Feral children...

I saw the most incredible show on Discovery last night and wanted to share it with you. Psychologists have had an hypothoses for years of how a child talks and learns in a specific way and that there is a window in their childhood that closes after a certain period without specific stimulation and nurturing.

Feral children are children grown up in the wild. They only have about four specific cases (kind of like the Tarzan boy) that have had reasonable proof that normal, intelligent children in these circumstances lose their ability to learn, speak and reason if they are not raised with proper stimulation and love.

The one child, named Edik, was born in Russia and they found him abandoned at four years old in an rundown apartment building with no tenants. His mother was a drug addict and left him for dead. He lived for years among stray dogs and had many traits that dogs have in terms of cleaning himself and eating. The reason (they say) why he flourished emotionally is because of the warmth, caring, and nurturing those dogs gave him. He lived among an entire pack of dogs, and because of his ability to find food for the pack, his status within the pack was elevated - and he was treated with great respect within this environment. When he was found - although wild, he went to a foster family quite easily and adapted into a “human” lifestyle of love and nurturing.

His case was played against another. A girl who was found to be inside a wire cage her entire life. During the day, all the lights in the room were low, curtains shut, and she was tied to a pottyseat so she couldn’t move. After being found, her test showed that her intellect was high, and her ability to learn was intact. But the lack of nurturing made it imossible for her to ever truly form sentences and interact with other people. I found it so interesting that animals can have such an impact on a life. I know they say that having a pet makes you happier and live longer. This story was remarkable to me. If I have a moment, I will write about the other cases because they were all quite incredible.

Bessy, that sounds like an amazing show- it makes me wish for a minute that I had cable. It’s tough for me to believe that the contast of the two scenarios mentioned can be so easly attributed to the boy’s interaction with the dogs as having been the only cause for his social and emotional functionality. The boy was more or less only “neglected”, while the girl was the victim of extreme and sadistic child abuse. If the girl had simply been abandoned and lived a relatively stable, however completely solitary life, I don’t think she’d be quite so bad off.

Now the boy in the first story, had he learned any spoken language while living with the dogs? I’d imagine that he would have had to see and hear people around him at some point. How old was the girl when they found her? If you have time, please do post the other stories!

Thanks for answering.

The little girl who was neglected was found when when she was thirteen and showed great promise, but her past haunted her so badly, and when the system became involved the state took her away from those who “rescued” her. The state gave her back to her mother who talked the courts into saying it had been the father’s abuse. The father shot himself in the head instead of being prosecuted. But, it was fascinating that the animals had cared for the other young boy who was, by the way, four when he was found. He had never had interaction with other humans in his short life and had been with the dogs for two years. He had no language skills, but learned quickly… his issues were more physical in nature and he had poor motor skills.

There was another boy who lived as a wild animal in the woods, and his story was the one they made the movie about… Grey something - I can’t remember. He howled like a wolf, and ate on the floor, but was quite teachable and became civilized in a short period of time - again the contact with wolves gave him a warmth which allowed for his development to flourish. This boy was so much like a wolf that he refused to stand upright for a very long time.

I wonder about their ages making the biggest difference as opposed to the animals influence. It was difficult to decide, but all the scientists involved were immediately taking stock because it is impossible to really know why and how people learn since most are born into “normal” families or at least ones that don’t torture or abandon. Again, there are very few cases so it is total hypothesis as to how kids really thrive and develop. Amazing.

Yes, some forms of autism used to be blamed on cold parents that usually had a child under bad circumstances or didn’t want it at all. There are many case studies that indicate this and I have met many parents that fit the bill. So, I wonder why verbal neglect is no longer seen as a potential cause of the problem.

In your profession, is that true?

Back in the 50’s autism was called refrigerator mother syndrome. The vast majority of cases almost always had a level of marital discord or strange event such as an accident that happened around the time of birth. The concept was that the baby was either unwelcome or that mom was too depressed to take care of the kid mentally. Take what we know about postpartum depression and add a bad relationship or situation to the mix, and then you might get a lonely depressed woman that feeds the kid but never talks to it. Then kid is healthy looking hasn’t had his brain turned on.

A long time ago I used to think that was crap until I met several families that were stereotypes of the old case studies, and now I’m not so sure. However, I bet that there are multiple causes to autism that just look the same, much like arthritis.

From autism-society.org/site/Page … atisAutism

[i]There is no known single cause for autism, but it is generally accepted by the medical community that it is caused by abnormalities in brain structure or function. Brain scans show differences in the shape and structure of the brain in autistic versus non-autistic children. Researchers are investigating a number of theories, including the link between heredity, genetics and medical problems. While no one gene has been identified as causing autism, in many families there appears to be a pattern of autism or related disabilities, further supporting a genetic basis to the disorder. Researchers are searching for irregular segments of genetic code that autistic children may have inherited. It also appears that some children are born with a higher susceptibility to autism, but researchers have not yet identified a single “trigger” that causes autism to develop.

Whatever the cause, it is clear that children with autism and PDD are born with the disorder or born with the potential to develop it. Bad parenting does not cause it. It is not a mental illness. Children with autism are not unruly kids who choose not to behave. Furthermore, no known psychological factors in the development of a child have been shown to cause autism.

Autism is a spectrum disorder, and although it is defined by a certain set of behaviors, children and adults with autism can exhibit any combination of these behaviors in any degree of severity. Two children, both with the same diagnosis, can act completely different from one another and have varying capabilities.

You may hear different terms used to describe children within this spectrum, such as autistic-like, autistic tendencies, autism spectrum, high-functioning or low-functioning autism, more-abled or less-abled; but more important than the term used to describe autism is understanding that whatever the diagnosis, children with autism can learn and function normally and show improvement with appropriate treatment and education.

Every person with autism is an individual, and like all individuals, has a unique personality and combination of characteristics. Some individuals mildly affected may exhibit only slight delays in language and greater challenges with social interactions. They may have difficulty initiating and/or maintaining a conversation. Their communication is often described as talking at others instead of to them. (For example, monologue on a favorite subject that continues despite attempts by others to interject comments).

People with autism also process and respond to information in unique ways. In some cases, aggressive and/or self-injurious behavior may be present. Persons with autism may also exhibit some of the following traits:

* Insistence on sameness; resistance to change
* Difficulty in expressing needs, using gestures or pointing instead of words
* Repeating words or phrases in place of normal, responsive language
* Laughing (and/or crying) for no apparent reason showing distress for reasons not apparent to others
* Preference to being alone; aloof manner
* Tantrums
* Difficulty in mixing with others
* Not wanting to cuddle or be cuddled
* Little or no eye contact
* Unresponsive to normal teaching methods
* Sustained odd play
* Spinning objects
* Obsessive attachment to objects
* Apparent over-sensitivity or under-sensitivity to pain
* No real fears of danger
* Noticeable physical over-activity or extreme under-activity
* Uneven gross/fine motor skills
* Non responsive to verbal cues; acts as if deaf, although hearing tests in normal range.

For most of us, the integration of our senses helps us to understand what we are experiencing. For example, our sense of touch, smell and taste work together in the experience of eating a ripe peach: the feel of the peach’s skin, its sweet smell, and the juices running down your face. For children with autism, sensory integration problems are common, which may throw their senses off they may be over or under active. The fuzz on the peach may actually be experienced as painful and the smell may make the child gag. Some children with autism are particularly sensitive to sound, finding even the most ordinary daily noises painful. Many professionals feel that some of the typical autism behaviors, like the ones listed above, are actually a result of sensory integration difficulties.

There are also many myths and misconceptions about autism. Contrary to popular belief, many autistic children do make eye contact; it just may be less often or different from a non-autistic child. Many children with autism can develop good functional language and others can develop some type of communication skills, such as sign language or use of pictures. Children do not “outgrow” autism but symptoms may lessen as the child develops and receives treatment.

One of the most devastating myths about autistic children is that they cannot show affection. While sensory stimulation is processed differently in some children, they can and do give affection. However, it may require patience on the parents’ part to accept and give love in the child’s terms.

[/i]
An autistic’s perspective from nas.org.uk/nas/jsp/polopoly.jsp?d=120&a=2202:

Myth…: High-functioning and low-functioning autism are completely different things

I have been told that as a high functioning autistic, able to express myself, I know nothing about what it’s like to be really autistic. I started out quite severe and non-verbal, but “moved along the spectrum”. A very recent study shows that there is no difference between Asperger Syndrome and autism other than IQ. The core deficits are the same; it’s only the presentation that is different.

Myth…: All autistics are the same

Sometimes people know about one or more autistic people and believe that everything they say applies to all of us. Aside from the fact that we share a few traits, and some experiences as a direct result of those traits, we are as individual as anyone else. From the assumption that we are all the same come a number of other myths:

a) All autistics think in pictures. (Thanks to Temple Grandin, author of ‘Thinking in pictures and other reports from my life with autism’.) While visual thinking may be more common in autistics than in the general population, it is certainly neither universal nor exclusive. I’ve also found that it is very common among dyslexics and others. I, for one, don’t think in pictures.

b) All sensory issues are hypersensitivities to touch or sound. Sensory issues can also be hyposensitivities, where nothing gets in unless it is very loud or painful; synaesthesia, where one sense is perceived as another; or sometimes extreme fluctuations. They can affect any sense including proprioceptive (sense of one’s body in space), and vestibular (movement). I am mostly hyposensitive with a few specific hypersensitivities.

c) All autistics have “special skills” or savant abilities. Savant skills appear in about 10% of autistic people. This is thousands of times higher than the general population, but still the exception rather than the rule. I had some savant abilities when I was little, but they faded as I learned to communicate. Savant skills are not “useless” as they are sometimes made out to be. I know at least two autistics who have used their savant abilities in employment situations.

Of course in this day and age the autistic society is not going to blame parents for being non-interactive with babies, so one can never know the truth. A feral child is one step away from a child growing up in a home where people behave like animals.

…but dogs are nice, i know this one dog named Rigly, he’s not a genius, but he could rase a healthy child.

talking bears are nice, as well.

G,

That may be because dogs do not have motives that we know of. However, a dog can’t have a Buddha mind if I recall correctly. Anyway, I may decide to open a Doggy Daycare and just hire animal employees. Do you think yuppies would like that?

i think thats a wonderfull idea, serious. you would have like one human there, but the dogs would be runnin the show. "a dog cant have a buddah mind set>…i was waiting for a time to present my theory, about how my dog is a self actualized artist. o.k., her nam is buttons anna…we dont give her hardly any rules, shes not affraid to act as herself. she puts her own style on the way she does everything. we have a rabbit hutch in our back yard, she loves barking at them, she manipulates where they will hop, and gets happy when she can get them to go from end to end, she gets frusterated, when they dont. buttons anna is an artist, moving the rabbits in her desired direction, is her way of manipulating an aspect of existance, in her desired way. one is a self actualized artist when they do art that they are proud of (their best)…when buttons anna has a good day, she is beaming, her eyes twinkle the way alot of humans should, but dont. and on halloween she wears fairy wings, and goes trick or treating…(i dont smoke pot anymore)

puppy anna, is a self actualized cock-a-poo.

It sounds like you ran an accidental Montessori school for the tender pup.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Montessori_school

yes. more children would be levitating if only people would listesn to pore old montesorri.

Less evaluatin and more levitatin! That’s what I say!

Plus, you have to talk to your babies or else they’re goin to end up autistic.

also, when they draw pictures dont say “what the fuck?”

Because the theory was shown to be invalid scientifically,perhaps?

Yeesh!:roll:

Haas et al. in the 1996 (Vol. 11) Journal of Child Neuropsychology review a number of studies showing clear anatomical/neurological brain differences in children with autism. The link between structural abnormalities and autism is well-documented. If you’re going to depend on 40 year old data to support your assertions,Adler, at least have the courtesy not to present yourself as having any sort of specialized knowledge in the area. You need to do a litle more research on the topic,I think.

Again, more on Autism from:

naar.org/aboutaut/whatis_hist.htm

In the 1950s and 1960s, the medical community generally incorrectly believed autism was a psychological disturbance caused by detached, or uncaring mothers (refrigerator mothers.) This belief, later completely disproven, was based on the observations and opinions of Dr. Bruno Bettleheim, one of the first child development specialists to focus on autism.

For decades, generations of mothers of children with autism were unfairly accused of causing their child’s disorder. In the early 1960s, a few people in the medical community such as Dr. Bernard Rimland and Dr. Eric Schopler, began to challenge Bettleheim’s opinion. In 1964, Dr. Rimland provided a definitive review of evidence that established autism as a biological condition – thus demonstrating Bettleheim’s theory was wrong.

Soon after autism was proven to be a biological condition, Dr. Andreas Rett first described Rett Syndrome as a specific condition in a paper published in 1966.

In 1977, Dr. Susan Folstein and Dr. Michael Rutter published the first autism twin study, which revealed evidence of a genetic basis for autism. Over the next ten years, researchers conducted additional studies that further yielded evidence of a genetic component to autism as well as refined the symptoms of autism.

In 1991, Drs. Catherine Lord, Michael Rutter and Ann LeCouteur published the Autism Diagnostic Interview. In 1992, the American Psychiatric Association released the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (DSM-IV), which refined diagnostic criteria for autistic disorder. The World Health Organization released a similar diagnostic manual in 1993 known as the International Classification of Diseases (ICD-10).

While progress was being made refining the symptoms and classification of autistic spectrum disorders and parent support and advocacy groups were being formed, very few resources were being invested directly into biomedical research for autism.

In 1994, the National Alliance for Autism Research was established, becoming the first organization in the U.S. dedicated to funding and accelerating biomedical research into the autism spectrum disorders. Founded by Karen and Eric London and other parents of children with autism, NAAR allocates millions each year to funding the finest autism research worldwide and has played a key role in increasing federal spending on autism.

In the early to mid 1990s, genetic researchers began to link autism to people with abnormalities on chromosome 15. In 1998, researchers had reported evidence of a link between autism and chromosome 15q and chromosome 7q. By 2001, several researchers had completed genetic screens that have identified several genomic regions containing genes that could be associated with autism.

Shyster,

Please think before going to the trouble of posting so much.

The OP mentions how children that have not been stimulate verbally will lose the ability to speak. That means that the areas on the left side of the brain that control speech just aren’t there. They don’t grow, thus the brain appears to be defective or odd, but in reality it has to do with the environment.

This kind of thing has been seen in children left in orphanages that have been placed in solid walled cribs, who were being just fed and changed. I believe that eastern Europe had a rash of this happen about ten years ago. It occurred with like almost every baby in the orphanage.

Some babies will just die from stimulation neglect and that’s called Failure to Thrill Syndrome. Nothing is being done to them physically that’s wrong, but they just die. I suppose the brain needs a kick start like a motorcycle.

So, it is not a stretch to imagine that in some cases autism is the result of a unique form of childhood neglect brought on by parents that do not know how, or do not want to, relate to a baby. If that sort of thing can happen in an orphanage, where there’s lots of comings and goings, then how isolated might some isolated depressed/sociopathic person’s home be?

So, which one of your relatives is autistic?

TheAdlerian wrote:

Please think before going to the trouble of posting so much.

:lol: Oh,okay…thanks for the advice.

Some babies will just die from stimulation neglect and that’s called Failure to Thrill Syndrome.

Do you mean “failure to thrive”…? (your Freudian slip is showing.):wink:

So, it is not a stretch to imagine that in some cases autism is the result of a unique form of childhood neglect brought on by parents that do not know how, or do not want to, relate to a baby.

How then, do you explain away the thousands of families with an autistic child and a “normal” child or children? Ever stop to think that perhaps a mentally disabled child who doesn’t communicate and is non-responsive to affection may be isolated because the caregiver(s) are at a loss about how to care for such a child? People feel uncomfortable around those who don’t act “normal”. A kid that creates a fuss/goes into a screaming tantrum, or starts banging their head on the wall, or stares off into space for hours and becomes “deaf” is understandably frustrating for the parent/caregiver to deal with. Especially if the parent/caregiver is a moron.

What of the twin studies which have shown that children with autism develop autism regardless of the enviroment?

Could it be possible that developmental disabilities could be the result of structural anomolies in the brain and/or “the result of a unique form of childhood neglect brought on by parents that do not know how, or do not want to, relate to a baby” ? If “some” cases are caused by neglect, what are the “other” cases caused by? Do not some symptoms of mental illness or disability resemble others to such a degree that the misdiagnosis of a particular patient’s mental illness or disability is commonplace?

I have no bone to pick with you,Adler…you’re probably very good at your job and help your patients a great deal. You just have this huge ego…that’s fine, but it can interfere with objective reasoning.