on our hands, but we did all this with the idea that it would be very transient"

I answer:

Wow, you almost gave me a boner. The last time I almost got a boner was more than 10 years ago, thanks a lot bitch. Now go on, tell me that I am Impotent, let me crush myself, make fun of me, like all ladies, it is implied, they crush and make fun of it and exploit the fact that I am Impotent, and in all sectors and endeavors, psychological, etc. the prettier and younger the lady the more I would like to punch them in the face, it is a constant provocation, the fact that they exist, etc. a total failure, go on, rub it in, go on, I will torture myself ever more, ever more contrasting Will Powers.

At least they could lie, make believe, pretend: I don't know why telling the truth or not lying or being honest is such a value, we need lies and deceptions more than anything else, I always lie, everything I said and ever said is a total 100 % lie, and even the opposite of what I ever said is a total 100% lie. Everything should be a total lie, we are always lied to anyways and deceived, lie ever more, make believe, pretend, at least make me fool myself: oh, no they have to be honest, instead of just giving in and making believe, what crap. And then the very essence of life is that it is a lie, Matter lying to Itself and pretending to be alive, go figure.

Anyways, I can't even keep on staying alive, every heartbeat is a miracle and gift, I can't even even be sure I can continue to exist, I am weak, maybe I should get some "Health Kare" if it didn't suck so much in the USA. Anyways all of life is a constant extreme struggle just to keep on living, life is an extreme instability, is a bad invention and a bad design. The transition from death to life and living must be made with new devices, not with this way too fragile and crappy and badly designed machine that Man is. And by using a new design, you can create a much better experience, a better lie and make believe world, since all of life is a lie and make believe world that just uses pain to make believe that it is real. But the new devices will do away with pain and create "Constant Winning Machines".

But we are in the most extreme paradise ever, every moment of life is an absolute miracle because you are not in infinite pain, there is no reason why it shouldn't be infinite pain, god or the laws of physics were good this time around (a godless universe would be even more terrifying), we should be in Constant Infinite Pain, Total Metaphysical Insecurity, but everything is an absolute miracle, beyond anything you can ever hope for (I wrote something about this in the ilovephilosophy website, look it up slut and study it). Aside from the fact that everything is an absolute INFINITE miracle because it simply exists, beyond anything you can conceive, we live in constant total absolute infinite and extreme miracles constantly.

Maybe nature just creates causes and effects, just invents them by association, it connects two independent events just for the fun of it, repeats the connection and decides to make it become a cause and effect. And then maybe hoses it again after repeating the pattern a number of times, who knows.


Money as a Weapon

The entire structure of Capitalism is based on the accumulation of Money by those actors that can get a profit from their enterprises. Since the Technological Economy can generate such huge economies of scale, also brought to you by that maybe one time free gift of free energy of oil (but I am not so sure if it is really oil or technology or a mix of both, this is a technical question, maybe some good technicians here can tell how much of this free gift is tech and how much oil) it generates Free Wealth by the boatloads by automating and optimizing agriculture, factories, all kinds of technological applications to the production process making it easier and cheaper to produce all kinds of goods and especially getting rid of the need for labor by the boatloads, it generates a huge amount of accumulated cash in banks worldwide, a huge amount of money that is constantly increasing.

Now this money itself must generate more money in terms of "return", in terms of "more profits", in terms of "return on investment". Why is this ? For no reason at all, just because, just for the fun of it, just because people who have the money in banks expect to get ever more free wealth (as if the free wealth they already got is not enough, but that is never enough). So how can they get even more ?

By lending the money with interest to other people, but especially poor, weak and easily influenced, brainwashed people. And people with salaries that aren't high enough to just go out and buy most of the things they need or want (the capitalists also like to confuse needs and wants a lot).

They create a never ending impulse of desires in the working class, the poor, you must "buy a new house" (and the game of always increasing the price of real estate nicely fits in, as in more and higher debts, and the ever increasing price of real estate worldwide reflects the ever increasing amount of profit money available and being constantly generated) as that is the "American Dream" (actually the worldwide dream today), you must buy the new car, you must do this and that, etc. Of course these desires are based on the fact that people are set up for unsatisfaction naturally, life is instablity, unsatisfaction, you always want something else, something more, you are constantly creating targets in your mind, you must win, etc. But by creating these desires, the system forces people to get loans and ever more loans for desires that potentially can never end. And the capitalists are all too glad to give people these loans, ever more, so that eventually they can crush them, they can hose them, and that is what they do. So desires, loans, consumption, repeat the cycles, etc. Like a poker player that is being taken for a ride, they let you win, but in the end they will hose you.

And that is how huge debts are created, subprime loans, huge public debts in Greece and entire countries, etc. There is also a factor that public debts are created because there is no way so many millions of people can be employed in "productive jobs" since there is no need for any more jobs, so governments just have to hire them and support them even if they do nothing at all, debts like this are created in Europe, JAPAN and even the USA, anyways.

But the money is there, huge amounts of money is available because the system generates enough wealth to support millions on essentially free salaries anyways.

But now that everyone is in debts, now that entire nations are under the thumbs of the capitalists and rich, they can crush them and torture them and take away as much money from them as possible, with the excuse that they "have debts to pay back". So this is how money is used as a weapon to beat up people, as a baseball bat to clobber people.

And this is the essential contradiction of a Technological Economy governed by capitalism: it generates huge amounts of free wealth, it could support everyone on free salaries more or less, but the free wealth is used to crush the weak, to beat them up. And they do this by explaining it and justifying it as a "natural order of things"; as the "economy is a science", is the "way it is supposed to be", all of the economists buy into this make believe fairy tale Macro Economic Model, as if it were a law of physics, and everyone is brainwashed that this is the only possible way an economy can work, after all "Communism Failed", etc.

Wow, look at what I found in my backyard this morning little Betty and Cindy:

WKKKRJ&/&(RRJJR&(/(TJTJTJJ&(&(/(JKTJTJJT

Go for it little girls, figure it out, it came for that Huge Supercomputer that the Sun is, always generating new brain - mind - universe perceived structures.

Now go on, little Betty and Cindy, draw a new block diagram of a new brain and mind structure, wow, that block diagram is a trillion pages long, so many incredible new symbols in there, so many new equations and wires and connections, wow, that is doing really interesting things. A new brain that is experiencing a new universe all brought to you by little Betty and Cindy, so many different relationships, memory structures tied into photons tied into sentimental generators, a never ending array and list of incredible new connections, wild symbols, intricate designs and pictures and on and on forever, for a trillion pages.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Wed Jun 08, 2011 11:46 am

"There is also a factor that public debts are created because there is no way so many millions of people can be employed in "productive jobs" since there is no need for any more jobs, so governments just have to hire them and support them even if they do nothing at all, debts like this are created in Europe, JAPAN and even the USA, anyways."

And this is a very important point: since you really can't provide, find or invent enough real productive labor for millions worldwide since it is not needed structurally (and make no mistake, no nation can provide all the millions of jobs of real productive labor needed, no matter how much they grow or how advanced they are) you are forced to create them, you have to simply support people, very often through the government, or through a lot of indirections, but it always ends up being mostly government (or defense or health care, etc.), sometimes privates, sometimes banks, whatever. This is another of those huge deceptions that they never tell you: the system must give out free salaries anyways (albeit hidden) as it can't provide enough real jobs as those jobs are not needed, people are "excess capacity".

So what are you going to do ? fire them all ? there is a limit to how many you can fire without an economy collapsing. So the governments and others support people, but then there is this constant background hum, oh, you are "not productive", you are not "innovative", you are not "performing", or whatever, a constant hum, as if it is understood that the workers are always "robbing the money" (like it is not the other way around, corporations and rich and capitalists have been looting trillions upon trillions for decades).

And then the various economic think tanks (FED, World Bank, IMF, you name it) all turn around and create the great guilt game, too many debts, cut costs, the economies are not competitive enough, they are not productive enough, all the European nations should hose and fire their all so "bloated" public sector, etc. The think tanks know that there is no alternative but to keep such large public sectors since there is no real possibility that the "invisible hand" and the market can really create an equivalent number of jobs since the private sector needs those workers like a hole in the head (and in fact the private sectors are doing and will do everything to get rid of as many workers as possible from their corporations to increase profits, cut costs, optimize and innovate their processes) but they (think tanks and all the economists) turn around and say, shame on you keeping all those worthless "freeloaders", you got to pay back the debts, etc.

As if they are afraid to tell people the truth because they think people couldn't wrap their heads around it psychologically and would become all "lazy" and not do anything anymore since now they know that labor is no longer needed. But the truth is, most people worldwide need to be idle like a hole in the head, would love to work and even more work, most people want activity, meanings, etc.

Therefore for this we need Hobby Factories where they can come in for an hour or even 12 hours if they want and help build houses, cars, boats, Rockets to Mars, Skyscrapers, you name it. And Cheap Rents and Free Salaries and a total BUS system across all of the world (especially the USA that totally lacks mass transit (which could even be somewhat privately managed, no problem with that)) and all of those things I already told you.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Wed Jun 08, 2011 12:57 pm

"As if they are afraid to tell people the truth because they think people couldn't wrap their heads around it psychologically and would become all "lazy" and not do anything anymore since now they know that labor is no longer needed. But the truth is, most people worldwide need to be idle like a hole in the head, would love to work and even more work, most people want activity, meanings, etc."

People would like to work but not fight. But the system is set up, in part by design and part structurally to make people fight more than work, simply because in most environments the only way to occupy time not needed at work (since technology and advances have eliminated the need for the "8 hour a day job" for years now, it should have been two hours by now!) is to create conflicts and fights (therefore producing nothing (but nothing really needs to be produced anyways) but time passed, "time wasted" (wasted for what ? another strange problem)) or (as the confusion between a command language and an assignment language)* in order to create work you have to create conflicts, fights, conflicting decisions, confusion, etc.

People would like work, activity, meanings but not fights, and so much work today has evaporated into fights, contrasts, challenges, work against other people and not for the task - an objective task at hand - where there is common ground, as in "if you are not fighting matter you are fighting people". But this is also by design, the powers that be want to brainwash everyone that they are "lazy" and don't want to "work" when most people don't want to "have to fight constantly against other people"; don't want the "conflicts". But the corporations, the system, the brainwashing and so many other subtle items create a lot of conflicts and little real work, a lot of fights and little real production.

Another result of EXCESS CAPACITY and Free Wealth generated but hidden behind masks, like jobs consisting mostly of conflicts, hire and fire, constant changes, you name it.

But the very fact that there is so much work not producing nothing, so many "bloated" sectors like public workers, health care, defense, etc. and especially so many debts is a real reflection of the wealth that is generated freely, like the debts: that is extra money hanging around and was borrowed out, but the extra money was generated by EXCESS CAPACITY in the first place, and no one ever asks themselves if maybe all of those trillions of dollars of extra money in banks couldn't have been used for something better. And no one even knows how much there is, 100 trillion or 500 trillion ?


*

- a "command language" is when natural language is used to subtly tell you what you have to do without you noticing it like "cut costs", "the public sector is bloated";

- an "assignment language" is when natural language is used to subtly tell you what reality is "the economy is growing", "unemployment is down", "productivity is increasing".

Most of these concepts are so vague, so general, so fluffy that it is hard to really pinpoint down what they are talking about, but this is also by design, no one even knows what it all means, let alone challenges any of it.
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Wed Jun 08, 2011 1:39 pm

From:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/06/the-cr ... alism.html

But not to worry little Betty and Ryan, little Cindy, we will overcome this old fashioned and expired generation, let them go back to their Planet of the Apes: we will go forward, we will Split the Sun and gain so much energy, nay, Split the Stars, split black holes, we will create trillions of skyscrapers from the core of Mars, from the core of the Sun to alpha Centauri, go for it, little girl, you can do it, go man go. They are jumping up and down, having so much fun, go for it !

Split all of the Stars man, go man, go!

leave your San Jose Mommy and Laura and all those old fashioned ladies to grow that crap in their gardens, I will take you far away.

Pat says:

"You do not need to give free houses or free anything, the moment people can have a job, make a living, paying the taxes and being happy..."

I answer:

Patrizia just doesn't get it: A TECHNOLOGICAL ECONOMY PRODUCES WAY MORE THAN ENOUGH WITH VERY LITTLE NEED FOR LABOR INPUT. END OF STORY.

Do you get it now ? Do you understand ? The entire worldwide economy could operate with probably a few million workers, working seriously, efficiently and with rational, well thought out work processes, robots and software, etc. But people can't wrap their heads around the idea that "they are not needed" for the "economy", they are EXCESS CAPACITY. Therefore we need Rockets to Mars, Trillions of Skyscrapers, and Hobby Factories hiring millions to work as if it were a hobby and fun, which it should be.

What is it with the ladies on this Blog ?!?!
nameta9
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Posts: 1888
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Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby nameta9 » Fri Jun 10, 2011 2:06 pm

From:

http://kunstler.com/blog/2011/06/the-cr ... alism.html

Racism on JHK's Blog...

Now, get this, vlad, and most of all you other "rascists":

"We're 60% the same as bananas.
Humans have about 30,000 genes. (which sounds like a lot, until you discover that chickens have about 23,000 and an ear of corn has 59,000!)
Our genetic code is also similar to other life forms. For example, we're 90% identical to most mammals. But between two humans, there's only 0.01% difference. So this means that your brother (or dad) is 99.9% the same as Albert Einstein!
We're also 70% the same (genetically) as slugs and 98.5% the same as chimps! :)"

Why are you all so obsessed with race, black and white, Indian or Asian or whatever ? How is it that you really think that something so insignificant as race or culture can mean anything at all in the greater scheme of things ?

People are simply puny machines, totally idiotic - repetitive - completely - one transistor circuit machines: there is no difference between a banana and a person so how on earth can anything else even count ?

Because you are all obsessed with justifying yourselves as superior, deserving more, as being "not equal" to some other slob, you need some kind of invented metaphysical justification to simply assign yourselves as better, deserving, more "intelligent", more anything (when all of these categories are a total joke in the greater scheme of things). So then you can freely and with great thrust and with great satisfaction hog everything up, hate on others, beat them up, you are finally free to hate and kill and make war against all others you arbitrarily assign as "inferior".

But most of all, you think that a simple information relationship, a sequence of symbols, a small difference that is amplified way beyond any logic or common sense is the key to all, a concept, an idea, a thought pattern that obsesses and concentrates all of the explanations, that is supposed to be the organizing principle of all (blacks suck) is supposed to give you comfort, is supposed to finally explain all.

What a puny mind you all have, there is nothing, no differences, people, all of them, any race suck deeply, are total turds, given enough power would crush and kill anyone or anything, people are bad machines, the christians got this right, (probably the only thing they ever got right) "we are all sinners", there is no limit to how bad people are and can be given the circumstances (Instinct against Civilization finally breaking the chains of "logic").

But most of all, this obsession on a word, a concept, a difference just shows how you all desperately need a simple cause and effect explanation of people and the world, a simple linearity, a simple concept, since you can't wrap your heads around the fact that people are pure contradiction, end of story, it is always just A against B for anything at all, a pure fight, a pure contrast of Will Powers, this is all, there is no deeper explanation, no metaphysical justification, no symbol, no meaning, no me better than you, no white better than black.

Aside from the fact that said blacks or Asians or whatever will then subtly end up behaving as they are imagined that they should behave, so rascism is also a subtle command language, blacks are violent then they end up being violent since society just brainwashed them to be like this and they just let themselves be programmed accordingly, but that is another story.

Anyways, strange that this race thing is so deeply felt right in the USA, country of immigrants and all, the melting pot, incredible!

Just all go fly a kite rascists on this Blog, go blow, you get the message...
nameta9
Philosopher
 
Posts: 1888
Joined: Thu Nov 25, 2004 10:42 am

Re: Economy Misunderstood

Postby malex » Fri Jun 10, 2011 11:55 pm

All this typing.

All the words, the sentences, all the intended meaning, just all of it. All the introspection, the research, the knowledge.

And all you're really seeing, all you're really showing us, is your own cynicism and pessimism.
malex
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jun 10, 2011 8:22 am


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