(idle) thoughts on 'the future' as a historical construct

I must say that I am quite fascinated by the idea that mankind’s own imaginings of the future are as ever eerily self fulfilling. I mean this mostly as a matter of aesthetics; it is the conjurings of our imagination, spanned across history, which give us the ‘alien future’ and which then guide us in realising our notion of the ‘futuristic’, the ‘modern’ etc; all in a manner which is profoundly historical; or as you might say, touched with our own unknowingly creative hands.

What ‘futuristic’ means is decisively shot through with unrecognised retrospect; a turning back in narrative twisted and distorted by the ingrained instinct to view time as a linear and singular progression.

All this talk about the future as something ‘alien’ belies the fact that the future remains, as always, what ‘we’ make it. This phrase, oft used as a dictum for freedom of choice, is now subverted to show how ignorant we are of the play of history in human reality. The meaning that guides us, which is not ours and which subsequently feels alien, is like an organism which feeds into every meta-discourse, a kind of inescapable inheritance; which is precisely that region of our grounding of groundings which is nonetheless prior to our best efforts at reaching the fundamental. What ‘we’ make of the future is no more ‘ours’ than the system in which we make it. But it is not really ‘inhuman’ either.

It is something alive like evolution, but also dead like evolution. It resists anthropomorphisation, by which I mean that our attempts to schematise it in relation to our human concepts of life, agency, and causation, are subverted when aspects of each, and their antithesis’s, are found all to apply equally (or rather, ‘indiscriminately’) in the description we eventually settle on, a description which remains nonetheless itself an outgrowth of the organism, and not either ‘yours’ or ‘mine’.

I do occasionally wonder whether it is even possible to harness this organism and direct it willingly. This may sound contrary to what I have been describing thus far; however even something limited in this regard would be significant.

Such a harnessing would be a kind of being-historical thinking after all; however yet I think that just this moment - the achievement of the peak of subjugation - would also be the point at which it is realised how incomplete is even this most complete of possible subjugations. There is, I fear, no such thing as creativity. It seems more accurate to say that we grasp only part of what we are embroiled in, and the rest of what we may call ‘our creation’ is not any more ‘ours’ than is our identity, our beliefs, our language, or finally – our meaning. We are all blind in this respect. We are perpetuators, not creators.

We think of the future as we do a foreign country. When we think of travelling to other cultures – i.e. in the ‘present’ - cultures which we consider to be backward, we often think that in some sense we are travelling into the past. Likewise, when we look into the past, we often think analogously that in some sense we are travelling to a foreign nation. What should be made clear is that in the first case we are only really travelling into ‘our own past’, and that in the second the notion of foreignness is critically unpegged – i.e. relative to what is familiar and thus no more than a shadow of what we might call the ‘genuinely foreign’. Of course though it is almost by definition that we can never label or confront this Other, lest we would domesticate it and in so doing remove what was foreign, henceforth occasioning the same outcome.

The future too can be a foreign country, but it is our own foreignness, and it is precisely the kind of place which is susceptible here and now to these kinds of anthropological accounts. Objective time, I think, is the culprit in all of these confusions.

Regards,

James

James,

I’m not quite sure where you are going here, but perhaps I can feel where you are going. At issue seems to be the issue of self-determination. You don’t always appreciate my commentary :slight_smile: , but I couldn’t let such a thoughtful post go without response.

There is, I fear, no such thing as creativity. It seems more accurate to say that we grasp only part of what we are embroiled in, and the rest of what we may call ‘our creation’ is not any more ‘ours’ than is our identity, our beliefs, our language, or finally – our meaning.

Functional in self-determination, to the degree that there is such, and something often overlooked, is the reconfiguration of the past, often unintentional invention of the grounds for a new future, by pre-positing antecedents of the future in descriptions of the past. Toni Morrison once said that we cannot change the future, we can only change the past. What I believe that she was eluding to was that it is by changing the past, -our interpretation of it- we do change the future. Ideologically this is clearly seen as histories as mythologies are written into the consciousness of a peoples. Could one truly be a Roman without Virgil’s Trojan Aeneas? Can one be an American without the “heroic” Pilgrim. Imagined antecedents always precondition future avatars. If one truly wishes to “change” the future, rewrite the past. But unconscioiusly this is always being done anyways, as language grows, metaphors appropriate new modes of production, or production metaphors, the past then is redescribed in terms that faciliate new means. One can make a project of it as some do. But I am sure of what exactly it is about the future or self-determination that you would hope to find. Is it a separate place, outside of history, from which you would like to stand and gauge one’s direction? If so I don’t imagine that this can be strictly done. Perhaps at best the one can only hope for something of an emanate process, both on personal and cultural levels.

Dunamis

No this is not yet radical enough an interpretation, I think. It seems to me that I am somewhere else in this dialogue, and you have only caught a glimpse of, rather than found, me. This is wholly subjective though; as occasionally one is seen better by others than one is by oneself, and only thinks otherwise erroneosly. I cannot tell, and there is more complexity here than I can quite articulate at this point.

Aside:
Although I see how this might be read in terms of there being an ‘experience’ (of sorts; I am thinking of your discussion with pragmatist) which is prior to ‘language’, I am beginning to see that there might be an alternative explanation, rooted somewhere in the erosion of the notion of ownership. I will have to think some more on this.

At issue I think is primarily a question of ownership. What does it mean for something to be ‘ours’, given that the traditional normative conception of the self as a kind of ‘full stop’ on the horizon of determinism is no longer either true or false? Are we drawn, finally, to stop anthropomorphising even ourselves? (This question, I hope, shows how we have gotten everything back to front and the wrong way around)

It seems to me that a lot of the consequences of all of this are yet to be systematically appreciated.

Occasionally it seems we overlap, but for the most you are too slippery for me to get a hold on. I find it hard to determine where you are neologising, and where you would like the words to be transparent. In this perhaps you are occasionally inconsistent, but it is almost impossible to know for sure.

Also, I have not read any Spinoza, nor can I say I have any meaningful or comprehensive understanding of his philosophy (at least not knowlingly). My only impression of him comes from certain of the professors who I know, with whom Spinoza is considered to be rather brilliantly confused.

In any case, on the notions of misunderstanding, appreciation etc, it does, as always, require two to tango. :smiley:

Regards,

James

I’m afraid I can’t do your piece as much justice as Dunamis can, only stick my two cents in the mind-machine and crank out a rather more mundane answer…

Will they not always be self-fulfilling, as the inventor/originator must always imagine first the machine/system that he wishes to create…? And build later. Or build in reality a thing which was only imaginable at some point in the past, but was transmitted as an idea/meme through the generations between. Inspiration/Imagination is the first step to creativity, and not so reliant on wether or not the thing imagined can be achieved at the instant of conception. And what is the future but the sum of all the technology available, the level of society it enables, and the people’s reactions to them both…?

Agreed, in that we always lean over the shoulders of giants to read their diaries before scrambling onto them and becoming giants ourselves.

Was there never an original thought…? Did even the simplest of early inventions and societies just arise from observations of nature and adherrence to instinct…? Do we only extrapolate and never originate…?

How about maths…? Okay, the laws exist in nature, and are explained by maths, but didn’t the first primitive to state 2 ughs in one hand and 1 ugh in the other make 3 ughs altogether, have a purely original thought…?

Hmm… I seem to have simply asked questions rather than give opinions as usual. :smiley:

Anyway - that’s all my two cents would buy me. :wink:

James,

“It seems to me that a lot of the consequences of all of this are yet to be systematically appreciated.”

Perhaps as long as one is attempting to “systematize” that which is not a “system”, it will always escape understanding to some degree. :slight_smile:

Dunamis

Well this is a complex question. I would say that there are things other than machines and systems which can be invented. For instance, you might invent a new use for an something extant. In a sense, you might say at this point that you have ‘made’ a new machine, by rendering into an object a kind of telos. Given this observation, it seems valid to say that an invention can also occur without the kind of preconception which you describe. For instance, you might realise after inventing a machine that the machine actually suits several purposes which you had not foreseen. These were not preconceived by you. Are they, still, each an invention of yours? If anything, this kind of accidental invention speaks even more to the lack of originary force in the individual. And yet I would say that this is all the more self-fulfilling; even to the extent that it illustrates that there is no chief difference between the invention which was ‘preconceived’ and the invention which was stumbled upon. I want to say, in terms of ownership, that the two are different in degree, not kind. So I think your argument is wrong, because I don’t think that the notion of self-fulfillment has any exclusive relation to the idea of creation being bound by pre-conception. However I think the conclusion, that such a self-fulfillment is inescapable, is correct, although I would consider the possibility that the notion of self-fulfillment means something a little different in your mouth than mine.

To recap: it seems that things are invented without pre-conception, and yet as far as I can tell this does not free us from self-fulfillment.

One of the reasons I did not go down this path (the door opened in your above quote) was due to the sheer breadth of the problem, and its many tentacled reach, consequentially speaking. Hence my feeble effort to draw a boundary on this discussion by calling it one concerned chiefly with ‘aesthetics’, by which I meant one which dealt narrowly with the relationship between our notions of ‘the futuristic’ and ‘the modern’, and our past. There is a strong temptation, which I have, to view this relation as somehow ‘arbitrary’ or ‘fake’, as if we are acting out a script with a predefined direction. My question then becomes, is our knowledge of this in any way empowering? Even if it is just another fold in an inescapable fabric, is it somehow different in degree? If we cannot progress beyond it, can we at least progress within it? Or is all this just a disguised plea for authenticity, based on that fundamental misconception which equates freedom with an escape from determinism? (On the question of whether all notions of authenticity are so grounded, I have no present opinion to give.)

Subsequent, related questions

Is it meaningful to talk about the sheer reality of an object, which you then invest with purpose in the creative act? I am always weary of any analogy using cavemen, as we generally do not think radically enough about how a caveman’s being in the world would differ from ours. It seems to me though that, even given such brute, configured objects, the investment of use would not be wholly originary, or if it was, then this would require a whole host of other inhibitions; cognitive, conceptual, semantic - inhibitions whose ramifications would make our cavemen quite unoriginary and uncreative, only in an entirely different manner.

It is not the fact that there is a preconception which makes the creative act a self-fulfillment. Viewing this as the source may even be something of a ‘red herring’, as the underlying fulfillment flows inescably by regardless, and so not only can we not affirm our lack of originary ability with this argument, we could not deny it either i.e. affirm the ability rather than the lack. Both would be conclusions grown out of a false ultimatum.

It is important that we should remember that, if there exists no condition in which we could be originary, then we cannot be unoriginal either. This would be a false step in our argument, a confusion at the critical moment. This is directly related to what I wrote before, here;

It is a temptation within discourses on determinism, which seems entirely wrong-headed to me. Its refusal is not something arbitrary, as in ‘let’s not be to hasty’ etc etc. Its affirmation is confused and inconsistent.

Like I said I am weary of this kind of argument. What kind of conceptual development must come before we have access to the abstract, access to numeracy? In any case, whilst one might use this argument to make a case for there being nothing ‘ontological’ in our current historicity, I would just as soon argue that our equivalence with the most primitive of humans is little better than our equivalence with a child; who looks in the mirror and imagines that they literally are the reflection, or imagines that all the strangers in the street exist purely for it, flashing out of existence the moment they flash out of sight. Just as I do not feel comfortable extrapolating back into the distant past in any definite manner, so too I would would not like to extrapolate from the past to the future, in order to ground some broad metaphysical assumptions. It all makes me rather uncomfortable, intellectually speaking.

There is also the notion of objective time, which I remarked earlier was probably one of the chief culprits in all of this. It should be remembered that our caveman would not have had a future the way we have one.

Aside: this is indeed an assumption; I am working with the supposition that the caveman could be sufficiently different to us to enable the ‘wholly original thought’. My argument, so far as I can tell, rests on an assumption which we both hold, so I will not bother to argue around it, for now.

The speculative mental space where we imagine the future seems to me to be thoroughly an outgrowth of our own particular metaphysical history. The question of what might suffice for us to say that our caveman had an original thought - for this we must be careful not to pick up covertly on the old notion of free-will as action without cause. If your idea of self-determination is tied to a notion of free-will like this, then your argumentative position becomes many magnitudes weaker. I will assume not, and thus the question becomes in what sense the caveman possesses himself in a way which we do not. My answer would be that he does not possess a self either, only that he does not possess it in a radically different way to us. The point at which early man becomes lost to a Self, rather than lost to something more alien, is ambiguous and perhaps prior to the development of whatever simularities between him and us justified our original comparison.

In any case this topic is not given to immediate conclusions.

Thanks for the response. :slight_smile:

Regards,

James

Dear James,

Still digesting your reply, but for now - the ‘that things are invented without pre-conception’ idea.

Okay, I didn’t think of that straight off the bat, but surely you can’t entirely separate the consequent use of a machine from the original concept - for example, if I invent a small portable heat-source - maybe for drying clothes, which I subsequently decide, would make a great toaster, the invention still falls within my initial conception in that it’s small, and generates heat - whatever end product this heat is used to effect.

And again - imagination - in that instant before I (or someone else later) decide(s) it’s a toaster, I still have to look at the machine that may become a toaster - its final physical use/form still unconcrete - and see a ‘toaster’ concept flicker across my imagination before said ‘maybe-toaster’ triumphantly becomes ‘true-toaster’.

Or are you saying it was always a toaster, from the instant the last screw was tightened, and ‘it’ was waiting for my imagination to catch up…?
A question of personal viewpoint, no…?

It does not - though I would like to believe, that there is something unique* in the way each of us processes/reacts to (however minutely) the causal stimuli producing the - what shall I call it…? - ‘free-will exercising event’ - to give us at least a hope of producing something new under the sun… the idea of total determinism - the predictable pin-ball-human, is abhorrent to me.

Anyway - back to ruminations

*don’t ask me what it is though. :smiley:

Well if there is a necessary connection here, then it would seem I should not be able to imagine even such an extreme example as this;

‘You scribble some random marks on a rock, which survives for a million years before being discovered by an alien race, for whom it becomes a fulfillment of a certain religious prophecy. Are you the author of that meaning? Did you invent it? After all, you had only made the scribbles to differentiate the rock from the others in the game you invent.’

It comes back to a question of meaning. I want to say that there is no such thing as the ‘inventor’ either, if by this we mean a solid subject to which we can attribute the act of knowlingly bestowing meaning.

I consider the ‘invention’ to be a small subset of the overall perpetuation of meaning. Not all inventions, further, need necessarily be of the functional or teleological type. Although there are many instances in which invention is preconceived beforehand - as your examples describe - I maintain that every act of creation is not so bound. Because meaning is such a broad concept, it is possible that in this narrow regard we are simply talking about different things.

However consider this example of creation which is not preconceived;

‘You are sitting at the piano, improvising. You start to play, yet unbeknownst to you, many of the strings are out of tune. However they are all out of tune in just such a manner that today your recording is going to, by incredible coincidence, form a section of Chopin’s second piano concerto. However, as you are deaf, you will not realise that you have just invented a new way to play this concerto, which in any case is not due to any premeditation on your part, as you were simply improvising and had no idea either what you sounded like, or that the strings happened to be out of tune in just the manner that they in fact are.’

(Additionally, the fact that the invention exists for a time without being recognised as such (i.e. before the first person views the recording) does not mean that this person, the first to conceive of the invention as such, is therein made the inventor.)

It would little sense to appeal that the act of invention comes when someone else, listening to the recorded video of this event, suddening conceives of what is taking place. He would hardly be the creator on this account.

No I am not really saying this.

Well this goes back to what I said here;

Simply substitute ‘originary’ for ‘free’, and vice verse.

Regards,

James

James,

I sense that you are diving between definitions.

For instance, you might invent a new use for an something extant.

Comprehend that all “invention” is finding new uses for something extant. It is putting extant things in new relation to each other. This relation is simply not constrained to the imagined intensions that supposedly put extant things into “new” relation to each other. Key to this is your observation (below) on freewill and the positing of a subject, who definitively imagines things is state “x” or state “y”. A process is always overdetermined by (historical) conceptions of its constitution, and so also ever breaks free from them.

I want to say that there is no such thing as the ‘inventor’ either, if by this we mean a solid subject to which we can attribute the act of knowlingly bestowing meaning.

To me, this idea should be the focus of your thinking.

Dunamis

I wrote;

You wrote;

And so it is. I will plead semantics on this one, as it ought to be obvious that I have no single argumentative position in this thread; rather several as I try to confront each response on its own terms.

I thought that this was well phrased.

I wrote;

You wrote;

And so it is, once again. :wink:

Regards,

James