If you cannot love an eternal torment god

[Jayson]

I would somewhat hesitate to claim any translation of the Christian Bible as correct in translation, as this is impossible to determine anthropologically, however, I will say that Young’s Literal translation does a very fair job of representing exactly what it titles itself as; delivering a literal translation of the words in the Christian Bible.
That said, unfortunately, because it is strictly literal, one has to do a lot of leg work for oneself to understand some terms that could be otherwise paraphrased as to the meanings for the readers (for instance, what 40 [which only reads as 40 in literal translation] as a day count implies when discussing fasting).

But, Young’s Literal is a very good compendium.

This said, however, if you want the best literal translation…then learn Ancient Hebrew and Greek and read the original manuscript copies.

Until then, I have little sympathy with the charge for literal translations of the Bible for authenticity.

In a nutshell, I’m saying if you are going to charge about getting a more authentic version of the Bible to see the right message, then I’m going to stand here and say go learn how to read the original copy.
It’s poor tact to condemn translations when one is holding a translation.

[rodgertutt]

@TheStumps

In a nutshell, I’m saying if you are going to charge about getting a more authentic version of the Bible to see the right message, then I’m going to stand here and say go learn how to read the original copy.
It’s poor tact to condemn translations when one is holding a translation.

Some of us (including me) are not smart enough to “learn how to read the original copy.”
So I do what I perceive to be the next best thing which IMO is
THE CONCORDANT LITERAL TRANSLATION

On the Concordant site it says by way of introduction

Our principal works are the Concordant Literal New Testament with Keyword Concordance, and the Concordant Version of the Old Testament. Our research efforts are centered upon the many issues involved in discovering the meaning of the original Scripture declarations themselves. Then we seek to determine how we may best translate these same Scriptures, endeavoring to do so objectively, accurately, and consistently. Our translation principles, both of vocabulary and grammatical analysis, govern all that we do.

We first seek to determine essence of word meaning; wherever possible, according to internal scriptural evidence. For each Original word, then, we assign a STANDARD English word. To facilitate a readable English translation, additional synonyms or other concordant variants are also used, as needed. In nearly all cases, any such standards, synonyms, and variants are used exclusively for a single word in the Original, thereby eliminating almost all “crosswiring” between languages. Thus a substantial formal correspondency is maintained between the original and receptor language. It is such very principles of translation themselves, together with our many years of refining our efforts according to these principles, which distinguish our work, and its results, from that of others.

[Jayson]

I think that’s fantastic and good.
Truly it is.

But I see it as no different than any translation of the Christian Bible in terms of authenticity to accuracy.
It requires a faith, not on God, but upon the translators choices of which (by the way, there are many options often) English word to select for a given Greek or Hebrew word.

I get into discussions about these things quite often around here.
You can look at several instances where tradition itself has words accepted as translations which simply do not exist in the dictionary as the meaning of the word; it simply occurs.

About the only Bible I am overtly outspoken against is the King James Version; due to blatant and tremendously horridly doctrinal affecting errors in it’s translation.

However, my original point still stands.
It seems odd to ridicule one format over another when neither can claim authenticity over the other; literal or interpretive.
I can only say that literal is nice to have regardless because it let’s you know what the raw words were.
Interpretive’s are nice to have as well, as they let you know the possible meanings of the literal.

Ideally, running a literal and three interpretive’s is a fairly decent method of getting a well rounded understanding of what a section can translate to; what you think about it, and what you like it to mean out of the literal.

Each interpretive is used to see another perspective on the same passage.
The literal is used to understand the core root of words that were more-or-less a form of the Greek or Hebrew words that existed.

Together, shrug yeah, you can get a pretty decent picture put together.
Apart…probably not nearly as easily.

[rodgertutt]

Forgive me if I posted this before. My 71 year old memory frequently lets me down.

Personally, I am a “Christian Biblical Universal Transformationist.”

I’m convinced that after we have thought the very best thoughts about God, we can be sure that He is even better than that because He is able to do above what we can even think, Ephesians 3:20. And IMHO I cannot think any higher thoughts than universal transformation.

I believe that after our resurrection from the dead God will eventually somehow transform every second of everyone’s suffering into something better that it happened.

That includes both the unexplained and seemingly unjustifiable suffering that we all experience in varying degrees, as well as what the Bible calls “kolasis aionion” which means age-during corrective chastisement that everyone who needs it will experience.

I believe that God will eventually fit every unique individual into His master plan in a positive way that necessitates their unique temporary involvement in evil and suffering that will enable God to manifest, and glorify, and magnify the many facets of His character in a way that uniquely involves that person, and everyone else involved in that person’s life too.

I believe that God has both the ability and the intention to save all fallen creatures from everything from which they need to be saved, and He will not fail to do so.

I believe that God’s determination, within the wise counsel of His DECRETIVE will which is that which MUST occur, to eventually rid all of creation from suffering, will in every case, overcome the strongest will that is temporarily opposed to God’s PRECEPTIVE will which is what His creatures OUGHT to do.

I believe the only mistake that I am probably making is in grossly underestimating just how gloriously God will achieve this universal transformation through what Christ accomplished for everyone by His death and resurrection, through the power in the blood of his cross. That is the kind of God that I see in the Bible.

Realizing that he is including everyone without exception, the following quote by universalist Dr. Leslie Weatherhead nicely sums up what I believe. I’ve had it memorized for many years and love to quote it frequently.

“God’s purposes are so vast and glorious, beyond all guessing now, that when they are achieved and consummated, all our sufferings and sorrows of today, even the agonies that nearly break our faith, the disasters that well nigh overwhelm us, shall, seen from that fair country where God’s age long dreams come true, bulk as little as bulk now the pieces of a broken toy upon a nursery floor, over which, thinking that all our little world was in ruins, we cried ourselves to sleep.”

[Jayson]

@rodgertutt

He is able to do above what we can even think, Ephesians 3:20. And IMHO I cannot think any higher thoughts than universal transformation.

This is good for you surely!

That includes both the unexplained and seemingly unjustifiable suffering that we all experience in varying degrees, as well as what the Bible calls “kolasis aionion” which means age-during corrective chastisement that everyone who needs it will experience.

And this is good for anyone that see’s life with suffering.
For my life, I do not, as one example, see life as such.
But that is another discussion.

More to the point, I would say that this is all good for you, very good.
But how does this, which is good for you, invalidate the perspectives of other Christian perspectives and interpretations for others?

Truly it invalidates it for you, and this seems good for you naturally.
But how is it invalid for others to approach God differently?

[rodgertutt]

@TheStumps

But how does this, which is good for you, invalidate the perspectives of other Christian perspectives and interpretations for others?

I don’t think it does invalidate other Christian perspectives and interpretations.
I think everyone is responding to the strongest influences to which their mind have been subjected.

@TheStumps

Truly it validates it for you, and this seems good for you naturally.
But how is it invalid for others to approach God differently?

I think everone approaches God in whatever way they have been taught to.
I think each person is unique and will find out what works best for them as unique individuals.

Yet, in the end I believe that God will work everything out for the good of everyone.

[Jayson]

This is really good, respectful, and peaceful!

But I cannot understand this perspective existing with one of your other perspectives in apparent ease:

That’s why I want to say right at the outset that many of the links posted here show that a correctly (literally, not interpretively) translated Bible actually teaches universal salvation, not eternal torment, or even annihilation.

How is there a correctly translated Bible if at the same time God will work everything out for the good of everyone in whatever way they have been taught to approach God?

Perhaps this could be said that this is a correctly translated Bible for anyone seeking the same fulfillment of life and lacks what you once lacked in it prior to this perspective?

[rodgertutt]

@TheStumps

This is really good, respectful, and peaceful!

But I cannot understand this perspective existing with one of your other perspectives in apparent ease:

That’s why I want to say right at the outset that many of the links posted here show that a correctly (literally, not interpretively) translated Bible actually teaches universal salvation, not eternal torment, or even annihilation.

How is there a correctly translated Bible if at the same time God will work everything out for the good of everyone in whatever way they have been taught to approach God?

Perhaps this could be said that this is a correctly translated Bible for anyone seeking the same fulfillment of life and lacks what you once lacked in it prior to this perspective?

Many people suffer extreme mental and emotional distress over not being able to love an endless-hell god.
These people are glad to learn that there is evidence that the Bible does not support such a concept of God.
Some people seem to be able to go through life without the endless-hell idea bothering them at all.
I’m truly happy for them!
I would not want my worst enemy to experience the horrfic twelve year nervous breakdown I experienced 1966-78 over my inability to love an endless-hell god.
I’m 71 years old now.

[Jayson]

I see your presentational perspective then.
You are trying to say that if you see God as such, and it causes you distress, that a perspective exists in which God does not have to be cast as such a figure.

Well that is certainty healthy and good I would think!

[rodgertutt]

@TheStumps

I see your presentational perspective then.
You are trying to say that if you see God as such, and it causes you distress, that a perspective exists in which God does not have to be cast as such a figure.

Well that is certainty healthy and good I would think!

I would agree.

My testimony contains information that, according to the many entries in my guest book, and the many positive emails in my email file folders, is helping many people. My guest book can be accessed towards the bottom of my front page at
greater-emmanuel.org/Hope4You/

My guest book only holds 150 messages. Then the oldest ones are automatically deleted to make room for the newest ones.

Also see the testimonies at
tentmaker.org/visitorcomments.htm

Also see
tentmaker.org/articles/hells_fruit.html

Also see
greater-emmanuel.org/Hope4You/consequences.html
(if necessary, copy and paste into browser address bar)

[Jayson]

Oh well thank you for all the clarity, but I don’t have a need for this perspective in my life.
I don’t see God negatively to begin with.

But I think your ambition is good!

[ochaye]

@rodgertutt

If you cannot love an eternal torment god

For the first 500 years after Christ, universalism was the prevailing doctrine believed and taught by the Christian church.

The New Testament does not support universalism, and no extant author after the NT is orthodox until the 2nd millennium. In other words, there was no church known to history in the specified period other than in the apostolic period.

If eternal torment seems an excessive fate, it may be useful to assume, pro tem., that it is not, and work back from that; then one might reach a conclusion about unredeemed human nature that one did not entertain previously.

[rodgertutt]

@ochaye

@rodgertutt

If you cannot love an eternal torment god

For the first 500 years after Christ, universalism was the prevailing doctrine believed and taught by the Christian church.

The New Testament does not support universalism

SCRIPTURAL PROOFS THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES UNIVERSAL SALVATION

       BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED – John Wesley Hanson
       [tentmaker.org/books/BibleThr ... ained.html](http://www.tentmaker.org/books/BibleThreateningsExplained.html) 

tentmaker.org/articles/unive … -bible.htm ?

richardwaynegarganta.com/Underst … %20One.htm

tentmaker.org/books/InFavorCh20.html

tentmaker.org/books/ScripturalProofs.html

tentmaker.org/books/Bible-Proofs-modern.html

haroldlovelace.com/lovelacelist.php

auburn.edu/~allenkc/univ3.html

tentmaker.org/FAQ/fewsaved.htm

tentmaker.org/articles/Hell_ … rever.html

Translations That Do Not Teach Eternal Torment
tentmaker.org/books/GatesOfHell.html

Also see four scriptural expositions expounding Universal Reconciliation at

concordant.org/expohtml/HumanDestiny/doubts.html

concordant.org/expohtml/HumanDestiny/1cor15.html

concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/index.html

gtft.org/Library/condon/Question … nswers.htm

Regarding the most common argument that the same word for “punishment” is also used for “life” see the following:

savior-of-all.com/aionian.html

All three of these articles should be studied with care, especially the third one.

concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/eon1.html
concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/eon2.html
concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/eon3.html

also see

concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/aion.html
concordant.org/version/tranprin.html
richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm

A little test about the word “ALL” that’s found in Scripture.

If Truth is changed to not be all inclusive, when the context renders that it should be it then becomes error.

Reconsider the following Scriptures, without using any preconceived thoughts or forced interpretation upon them. This may be more difficult to do than first realized, because we all resort to an immediate interpretation of something based on our past understandings of the verse.

The darkest doctrine ever devised by men was that of an “eternal suffering” for the billions of souls that die lost without Christ.

godfire.net/eby/circularity.html

Like wolves among the sheep, carnally-minded men within the church system found it very effective to use the fear of an unending hell to control the masses that enter their religion.

Unfortunately this doctrine has remained at large in Christianity as a whole.

The Lord Jesus said, “When I am lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men to myself.” - John 12:32
LOOK AT THE VERSES WITH THE WORD ALL

Savior of all, especially believers (1 Tim 4:9-11)
(see why “especially” is inclusive, and cannot mean “only”)
tentmaker.org/Dew/Dew7/D7-Es … lieve.html

God wills that all mankind be saved (1 Tim 2:4)

Operating all in accord with counsel of His will (Eph 1:11)

In Adam all dying; in Christ shall all be vivified (1 Cor 15:21-23)

It says “in Christ shall all,” not “all who are in Christ.”

One offense for all mankind for condemnation… (Rom 5:18-19)

Lamb of God taking away sin of the world (John 1:29)

Correspondent ransom for all (1 Tim 2:6)

Every knee bowing in the Name of Jesus (Phil 2:9; Is 45:23)
“in” is the literal Greek translation. See Young’s Literal Translation
and every tongue acclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord.

And we know that anyone who acclaims that Jesus Christ is Lord,
especially when it is to God’s glory without any hypocrisy is saved for 1Corinthians 12:3 says so.

Locks all in stubbornness; to be merciful to all (Rom 11:30-32)

All created … to reconcile all (Col 1:16-20)

He should be tasting death for the sake of everyone (Heb 2:9)

That the world might be saved thru Him (John 3:17)

God was in Christ conciliating the world to Himself (2 Cor 5:18)

For our sins, not ours only but the whole world (1 John 2:2)

[ochaye]

@rodgertutt

@ochaye

@rodgertutt

If you cannot love an eternal torment god

For the first 500 years after Christ, universalism was the prevailing doctrine believed and taught by the Christian church.

talk.guardian.co.uk/WebX/Guardia … Y1idVc3wd@
The New Testament does not support universalism

SCRIPTURAL PROOFS THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES UNIVERSAL SALVATION

It is true that the Bible teaches that the sacrifice of Christ atoned for all sins. It is not true, however, that all will be saved. Those who are saved are those who accept the sacrifice as necessary. Those who claim to be good enough without that sacrifice make their own ‘payment’, which will not suffice. There are abundant warnings in the New Testament to the truth of that.

[rodgertutt]

You said

It is not true that all will be saved.

The contents of the links that I posted in my last message prove you are wrong.
Here they are again.

SCRIPTURAL PROOFS THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES UNIVERSAL SALVATION

       BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED – John Wesley Hanson
       [tentmaker.org/books/BibleThr ... ained.html](http://www.tentmaker.org/books/BibleThreateningsExplained.html) 

tentmaker.org/articles/unive … -bible.htm ?

richardwaynegarganta.com/Underst … %20One.htm

tentmaker.org/books/InFavorCh20.html

tentmaker.org/books/ScripturalProofs.html

tentmaker.org/books/Bible-Proofs-modern.html

haroldlovelace.com/lovelacelist.php

auburn.edu/~allenkc/univ3.html

tentmaker.org/FAQ/fewsaved.htm

tentmaker.org/articles/Hell_ … rever.html

Translations That Do Not Teach Eternal Torment
tentmaker.org/books/GatesOfHell.html

Also see four scriptural expositions expounding Universal Reconciliation at

concordant.org/expohtml/HumanDestiny/doubts.html

concordant.org/expohtml/HumanDestiny/1cor15.html

concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/index.html

gtft.org/Library/condon/Question … nswers.htm

Regarding the most common argument that the same word for “punishment” is also used for “life” see the following:

savior-of-all.com/aionian.html

All three of these articles should be studied with care, especially the third one.

concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/eon1.html
concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/eon2.html
concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/eon3.html

also see

concordant.org/expohtml/TheEons/aion.html
concordant.org/version/tranprin.html
richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm

A little test about the word “ALL” that’s found in Scripture.

If Truth is changed to not be all inclusive, when the context renders that it should be it then becomes error.

Reconsider the following Scriptures, without using any preconceived thoughts or forced interpretation upon them. This may be more difficult to do than first realized, because we all resort to an immediate interpretation of something based on our past understandings of the verse.

The darkest doctrine ever devised by men was that of an “eternal suffering” for the billions of souls that die lost without Christ.

godfire.net/eby/circularity.html

Like wolves among the sheep, carnally-minded men within the church system found it very effective to use the fear of an unending hell to control the masses that enter their religion.

Unfortunately this doctrine has remained at large in Christianity as a whole.

The Lord Jesus said, “When I am lifted up from the earth, I will draw all men to myself.” - John 12:32
LOOK AT THE VERSES WITH THE WORD ALL

Savior of all, especially believers (1 Tim 4:9-11)
(see why “especially” is inclusive, and cannot mean “only”)
tentmaker.org/Dew/Dew7/D7-Es … lieve.html

God wills that all mankind be saved (1 Tim 2:4)

Operating all in accord with counsel of His will (Eph 1:11)

In Adam all dying; in Christ shall all be vivified (1 Cor 15:21-23)

It says “in Christ shall all,” not “all who are in Christ.”

One offense for all mankind for condemnation… (Rom 5:18-19)

Lamb of God taking away sin of the world (John 1:29)

Correspondent ransom for all (1 Tim 2:6)

Every knee bowing in the Name of Jesus (Phil 2:9; Is 45:23)
“in” is the literal Greek translation. See Young’s Literal Translation
and every tongue acclaiming that Jesus Christ is Lord.

And we know that anyone who acclaims that Jesus Christ is Lord,
especially when it is to God’s glory without any hypocrisy is saved for 1Corinthians 12:3 says so.

Locks all in stubbornness; to be merciful to all (Rom 11:30-32)

All created … to reconcile all (Col 1:16-20)

He should be tasting death for the sake of everyone (Heb 2:9)

That the world might be saved thru Him (John 3:17)

God was in Christ conciliating the world to Himself (2 Cor 5:18)

For our sins, not ours only but the whole world (1 John 2:2)

[ochaye]

@rodgertutt

You said

It is not true that all will be saved.

The contents of the links that I posted in my last message prove you are wrong.
Here they are again.

I’m not going to plough through those. Netiquette (remember that?) requires that links be provided as confirmation of explicit, existing post content, not as prime sources.

[rodgertutt]

Everyone will choose to believe whatever they are convinced is the truth about what the Bible teaches. I posted on this forum to give people an alternate point of view. Had I known that one existed I never would have had a twelve year nervous breakdown 1966-78 over my inability to love a god who would allow anyone to WANT to or have to suffer forever rather than eventually reach out for the salvation that God has provided. I’m 71 years old now.

THE FOLLOWING HAS, AND ALWAYS WILL BE TRUE REGARDING THE DEBATE ABOUT ETERNAL TORMENT

The argument about “eternal hell” nearly always gets bogged down with the words, “My Greek scholars are more reliable than your Greek scholars,” and the result is nearly always a stalemate.
My Greek scholars are Louis Abbott and the many Greek scholars he quotes in chapters three and twelve. Copy and paste into Google
AN ANALYTICAL STUDY OF WORDS or click on
tentmaker.org/books/asw/index.html

Also see THE SCHOLAR’S CORNER FOR THE STUDY OF BIBLICAL UNIVERSALISM at
tentmaker.org/ScholarsCorner.html

If you think it glorifies God more to let some of His creatures suffer forever, or annihilate them, then you keep believing that.

But if you think it glorifies God more to eventually meet everyone on the level of their greatest and deepest need which is a change in their stubborn will, then know that there is plenty of evidence in the Bible that that is exactly what God is like.

ON THE BASIS OF HAVING STUDIED THE EVIDENCE AVAILABLE TO YOU CHOOSE ONE
Choose to believe that the Bible teaches that God will sustain people alive in an inescapable state of eternal suffering.
Or
Choose to believe that God will annihilate (cause them to cease to exist) anyone who does not become a Christian before they die.
Or
Choose to believe what the following expositors reveal about what the Bible teaches.
Copy and paste into Google
THE SAVIOUR OF THE WORLD SERIES
tentmaker.org/articles/savio … /index.htm
godfire.net/eby/saviour_of_the_world.html
Or
ABSOLUTE ASSURANCE IN JESUS CHRIST
tentmaker.org/books/Absolute … hrist.html
richardwaynegarganta.com/4Vi … vation.htm
sigler.org/slagle/absolute.htm (the author, Charles Slagle’s personal website containing many other good writings about the subject)
richardwaynegarganta.com/4Vi … vation.htm
Or
UNIVERSAL SALVATION UNIVERSITY
richardwaynegarganta.com/universalsalvation.htm
Or
CHRISTIAN BIBLICAL UNIVERSALISM
christian-universalism.com/links.html
Or
CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALISM
christianuniversalist.org
Or
BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED – John Wesley Hanson
tentmaker.org/books/BibleThr … ained.html
Or
ETERNAL DEATH ANNIHILATION?
tentmaker.org/books/EternalDeath.html
Or
Just What Do You Mean By The Word DESTRUCTION?
hell-fact-or-fable.com/destruction3.html
Or
WILL UNBELIEVERS BE ANNIHILATED (If necessary copy and paste the following url into your browser address bar)
lighthouselibrary.com/read.p … or=||KNOCH, ADOLPH E||&type=&what=author
I myself, along with many others with whom I am acquainted, simply cannot love a god who would let anyone choose themselves into an inescapable state of eternal suffering (Arminian), or suffer forever just because they were born into the human race (Calvinist). Neither can we love a god who would snuff us out of existence just because we didn’t hear about Jesus before we died.

But we CAN love a God Who, because of His Son’s death and resurrection, through the power in the blood of His cross, will sooner or later save all fallen creatures from everything from which they need to be saved (including their stubborn wills). That’s the God that the above expositors see in the Bible.
And that’s the God to Whom I joyously yield my heart in complete and total abandonment.
SO FOR US THE CHOICE IS EASY
See
How I recovered from a 12 year nervous breakdown (1966-78) I’m 71 years old.

I could have avoided a horrific twelve year nervous breakdown (1966-78) had I known as a youth about the following information concerning what a correctly (literally, not interpretively) translated Bible teaches.

You can also access most of the following writings through Google by typing in the title.

BOOKS THAT SHOW THAT THE BIBLE TEACHES UNIVERSAL SALVATION,
THE ENTIRE CONTENTS OF WHICH CAN BE READ ONLINE

If necessary, copy and paste the following urls into the address bar.

0. ABSOLUTE ASSURANCE IN JESUS CHRIST – Charles Slagle
   tentmaker.org/books/Absolute … hrist.html
1. HOPE BEYOND HELL - Gerry Beauchemin (recently published)
   hopebeyondhell.net/Revised_Edition.pdf
2. CHRIST TRIUMPHANT - Thomas Allin
   tentmaker.org/books/ChristTriumphant.htm
3. THE BIBLE HELL - J.W. Hanson
   tentmaker.org/books/TheBibleHell.html
4. THE ORIGIN AND HISTORY OF THE DOCTRINE OF ENDLESS PUNISHMENT – Thomas Thayer
   tentmaker.org/books/OriginandHistory.html
5. THE OUTCOME OF INFINITE GRACE – Dr. Loyal Hurley
   tentmaker.org/books/infinitegrace.htm
6. JUST WHAT DO YOU MEAN “HELL” - J. Preston Eby
   tentmaker.org/articles/savio … d/hell.htm
7. ONE HUNDRED SCRIPTURAL PROOFS THAT JESUS CHRIST WILL SAVE ALL MANKIND - Thomas Whittemore
   tentmaker.org/books/ScripturalProofs.html
8. TWENTY-FOUR SERMONS ON UNIVERSAL SALVATION – John Bovee Dods
   tentmaker.org/Bovee2.htm#Top
9. THE SECOND DEATH AND THE RESTITUTION OF ALL THINGS – Andrew Jukes
   tentmaker.org/restitutionindex.htm
10. ONE HUNDRED AND FIFTY REASONS FOR BELIEVING IN THE FINAL SALVATION OF ALL MANKIND – Erasmus Manford
    tentmaker.org/books/150reasons.html
11. THE RICH MAN AND LAZARUS – J. Patching
    tentmaker.org/books/RichMana … ching.html
12. BIBLE TRANSLATIONS THAT DO NOT TEACH ETERNAL TORMENT – Gary Amirault
    tentmaker.org/books/GatesOfHell.html
13. AION – AIONIOS – John Wesley Hanson
    tentmaker.org/books/Aion_lim.html
14. BIBLE THREATENINGS EXPLAINED – John Wesley Hanson
    tentmaker.org/books/BibleThr … ained.html
15. THE CASE OF JUDAS, ETCETERA
    tentmaker.org/books/asw/Chapter16.html
16. THE PROBLEM OF EVIL – John Essex
    AND THE ROLE OF THE ADVERSARY – James Webb
    tentmaker.org/articles/TheProblemofEvil.html
17. HIS ACHIEVEMENT ARE WE – James Coram
    concordant.org/expohtml/HisAchie … index.html
18. THE RESTITUTION OF ALL THINGS – Andrew Jukes
    auburn.edu/~allenkc/jukes2.html
19. THE RESTITUTION OF ALL THINGS – George Hawtin
    godfire.net/restitutionHawtin.html
20. THE SAVIOUR OF THE WORLD SERIES – J. Preston Eby
    tentmaker.org/articles/savio … /index.htm
    ESPECIALLY THIS ONE IN THAT SERIES
    tentmaker.org/articles/savio … larity.htm
21. THE PURPOSE OF EVIL – A.P. Adams
    thegloryrd.com:80/apadams/evil.html
22. TEN REASONS NOT TO BELIEVE THE TEACHING OF ETERNAL TORTURE
    completerestorationinchrist. … s-not.html
23. IS HELL ETERNAL OR WILL GOD’S PLAN FAIL?
    archive.org/stream/willgodsp … 3/mode/2up
24. THE PROBLEM OF EVIL AND THE JUDGMENTS OF GOD – A.E. Knoch
    concordant.org/expohtml/TheP … index.html
25. GOD’S EONIAN PURPOSE
    gtft.org/Library/loudy/GodsE … pose00.htm
26. THE TRUE BASIS OF REDEMPTION – A.P. Adams
    tentmaker.org/articles/TrueB … Adams.html
27. TWO TREASURE HOUSES OF CHRISTIAN UNIVERSALIST ARTICLES
    auburn.edu/~allenkc/articles2.html
    tgulcm.tripod.com/cu/univart.html

[ochaye]

@rodgertutt

Everyone will choose to believe whatever they are convinced is the truth about what the Bible teaches.

What people can do is read selections from the Bible and say that all will be saved. Not otherwise, though.

[Jayson]

rodgertutt, I would ask that you make the assertions inside of ILP rather than relying on people leaving ILP to even read the assertions.
It’s fine to provide supporting sources, but please do not make posts that are impossible to consider the assertions of without leaving ILP to read through sites you are linking.

That is bordering on advertising and we have locked people down for that in the past.
You are engaging in conversation, and that is the difference between those that have been locked down in the past and yourself.
But please alter your method to placing your assertions (in full) within ILP itself.

Thank you.