An Exploration of Kant's Aesthetics of Music

A brief overview: Before we begin our exploration of the aesthetics of music, it is important to understand the distinction that Kant draws between agreeable art and fine art. Agreeable art is something man-(formed)created that produces pleasure in an individual through the apprehension of sensations. Agreeable art can be beautiful, tasteful, and even, purposeful (Kant gives the example of preparing a dinner banquet as an agreeable art, for, Kant observes, it is arranged purposefully to affect the guests with the delight of the arrangement, the delight of the music, the conversation, laughter, etc., and all of which, are the play of a confluence of pleasurable sensations). Fine art, on the other hand, can have all of the qualities of agreeable art, but has the crucial distinction of producing an idea for reflection and ultimately leading toward an understanding of that particular idea/concept. In the category of fine art, Kant points our attention toward poetry, which, through its play, or manipulation, of pleasurable or displeasruable sensations (imagery), poetry elevates our awareness toward a concept/idea–hence, toward the category of the Understanding in Kant’s paradigm of human consciousness; whereas, agreeable art, only penetrates the imagination and body in the Kantian paradigm.

With that distinction in mind, let us begin to explore music. Abstract music that is, without lyrics; for lyrics, according to Kant, would be a confluence of music and poetry.

“Music,” writes Kant in the Critique of Judgement sec., 53., “advances from sensations to indefinite ideas […]”, which in Kant’s “Comparative Estimate of The Aesthetic Worth of The Fine Arts,” (emphasis mine), is placed below the catagorically different fine arts such as poetry and painting. (Music for Kant is an agreeable art.) What I want to consider, is Kant’s claim that music leads toward indefinite ideas. Music, is certainly a formative art, driven by ideas, Kant asserts so himself, but, it does not lead the individual listening to music toward a definitive, universal idea. Or does it? Can it?

Can, for instance, a title of a piece of music in conjunction with the actual music, lead toward a definitive concept? I understand that we are probably violating Kant’s distinction between music and poetry in the combination of a linguistic object with the sensual perceptions of sound, but, I wonder, if perhaps complete linguistic restriction during interpretation is going too far? A title, after all, sets up the context; further, a title, is certainly not ignored when interpreting a painting–(I am not sure what Kant’s position would be on a painting’s title)–unless preforming a phenomenological reduction (but, to simplify, I am going to leave out the phenomenologists from this discussion–although anyone should feel free to employ phenomenological methods if they believe they can demonstrate an apodictic result).

Let’s recap. A musical title, such as for example “Central Park in the Dark,” by Ives, with the conjunction of the actual piece of music, can, I ask, lead toward an elucidation of a universal idea or concept (not–this is critical–feeling or emotion)? Perhaps, my question fundamentally is about the epistemology of musical theory. Is musical theory possible? Has it been done–that is, an interpretive, critical analysis of ideas embodied in music–and if it hasn’t, can it be done? Or is it, as Kant claims, simply the play of sensations (playing within the body and the imagination, never generating anything in the Understanding? Can an example against Kant be provided? A theory postulated?

I should add that the same questions, as some of you may have picked up on, can also be directed toward abstract art.

(Note: I am unfamiliar with musical theory, so I hope to see someone who is, provide some input, as well as, any musicians, composers, or, yes, oy, err, philosophers.)

Looking forward to your responses,
Andre

Andre, I think music is relative to the harmonics and acrobatics of brain-wave frequencies. It is moreso an energy than a specific concept. A song without words can be interporated and felt by anyone of any language. It is instinctive.

think mathematics…

that’s all music is…

-Imp

Dan,

I am not asking what music is, rather: What can music generate within consciousness? You wrote, “A song without words can be interporated and felt by anyone of any language.”, feeling, as I specified in the original post, is not of interest to us. Interpretation, on the other hand, is exactly what we are considering, but, the question is one of possibility: Is deductive analysis possible? If it is, as you claim, please provide some, or theortically prove it. At least, provide an example.

Imp,

What you are saying is comparable to saying, in a discussion of poetry, “think meter… that’s all poetry is…”.

Kant asserts himself, and I, too, in the above post, that music is a formative art. Music, however, unlike poetry, literature, painting, does not generate any traceable progress in culture, because, as Kant claims, music never penetrates the Understanding.

confuzzilingly,
Andre

There’s been various lab-tests – about the physical effects of various sounds and frequencies. Interporatation is mostly a visual conceptualization. Interporatation of the sort you speak of, is finite and it can fail.

having heard neither, kant never understood the difference between blues and jazz

traceable progress? tell that to all the blues musicians from whom elvis and the beatles stole.

-Imp

Dan,

I understand, as did Kant, that music functions on a physical level (as well as a temporal and spacial one); Kant talks, for instance, about music and the body. I should have clarified however, that Kant draws a catagorical distinction between the Imagination and the Understanding (it is only in the catagories of the Imagination, for example, that visual semblances occur, but, very significantly, universal deductions cannot be drawn from them, as they would be based on pure subjectivity). The Understanding comes into play after a temporal delay, through reflection, attempting to make sense of the Sublime.

Personally, I’ve been mulling it all over in my head today, and I am still not entirly convinced that Kant is correct, though I’m leaning that he is; still . . . I would love to come up, or have someone here come up, with an example to contest the claim.

No interpretation (spelling) Dan, is ever ineluctable, but the claim here is that it is absolutly, necessarily, impossible–hence, music is on a lower hierarchal plane than poetry, literature, and painting, of less value. (If Kant is correct.)

Imp,

That’s exactly what I am talking about. Something seems wrong here. But how do we formalize it? How would we take a piece of Jazz music, or blues, and say, Ah, there, look! The music is about freedom, sex, movement, longing, passion, despair, hope, or any other such Idea. How do we formulate the argument? How would you? Could you give an example?

Did someone underestimate how many brain-regious of sentience we have here? There are many, many forms of “understanding”, which are various formats of inter-relation. But I think you’re moving towards codifying and conceptually seporating a whole organ into tiny parts…

Dan,

Sure, there are many regions of sentience. It is not I who is “codifying and conceptually separating”, but Kant; I am simply working within his framework of consciousness. In this discussion, I would like to explore only though that framework (this does not translate that I necessarily accept the framework).

Certainly, now that you have me drifting along this wave of thought, we probably ought to question Kant’s (hidden) meta-hierarchy; his placing of The Understanding above The Imagination, and also, the internal structure of the hierarchy: The Imagination as only a means toward The Understanding.

However, it seems rational, considering that Kant’s Understanding can be linguistically traced. Of course, there are still plenty of problems even with that statement considering the postmodernists, but at the least there is a problem to consider, whereas with all other “Understanding”, such as, intuitions, as they cannot be objectified (except through Kant’s Understanding), are of no universal value.

Here I hear someone yell: “Great! We are alone, and can only depend on subjectivity for truth. Welcome to our contemporary state of perpetual individualism–even, solipsism.” I respond, “You’ve Understood.”

Andre

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elvis’ hips…

animalistic drum beats work because humans are animals…

audibile rythyms…

formalized? when I get in that groove, it sounds like and reminds me of being in this other groove… what do the words “rock and roll” mean?

-Imp

Agreeable art.

no, not agreeable… more base than that… it is the continuation of the species…

-Imp

Imp,

So you are taking music further than even Kant down the ladder of aesthetic judgement. From Kant’s point of view, of course, without contradiction to what you say, music still operates as an agreeable art – debase of culture: beautifully, abstractly, formatively, primitive.

This for me is quite disheartening. I really hoped to appease my stubborn sun with a rational justification, but for the moment, it seems that it cannot be. And the existentialists roar in my mind: the subject, the subject, the subject: “Truth as subjectivity.”

Tis blatantly annoying…

Well, guess I’ll have to resort to subverting his meta-hierarchy. (Judgement over intuition). I’m not proud.

Waving goodbye to the crystal palace,
I skip back to the underground…
Andre

just remember, anything can be justified…

-Imp

I think what Kant would have called “Fine” I’d describe as cerebral, or satisfactory on a level of cerebral criterion. What he defined as “agreeable”, I’d substitue with the word “visceral”, and perhaps this is what Impenitent meant?

I have no personal difficulty with Kant’s distinction, having been a musician for several years. Classical music might inpire with awe and wonder, but it doesn’t always have the power to make thousands of people moves like chunky dance beats (which, to me, aren’t any less “intelligent” or fine than Bach’s offerings).