Hey peacegirl, how are you?
Here is a question. The solution you propose to end all evil is to impose a set of conditions so specific on all humans, that it becomes impossible to even think of doing evil. The question is: is this imposition itself not evil? Is programming another human being, and in fact all human beings, not an evil act?
Peacegirl: Where is the imposition? If I give you a better way to accomplish a goal, does that mean I’m imposing on you? Should we not share our thoughts? There is no force or imposition so this doesn’t apply.
Aventador: I suppose you might say that there is no such thing as evil, because there is no such thing as choice.
Peacegirl: There IS choice, just not FREE choice. Evil comes to an end because hurt in human relations is coming to an end.
Aventador: In that case, would forcing a set of conditions on a human or all humans not itself constitute harm?
Peacegirl: No one is forcing a set of conditions. People choose options that they think will help their lives, regardless of what the particular options are. It’s the same here. If the claims bear out, people will see the benefits and work toward creating what will benefit them.
Aventador: And, if it did, would it not negate the basic premise you are operating with of both determinism on one hand and ending all harm doing on the other?
Peacegirl: Not at all. This discovery
tries to show what happens when the principle of no blame (the corollary to determinism) is extended on a large scale.
Aventador: If it doesn’t, what definition of harm are you going by?
Would the elimination of a cultural heritage constitute harm?
Peacegirl: Not unless the culture forces compliance. All force is coming to an end.
Aventador: Would it only constitute harm where the heritage does not include violence? Does whether the heritage includes violence modify the act of elimination itself in terms of constituting harm?
Peacegirl: Harm is doing something to someone they don’t want done to themselves. Culture is a form if dictatorship which is coming to an end out of necessity.
Sculptor: There is a much bigger problem that “peacgirl’s” tyrrany.
Peacegirl:This is the antithesis of tyrrany. This jumping to conclusions is the downfall of this thread
Sculptor: The simply fact is that there is no pure “evil”, there is only things that humans consider bad, as there is no pure good; only things that please humans.
What is evil for one person may not be so for another and maybe good. And what is good for one may do evil to another.
Peacegirl: Dog food is good next to starvation and bad for a king. But if everyone can have steak, would you complain? Evil in this context means striking a first blow of hurt that steps on someone else’s freedom. Everyone having steak is hurting no one. Let’s not get off track.
Sculptor: There may well be actions possible that would do good and not evil, but I cannot think of one. And there may well be evil acts that are generally so, but these too are rare.
So whether Peacgirl allows us to be programmed to do what she thinks is good, and programmed to forebear upon acts she thinks are evil, I cannot image a world that would result in a generalised benefit to all that would not do some harm and do good only to a few, rather than for the whole race.
Peacegirl: That is because you don’t see that this world is within reach. Please don’t use your doubts as a reason to scrap this knowledge even if you’re skeptical. This is for your benefit as there is wisdom in these words.
Sculptor: I can take examples and give my reasons. I’d be happy to find one thing which would work.