If there is a God, is he Good?

Philosophy Forums Religion and Spirituality
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Something that has been plaguing my mind recently is this: All things in nature are made up of atoms, which are a collection of protons, neutrons, and electrons eternally striving to be perfectly balanced. Most religions argue that their respective God is good. Most religions also argue that good is stronger than evil, and will eventually win the contest between the two forces. But if that is true, and God is inexorably moving the world toward good, that represents a lack of balance. My thought is that perhaps God, if he exists, is not necessarily a force for good, but rather a force for balance.

Something else to throw at the hardcore religious types. You tend to argue that God made man in his own likeness. Man is constructed of the same balancing atoms as the rest of the world, which you believe God also created. The world is those balancing atoms…so wouldn’t God be similar?

I realize my argument may contain jumps in logic, or perhaps may not contain any true semblance of logic. However, this is my thought…so I invite criticism.

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God has many atributes. Some are unknowable. You can not define God, because by definition, God is undefined.

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If God is truly undefined, how would one know that God has many attributes?

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because undefined means undefined number of attributes.

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God, at least, cannot be described by a human perception, especially the meager symbol of “Good”.

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I feel, and I stress that I feel since my knowledge is assumed when broken down, that God, this eternal, this One, this all encompassing stuff, may be defined by what we call balance (that you have mentioned, Socratic_Miasma), but will be separated, by some, into good and evil, even though they know not the nature of existence. I dare not even label the mysterious with the idea of balance, considering my mortal naivete.

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((I apologize for triple posting, dock me on the count if you want.))

To address the assumption that man was created in God’s image, I would say that it is absurd. It seems to be more of a mockery than truth. And why the hell would It feel the need to pass on this message? (Would someone direct me to the passage that refers to this in the Bible?)

Defining God is ridiculous. What arrogance… We can do our best to define the way we live though. Succumb to the mystery.

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If there is a God, it wouldn’t be a question of is He good or bad. It would be a question of is He JUST because that’s what we would expect from Him, justice! If God started to be good and forgiving then who would punish the criminals? There would be no fate and life would be meaningless. But the fact that we are all unique and go through unique experiences means that fate is at work somewhere and so there’s a God and so life is not meaningless but may appear so at times. Personally I feel that life is its own God for the simple reason that we KNOW that, “Life has a way of taking care of itself.”

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BeenaJain,

I already told you God is undefined, why are you still trying to define God. God in his infinite wisdom has shown us all we can ever hope to know about him in the bible.

Read Job, Job complained to God who told him that God is so great that we as limited human beings will never understand his grand plan. So there is no point try to understand all of God’s characteristics. Instead, focus on the knowable in the bible.

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God said “I am”. Therefore he is everthing that is.

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Pinnacle of Reason,
Where am I trying to define God? I’m just saying that life is the same as God, so big that it is difficult to understand it. But now I’ll say, that does not mean that we can’t try to understand it.

And my dear there is no God in this world who will say that He is so GREAT and that we are puny in comparison. Which truly enlightened one comes and says, “Hey! Look, I’m the enlightened one.” Which great God would say, “I’m the greatest?” My dear the truly great never really know how great they are. Remember, “A diamond doesn’t know its own worth?” On top of that the truly great even if they do know they are more superior, they will never make a show of it. Which world do you live in? In the world of STUPID “Job” who doesn’t like using his commonsense?

You wan’t to live there, not my problem. Just don’t dictate to me not to try and understand God just 'cause you CAN’T find enough commonsense !!!

And Jub Jub,
There is no God who comes and says, “I am.” He won’t pretend to be who He is, He will SHOW you who HE is.

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A few responses to various comments for you guys.

  1. Pinnacle of Reason,
    I’m not arguing that undefined means undefined. I’m simply arguing that undefined means precisely that the exact or even general number of attributes in this case is unknown. So it can be equally likely that God has 1 attribute, or uncounted millions, BECAUSE he is undefined.

  2. i-zacharia
    I would argue that, being human, we can only attempt to define things we do not understand in human terms and concepts. Although meager, the concept of “good” is universally recognized and understood. We must use these types of concepts to glean meaning from that which we seek to understand. After all, without eventual understanding, does philosophy have a point?

  3. Jub Jub
    You have hit my basic point again. According to the Bible, God said “I am”. Everything that exists may be analyzed and explored down to its very core structure of atoms. Thus, if God is indeed everything, could we not seek to understand God by analyzing that everything which we find? If we cannot, then it might very well follow that God does not exist.

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Apologies for the second post in a row, but…

 Pinnacle of Reason, I agree wholly with Beenajain on one point.  To enter a philosophical forum and reply to a question concerning God by saying "God cannot be defined" is a bit silly.  This is philosophy...the quest for definition and understanding.
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The term, “God”, applied loosely could basically be, “one who is more advanced than myself”. Therefore, to an animal, a human might appear to be God-like. Yet, in that context the question of “Is God good” would probably boil down to “no”; humans are basically bad.

Therefore, the application of the term God to a being more advanced than us would probably come down to the same view that God would not be good. Just depends on your definition of good, and your perspective, I suppose.

A well loved dog might answer yes, despite the fact that his master is Hitler. From the dog’s perspective, he gets attention, food and shelter. The dog has no concept of genocide.

I suppose my argument would be that we might argue a God to be good, but that would be presumptuous, optimistic and woefuly shortsighted.

Power is a corrupting force. If you could be bad, would you? Why apply a different set of groundrules to another entity, god-like, or not?

(Incidentally, Hi. I’m a first-poster and thought I would dive straight in. My name is Leigh and I am from Manchester, England. The spelling of my name is the English way, not the girls’ way, therefore, I am a bloke!)

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What’s undefined?

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Some call it faith!

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Do people know that we humans have limits?
As I said in my previous posts, God is undefined. Basically, God is unknowable. We only know a certain section of God revealed through the Bible.
Now, if everyone just calm down and think about what I said. It makes perfect sense.

hehe, what is undefined. Undefined is by definition undefined. lol. hahahha.

Once you have accepted we have limits, everything becomes clearer. We see through our eyes, we’ll never know what a bat sees. Therefore, there is no point trying to “see” like a bat.

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Hi everybody,
Like a lot of words that we use, “good” has become subject to interpretation. What you might consider good in one point in your life can then be considered bad later on. We have the tendency to change our concept of “good” during our life. To attribute the word to God would not be an accurate description, since God is constant, or never changes. I would say that God is the source of enlightenment.

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Philosophy, at it’s best, can only direct the thinker to his personal
understanding of the mysterious.

The philosophical points that we may reach collectively are blunt compared to the infinte reach of existence and being.

We would do well to look deeper into the essence of a proposed One through our solitary mind’s eye, instead of focusing on an all too vague term. Terms impress each other differently, and will find their definition through one’s exlcusive understanding.

You will reach a point when looking outward will be a step backwards from enlightenment. What will you do when death has you in His clutches and you will have no one to propose these questions to?

Through honest and thorough introspection one may begin to worry more about the manner in which he lives, as opposed to which label one will apply to his beliefs.

I see it as an impossibility to still bear the burden of fear when you have been honest to yourself, your friends, and the divine One.

The answers we may uncover can only be a glimpse into the infinite majesty of the unknown. I would bet that priest, scientist, and philosopher would agree.

Now, Socratic_Miasma, I agree that we must still inquire into the essence of the mysterious, but our collective effort has it’s limits, for we will be left alone before we part this planet.

So, I advocate personal understanding, as opposed to assimilating a man-made doctrine, which undoubtedly has been corrupted by our clumsiness. I say again, your quest boils down to an individual one. There lies the most important aspect of philosophy. That which is significant to your isolated focus.

The only habitat that can support a philosophical point is in the mind of the individual. There, where the battle between spirit and mind rages, is where one must come to terms with his limits as a man.

I would also argue that with perpetual warfare smattering the globe, that the concept of “good”, is quite obviously not universally understood. However, it is still a concept that we find in every culture.

The epicenter of the war being fought with philosophy takes place upon a neuron rich landscape. The only enemy that you can afford to affront is that of your own illusion.

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100% agree.

One can’t measure the undefined using a 30cm ruler. hahahha