his actions of closing the meeting were illegal, as it was called using a little used rule by the democrats to call their own witnesses to discuss the patriot act, because during the normal hearings the republicans would not allow democrat witnesses.
As for his comment in the video that gaunanamo has nothing to do with the patriot act? It has EVERYTHING to do with the act. It gives them a place to hold you indefinately without a fair trial, without you being able to contact your lawyer or family.
worried about the direction of the “majority” yet?
Of course he went to far. What he did was fucking outrageous, regardless of his political party. The fucker should lose his position for such a gross misuse of power.
True and furtermore, the “liberal” media didn’t report on this at all. I didn’t see one mention of this on the major news networks. I read about it on the blogs.
i dunno i watched the video and if i understand correctly he is upset with the fact that witnesses who were called to testify about the renewall of the patriot act were speaking about things that had nothing to do with the patriot act. I admit i saw no reason for him to get up and leave, but i understand his frustration. It sounds like people were just using the hearing as a forum to vent frustrations on other issues, that had nothing to do with the patriot act.
I suggest you watch the ENTIRE meeting since you blindly believe ko"TEX" Sensenbrenner’s bullshit statement about the hearing not having anything to do with the PAT act. “Tex” is just talking out of his ass. He didn’t like the fact that the Democrats got to bring their OWN witnesses to a meeting, so he illegally adjourned the meeting.
I was going to comment then realized that its is mundane babble. Most opinions here and in Rant House are bullshit… else they would be in a respectable forum.
Your mundane homework is to look up what you can re. Cognitive Dissonance Reduction theory (Festinger, but look for his later versions after his original 50’s work; Aronson (and Mills) would be another place to see developments on the theory). Throw in “rationalization” from the ego defense mechanisms as bonus homework.
I was going to write that I found it just as appauling for the sensenbrenner act… however, as things started to spin nicely into simple minded bashing I remembered that this is mundane babble and that you fiends err, f(r)iends would be happy to bitch all you want without a truly serious discussion. If someone would like to discuss this in a civil, clear headed manner, I recommend it be placed in social sciences… not here.
So let me get this straight. You agree with us that his actions were outlandish and wrong, but the mere fact that we were venting about it turned you off?
Well then if you REALLY wanted to have a civil discussion you wouldn’t have made a troll post in here. You would have instead created a similar thread in the social sciences forum and posted a link to it in this thread.
I agree with Fthenaysayers on this, watching the whole video all the witnesses called had everything to do with the patriot act.
points:
librarians are called under secret warrants via the patriot act. They can’t talk to a lawyer about their legal actions as that would land them in jail or worse.
gitmo could not exist without the patriot act.
the patriot act is undemocratic and that was another valid point raised during this meeting, if we are trying to go out promoting democracy we should not do so waving the banner of the “patriot act”.
I wonder if people can be civil about this topic? it’s going to upset those who care deeply about the loss of democracy within their country while a majority of republicans (minus you, clearly you feel sensenbrenner went too far.) think his actions were justified. That a secret prison is justified.
Naysayer, before I knew this thread was up I had agreed with Scythe in a PM that I agreed with his position–in fact, his PM led me to this thread. No bullshit there.
As for the troll post: what, do you think your the only one who likes to rant? Everytime a democrat or a republican does something bad people around here bitch and whine. That is what I was pointing out. I also further added that it IS appropriate in mundane or rant… so, I bitched about people bitching.
Thankfully, Scythe made a very level-headed reply above… of which I can pretty much agree with in full. So even though he says that people’s feelings get the better of them, I don’t think they should allow it. I also discussed with Scythe in very clear words, that I enjoy heated debate–however, so long as all parties respect one another. That’s it.
ALSO, if it is a secret prison I think they forgot the secret part…
Much like the “cover up was so bad no one realized there was a cover up” about the clinton fiasco, I think this will be seen the same way in the past… they’ve tried to keep their operations at Gitmo secret. They’ve tried to keep
but this thread isn’t about gitmo (I should’ve started that other thread in mundane babble as it really was me ranting at the time )
I think calling people “trolls” is rather childish, and is the reason I don’t respect “theadlerian” much anymore, he always resulted to calling me and psyque trolls in the homosexual thread.
I also like heated debate, but (I can’t tell from your post your stance on this) I think some actions warrant bitching.
as soon as you take that bitching and turn it into name calling (ala “troll”) you’ve stepped over the line IMO.
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