Government Does Not Exist

[James_L_Walker]

Understanding that government does not exist it then goes to follow that the social contract does not either. There is no social contract but instead only ultimatums enforced in society or people becoming entrapped by others through forced agreements.

A forced agreement would be when a person becomes entrapped or enslaved doing a miserable job and task that they do not want to do but are nonetheless forced to do because they cannot survive any other way. This happens to many individuals of every society. They become forced into labor just to survive and are punished for disobedience.

[Polly]

@SIATD v2

@Polly

@SIATD v2

Basically, they don’t understand that the government is a corporate entity and that corporations are state entities. Or they willfully ignore the fact.

Any proof for that, not consisting of your own conjecture?

Well, banking is an obvious example but there at the heart of the thing in each nation you have a central bank, which has the national monopoly rights of a government department but the secrecy and unaccountability of a private corporation. Even when the bank itself is nationalised, which has happened in some countries, it still functions in the same way as a normal central bank, in that it sells debt in order to raise money to then loan to the government, while at the same time using that process to back the simple creation of money out of nothing to then loan to the government. The bigger the governmental deficit, and all capitalist nations run at a deficit pretty much all the time, the better it is for the central bank. So the government spends more money that it can obtain through taxation by agreeing to hand over a proportion of that taxation on interest payments to the central bank and to debt holders.

Thus, the economy will always be growing in that there will always be more money in the economy (i.e. inflation is a given) even when in real terms it is shrinking, when the increased money supply actually pays for less stuff. This happens when inflation outstrips the increased money supply, i.e. when private businesses charge more in order to eat up more of the money supply in the name of making larger profits. Frankly, if you’re a Tesco or a Wall Mart or a Exxon Mobil or whoever you can hardly fail to make money in such an economic system. Your profits basically come from the increase in money supply caused by the government borrowing it through the central bank.

This is not just collusion between the government and big corporations, it is a systemic tie that neither could truly survive without. The government can’t borrow enough money to keep enough people employed to keep enough people paying taxes to keep borrowing more money. So the corporations employ people at less than their labour is worth but just enough to keep them consuming and paying taxes, as dicatated by the market forces in such a system. If you take out the government and the big corporations there really aren’t that many people left who are making much money or paying much tax. Of course, if we could get rid of the debt-machine that is state capitalism then there’d be a much more open economy in which you’d get lots and lots of smaller businesses and civil institutions. Probably.

(sigh)

I asked for a link that proves that libertarian scholars “don’t understand that the government is a corporate entity and that corporations are state entities. Or they willfully ignore the fact.”

More of your own observations aren’t what I asked for.

[SIATD_v2]

@Polly

(sigh)

I asked for a link that proves that libertarian scholars “don’t understand that the government is a corporate entity and that corporations are state entities. Or they willfully ignore the fact.”

More of your own observations aren’t what I asked for.

On the contrary, what you said was:

Any proof for that, not consisting of your own conjecture?

The above is mostly not my own conjecture, but information anyone can find if only they look for it. You didn’t ask for a link - and what kind of link could I provide? A video of the ‘libertarian scholar’ Ron Paul saying something that shows he doesn’t grasp this?

[Polly]

Proof that A (any) libertarian scholar does not “understand that the government is a corporate entity and that corporations are state entities. Or they willfully ignore the fact.” is what I asked for indeed. Proof can come in the form of a link. It usually does on internet forums.

Ron Paul wasn’t a scholar, nor was he advocating anarcho-capitalism, last time I checked. Maybe you could find something Von Mises claims that supports your own personal opinion. Until then, it’s really just your own opinion.

[SIATD_v2]

@Polly

Proof that A (any) libertarian scholar does not “understand that the government is a corporate entity and that corporations are state entities. Or they willfully ignore the fact.” is what I asked for indeed. Proof can come in the form of a link. It usually does on internet forums.

Ron Paul wasn’t a scholar, nor was he advocating anarcho-capitalism, last time I checked.

As I said, it is not just the anarcho-capitalists but also the libertarian minarchists of the Austrian school that make this argument about contracts.

Maybe you could find something Von Mises claims that supports your own personal opinion. Until then, it’s really just your own opinion.

That it is ‘just my own opinion’ is just your own opinion.

BAM. The irony apple strikes again.

[Polly]

Oh dear.

[Polly]

Anyway Walker, cool thread. Would be nice to discuss the topic further once other contributions come in.

[James_L_Walker]

@Polly

Anyway Walker, cool thread. Would be nice to discuss the topic further once other contributions come in.

Sure. I plan on writing other conclusions in this thread later on in the evening.