It is said ‘as above so below’, so how would that translate in real terms. Lets imagine that this world unfurls – so to say, into the otherworld/heaven/eternity in a continuous stream. In some sense it would necessarily be like that given that when we die we enter it, no?
To simplify the whole thing, lets imagine that the otherworld is like a road [possibly to eternity, hence there is usually an ‘underworld’ or intermediate realm, in most religions]. This road goes to all places and yes to Rome too, ancient Rome.
So if this road rolls out like a carpet – lets imagine, if you walk down it, you would be going back in time, walk forwards and you would be in the ‘now’ moment [moving forwards in time] ~ correlating perhaps with ‘below’?
Is that where the time goes? i.e. history. Perhaps this is how reality processes [for want of a better term?] or resolves itself into the infinite and eternal? …as eventually the road through all-time would reach beyond the birth of the universe, and join infinity there?
As above, so below is the the maxim of Hermatics in the west, though the same concept is present in Islam and much before all these in the Vedas in Hinduism.
It menas that whatever happens above (in the haven) repeats here too. It also says that borh worlds are somehow associated with each other.
Secondly, for more clarification, repeating does not mean that whatever happens there had to repeat here in toto, and vice-verse.
Repeating is a metaphor for giving direction or guidance.
It simply means that as our ideas conflict (the “angels”), we will conflict, the people, because our ideas tempt our actions. Heaven and Hell are separated by whether the ideas are harmonious (Heaven) or conflicting (Hell). Satan is the primary idea for how to manage conflicting ideas. Harmonious ideas need no management fore they are in harmony with their situation, with reality, “with God”.
Both words “heaven” and “nirvana” carry with them baggage of connotations and implications. Scriptures reflect the implications of the authors and are often a bit conflicting and conflating. They never used precise language.
Nirvana strongly implies a state of blissful joy, as does Heaven. What neither indicates is the necessity of harmonious motion required for physical existence. Plato’s divine forms, the realm of perfect concepts and souls, can be referred to as a “heaven” wherein there is no conflict. But that is because there is no change or motion, merely relative existence, “perfect peace” and perfect stillness, no actual life.
A state of perfect stillness is not tolerable on Earth, nor physically permitted. It cannot protect itself and is a feeding ground for random, very disharmonious uprising. Ultimate “peace” can never exist on Earth for long. But if, rather than ultimate peace, ultimate harmony is established, it cannot be removed from Earth.
Peace and harmony tend to be thrown together as if they are the same thing. They are not and they bring the extreme opposite of results, except that joyous life can exist and persist in ultimate harmony.
I don’t think they ever made that critical distinction in any scriptures (certainly left it out of the Bible). It seems that they even had a word for it. Perhaps the Chinese had such a word related to Chi in ultimate motion. They, like the French, seem to have a different word for every nuance of every thing.
So realistically, if Heaven is to be had, it is to be defined by “ultimate joyous harmony”, not “blissful peace”.
But form is conflict? Its all one thing pushing upon another, forging themselves out of the process.
Hmm interesting point.
I could visualise a non-object i.e. mental or consciousness based world [and thats what i’ve seen too], and I equally think the universe isn’t composed of objects i.e. is not physical in that sense.
Then it becomes more about what kinds of minds can coexist in harmony. I think that our anxieties all derive from things of the world, and without the world the essential tensions simply wouldn’t be there.
course, the conversation has to be up to scratch.
I can imagine the otherworld to be a bunch of ‘clubs’/mental-realms.
“Pushing”??? Two squares side by side are “pushing” each other?
Physical forms, not divine but mortal, can be said to be “pushing”, but even that isn’t entirely accurate.
Minds that share an essential coherent understanding of their purpose.
Basically “above” refers to the ideal organization. And “below” refers to mortal life. The idea is to get them in sync.
They are ideas, but reality is formed ~ is what I meant. Real objects in the world are formed ~ forges, and we don’t know if the idea of say a cube exists prior to the object. I would think that the object is arrived at first, then humans give such objects names and they then become conceptual objects.
…but that’s this world, the otherworld appears to be composed of mental objects, primarily orb consciousnesses in the ‘intermediate state’/underworld. I don’t know anything beyond that.
I take your point though, that the otherworld isn’t forged like this world. That’s where it gets interesting.
hmm however; ‘as above so below’ = correlations? maybe the idea of forms is arrived at as the world progressed, otherwise this world would have instantly been developed ~ as a kind of mirror of the otherworld. we see an evolution here so why not there?
