Always start with..."the manifest"

Philosophy Forums Philosophy
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When discerning or at least coming up with a good possibility of the true nature of existence, the best starting point is yourself. That is, look at yourself and what you truly are, disposing (for the moment) of all your conditioned or accepted ideas about the nature of existence and your guesses, let’s face it, regarding the nature of the external world.

When you do that, existence immediately appears and presents itself in the form of you—a “first person POV camera” that is, right now, experiencing something in sensory, thought, or emotional form.

That’s your starting point, your true “square one” which you can always jump back to when things get complicated, or when you start to accept the existence, and treat it as if it is as real as you, of something or things not composed of the same thing you are: subjective experience.

Begin, then, with the simple observation that you are an experience. From this “Existence 101” observation you can probably deduce, using yourself and the substance of which you can immediately see you are composed (subjective experience) that the experience that is you and that forms you had to derive from the external world, if experience is not something that did not exist before it is magically conjured by the brain (for, where is an experience before it is experienced?)

If you deny that experience is something that does not exist that is then inexplicably and magically caused to exist without use of something that already exists to create it (and magically and inexplicably stops existing when the brain ceases to function)…

…you can probably surmise experience exists in and hails from the external world, and in the absence of the ability of non-existent things to come into existence and vice versa, is probably (in terms of experience qua experience as opposed to types of experience) eternal.

Phenomenal Graffiti

Pantheopsychic Theist and Philosopher

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Meaningful definition of existence?
Dreams are experiences – “from the external world”?

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Better from subjective experience pre-existing in the external world than magically conjured from previous, total non-existence.

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Are You sure? What is magic? There is no doubt that the proof for subjective existence or the question of where it originates is almost mute by definition, even if existence is defined by certain signs, as when existence is awareness, or becoming aware of objective signs of recognition of other awareness.

But that failing , refutes a definitive identity. and an indefinite identity is nothing to hang your hat on.

It was magic that allowed a nomination like Descarte to turn it into possible machinations of an ‘evil genious’ and thus certainty coincides with your call to reduce every existential phenomenal symbol to be reduced to a sign.

That sign and it’s negation, empowered the reevaluation as a signal to inquire into the pre-existential nominal contradiction to be unable to be de-signed on architecture that a only digitalisatiin would allow.

For that reason, the basic premise needs to be supported by meta magically developed formal logic.

This may look like intuitively contrived processing, and I am not suggesting some other way Jesus may become manifest in the new global environment, but the suggestion is compelling.

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Magic as I use it is creation independent of the use of pre-existing material, or the brute transformation of an essence into its exact opposite.

For example, once again: always start with the manifest: subjective experience or the fact or act of experiencing. There is no logic in saying that experience is something that does not exist that something (re: the brain) caused to exist without the use of pre-existing subjective experience. The negative condition of this magic is godless or atheistic view of death: subjectie experience as something that exists that can cease altogether to exist upon cessation of function of something that itself, is not composed of subjective experience.

One should hang one’s hat on the manifest, subjective experience, because it is the only thing that demonstrates it exists.

Everything else is a figment of the imagination composed of…you guessed it…subjective experience.

PG

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Immanence without transcending whatever appears like preconceived .

But what is preconceived is everything that imminance is not like any memory of what appeared before conception of dubjectove material. Any memory is just that.

How far and long ago?

From just a moment to all the way back.

When conception happened when the subject was born, that subject is nil. ,a supposed blank slated blank and defenseless.

The first indication of a non worktable other.

Dependent on mother, at first. That subject is nil for not a defense.

Unless the other are parents of other o thers, that are within the essence of that contradiction, not dependent, and a spark of something that never was but always will be.

Be G ore the before could begin the begin.

This void that is all.

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Not sure what you’re saying here, but it is not necessary for consciousness to cease to exist or be non-existent before birth: it is also possible it exists in a not-yet-that-person form of eternal consciousness, even if that pre-birth consciousness is that of an entirely different person, or some individual’s perception of an object, or whatever.

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Not sure either of necessity between being conscious or even being conscious of that necessity, or even being conscious of any reason why it could become unnecessary.

Something leads on or, draws it out of that complacency.

(Why, and How, though are primordial bits, suppose)

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I see thread title, I think Bill Gates, behind the vaccine, is on Epstein’s manifest…didn’t kill himself.

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On the other hand, I also think love is not love without demonstration. (Jesus)

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Praying Gates turns his focus to Jesus & ends the madness.

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How did you get to know about yourself what you have been conditioned to accept and what is actually true? I am too emotionally attached to myself to ever get there.

But what about the body? Are you saying experience causes it instead of the opposite which is what people most of the time say?

I think this is why I dont like philosophy. :frowning: :frowning:

Life is much better if you don’t talk about “what it is”.

:cry: :cry:

if you deny that experience is something that does not exist??

Freak me out some more will ya.

Theism is belief in God and God is objective so you deny yourself!! I badly want coffee but I know I shouldn’t after reading this.

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Destiny:

To answer your questions:

Just through observation of “the manifest” or what is right in front of us, I suppose. The most manifest aspect of “what is” is that I am a “POV” that has experiences, leading to the observation that I am an experience, which is the most obvious nature of my existence (and by inferential extension, any conscious being).

Everything that is not “the manifest” (the only thing that demonstrates that it actually exists is experience) is make-believe, so any “body” not made up of subjective experience is make-believe, and may not exist. Although many swear up and down it does, despite the fact that existence only appears in the form of a person and that which the person experiences.

For some, I suppose. I can only speak for myself but I suspect many if not all philosophers on this site would be crawling the walls in sheer mental torment if we just “let go” and stopped wondering “what is”.

Believe me, when it comes to the irrational belief the brain creates consciousness, a lot of people believe that experience is something that does not exist that must be magically conjured into existence.

If God exists it is likely he is an experience like the rest of us (otherwise he would truly be “objective” in the sense of being an object :slight_smile:)

Coffee doesn’t seem to have the effect it used to, which is bad for me as I am a security officer.

PG