I want to convert to Catholicism, except...

I want to convert to Catholicism (for family tradition and moral reasons), except I believe that Jesus was just a man, not miraculous by any stretch of the fairy-tale notions. Perhaps he was truly a great man, but that is as high as I would probably think of him. I do not accept him into my heart as Lord and/or Savior, but I do appreciate his sacrifices in order to give me a better life. Nobody is my Lord, not even ‘God’ by how the (blasphemous) word is common conceptualized.

Is this a problem for me? What kind of conflicts would I run into beginning my conversion (my father’s parents were both Roman Catholics).

My father is/was an Atheist, but I can’t stand for moral indecency and hypocrisy. It makes me sick just thinking about walking outside anymore.

Hi Unreasonable,

As an ex-Catholic who left on solid liturgical grounds (I could not recite the Creed in good faith, etc., and so excluded myself from the proceedings of the Mass), I would suggest you’re hooped…

As a father and an athiest, though, I need to ask if you are equating your father’s atheism with indecency and hypocrasy?

I do believe that my Catholic upbringing did provide for me a moral mold which in many respects was positive (though its limits I eventually felt I had to transgress). I hope to provide my son with a positive moral upbringing, but don’t rely on my atheism for that (it’s an empty bag in that respect). Was the expectation that you, too, be an atheist, and that this be your moral ground?

Well, my father did do a lot of “indecent” things when he was young, but I do not necessarily relate the two.

He was indecent and hypocritical in his life, because he is ignorant as to the Truth of many things. He just didn’t care, like many people do not care.

I care about Truth. That is like the only thing I care about in this world.

No, my father was pretty good in that regard. He did not expect me to be one thing or another.

On the other hand, he provided no ‘moral’ ground for me to live my life upon, except where the Catholic tradition lingered in him. For example, he is married to the same (and his only) wife for God-knows-how-long, had my siblings and I, and lives mostly honorable. However, I see that these things were passed onto him by tradition, namely, the Roman Catholic tradition.

Yet, my father, being ignorant as he is, cannot, does not, nor would ever even try to see the bigger picture as to how his lifestyle was passed onto him. In this sense, he is a hypocrite, but I see that as forgivable. The Roman Catholicism is the hidden faith, so-to-speak, behind the scenes. I would like to embrace this rather than reject it, and add to it as well.

Jesus was just a man, perhaps a great man, but the religious-ity is nothing compared to the spirituality and Morality of the Faith, to me.

I want to know if I would be accepted into it if I were to pursue this course.

It is my understanding that there are a lot of secular/cradle Catholics. In terms of converting it might be a pinch more difficult since you don’t default into it. Start going to Mass, after a few visits (so the priest recognizes you) go up to take communion . . . but don’t. Ask the priest if you can speak to him later privately. Then chill 'til Confession is done and explain the situation to the priest while saying you want to become a member of the church. He won’t say no, no matter how you explain the situation.

Further to Xunzian’s suggestion: yes, that would be a great introduction into the fold, and just prior to your balking on receiving Communion, make sure that you note and consider the congregational refrain you would just have heard: namely, “Lord I am not worthy to receive you, but only say the word and I shall be healed.” That one stuck in my craw.

The priest will with little doubt speak with you quite openly. Be assured that you wouldn’t have been the first for him. Perhaps in discussing your desire to embrace the Catholic faith, you might direct the issue specifically to the question of membership. I’m pretty sure there’s terminology for being an associate member (whereby, though you wouldn’t be deemed able to receive Communion, you would nonetheless be recognized by the parish as a member).

By Lord, are you accepting God or Jesus though?

I don’t care much for Jesus as some kind of deified man. That just seems logically inconsistent to me.

The ideal of ‘God’ is much more powerful.

Good question. On first blush I’d say Lord = God the Father, but all said and done I’m pretty certain that Jesus necessarily resolves back up in there, too (along with the Holy Ghost).

Oops. Brain fart. No, the Lord referred to for Communion is thoroughly (at least prima facie) that of Jesus Christ. Yahweh & the Holy Ghost are implied, of course, but Jesus is the one principally in question during that utterance.

I ought clarify. While it is somewhat crass, becoming a member of a congregation normally involves a financial contribution.

So the order is:

  1. Start going.

  2. Balk at communion

  3. Talk to the priest about it, explain situation

  4. Give priest money

  5. Huzzah! You are a Catholic!

  6. Down the road, get confirmed. Not sure how that goes, but if you overcome 5, I’m confident you’ll figure that one out.

Um, I don’t know what kind of Catholicism you guys are referring to, but the one I know would not be the right choice for someone who did not believe Jesus was the son of God. That’s pretty central to the Catholic faith. To put it mildly. You could not, in good conscience, convert to Catholicism without that.

Jesus can be the Son of God. That’s fine. I just wouldn’t call him my Lord…

He’s just a man, after all.

What are you converting from?

Maybe to you, but not according to Catholicism. No parish or priest would allow you to convert if you genuinely thought Jesus was just a man, I can guarantee that. I’d recommend you look to something else, a non-Christian faith perhaps?

I’d prefer the traditions that have landed my family and heritage to where I’m at.

Catholicism accepts liars after all… Hmm… :-k

After all, I agree that Jesus was a prophet, but I don’t believe he had monkeys flying out of his ass or anything like that…

Is that a problem? I don’t know.

Yes, but I think they might just have a little problem welcoming a non-believer into the fold, UR. :laughing:

Besides, traditions aren’t really a good enough reason to become a Catholic. You’ll just have to trust me on that one. O:)

I don’t want to start my own religion. I want to be lazy! Where’s a moral authority?

I of course agree with Anita S, though I would suggest that it wouldn’t be a complete waste of time for you to spend some time in some church or other, just for the experience… I’d hasten to add, though, that for propriety’s sake, and based on the little I know about you, you might not want to talk to any of the laity, at least not in depth…

As far as lazy religion goes, you might want to get hold of a copy of The Lazy Man’s Guide to Enlightenment, by Thadeus Golas (if in fact it’s still in print). Zen & The Art of Headlessness by D.E. Harding is also a nice lazy read…

Ok, I don’t want to be that lazy.

I just meant: I want to reestablish the roots of my family tradition, but the problem seems to me to be that Catholicism is a bunch of fairy tales in the specific sense where Jesus is taken out-of-context of being mythical or “beyond” the flesh. He was, and is, just a man. He may have been a great man. He may have been a prophet. He may have been the Son of God. But I do not accept him as my Lord, because this is not how I envision he would see the concept of ‘God’.

Mastery is something different. I am not willing to be a slave to Jesus’ will. However, that also does not mean that I won’t go along with it (him).

How does this run contrary or contradictory to Catholicism? I know that Roman Catholicism is all about binding its subjects to its will, but Catholicism in general means: “universal”, apparently.

Do I not have a place in the “universal”???

EDIT: is this kind of like, “bow down!” and I just won’t do it? I don’t really want to have to lie about it…