In Defence of a Medieval Ontological Argument?

Can the ontological argument as presented by Anselm and Scotus be defended against the objections of Aquinas and Ockham?

I shall merge the arguments of Anselm and Scotus together as it shall benefit the conclusion that we have looked at the arguments themselves in their best possible light rather than as pieces drawn from separate individuals. It is my thesis that the ontological argument in question cannot be defended against the objections raised.

Pro et Contra

Part I.

That it can be defended

[Arg. I] That the definition ‘that being than which no greater can be conceived without contradiction’ fits the Christian God exactly and is the correct definition because God is all-knowing, all-powerful, all-good and unchanging.
[Arg. II] To understand the phrase ‘most perfect being’ is to already have conceived of it. This a priori proof equates the phrase ‘most perfect’ with ‘most real’, a Platonic influence. Upon conceiving of the most perfect being, it cannot exist solely within the subjects head for then it would have something more perfect than it. Therefore, this perfect being must exist.
[Arg. III] That God is infinite because a finite being would not be the most perfect being conceivable without contradiction, therefore God must be infinite.
[Arg. IV] It is possible that a being than which no greater can be conceived without contradiction can exist and that if possible, the existence of God is actual. Since positing the possible existence of God in the intellect only would be a contradiction, we should conclude that God has actual existence also.

To the contrary

[Arg. I] Anselm presents his definition as the crux of his argument for the existence of the Christian God. However it is impossible to conceive of a ‘being than which none greater can be conceived’. To undertake such a conceiving would be a task that took an indefinite period of time.
[Arg. II] Existence should not be used as a defining tool for concepts such as this, as existence is not a property of a thing. The process of definition is one that separates the particular thing from all other particular things by identifying the unique or specific characteristics of the particular thing. That something exists or not is not a defining characteristic – it tells us nothing more about the nature of the thing.
[Arg. III] The proposed transition from conceptual existence to actual existence is not a satisfactory one. The move from conceptual to actual existence via possibility is equally invalid as this allows any perfect thing in concept to exist in reality also.
[Arg IV] One cannot define something into existence – definitions serve only to provide us with the specifics of what to them observe in the actual world to see if the concept refers accurately to anything in existence.
[Arg. V] The proposing of an infinite being that is intensively infinite such as the all-powerful infinite God proposed by Anselm and Scotus leads to a contradiction.

Body of the Question

[Method of Procedure.] The method used to establish the thesis is to consider three separate propositions, the analysis of which shall lead to the required proof that the thesis is correct. [1] That an intensively infinite being could create motion in an immediate instant and in doing so create a contradiction; [2] that the proposition [Arg. I] in Pro (‘that it can be defended’) for the definition of God is an impossible one; and to cement the understanding reached by Scotus that [3] existence is not a property and [4] that our definitions do not necessitate reality.

Anselm’s argument requires that even the fool can reason the existence of God, although for him it does not particularly matter who is doing the reasoning. For Anselm the most perfect being conceivable is the Christian God, and He is all-knowing, all-good, all-powerful, eternal and unchanging. The question is if this concept of a perfect being exists only in his head or also in reality. If the former, this being is hardly the most perfect imaginable, as existence is a perfection greater than the opposite.

The important concern for Scotus is that God be intensively infinite (all-powerful etc), as this is a requirement of the scriptures these scholastics were so keen to unify with reason. There is no theoretical need for this postulation however, as all that needs to be explained can be explained with a finite God. As Ockham demonstrates, ‘plurality is not to be posited without necessity’. By this standard, the ontological analysis of particular situation should make reference to existing things only when the features of the question cannot be explained in any other way. Opinions may differ about whether or not the postulation of a new kind of beings is really necessary in certain situations, but general acceptance of Ockham’s Razor places the burden of proof firmly on the side of those proponents of a more complex view of the world.

Turning to proposition [1], we see that a being infinite in power and knowledge could produce motion in an immediate instant. If such a being undergoes a motion, or some other type of change then it must either gain a property it formerly lacked or alternatively lose a property it otherwise had. The third and only alternative is that the being both loses and gains properties or parts of properties. The contradiction arises when we consider the time within which the change occurs; that God might create motion in one instant (an individual moment in time that is undivided) and have property X at that time and also lose property X at the same time. In this situation God has both property X and lacks property X at the same moment in time; a contradiction.

There are two problems caused by the definition of God required by the ontological argument [2]. As Gaunilo stipulates, it is impossible to conceive of a being than which none greater can be conceived. The Great Chain of Being provides a framework within which to do so but the problems arise from the nature of conceptualising infinity and perfection; these are terms that cannot be properly understood and certainly not used in a definition that requires certain parameters and borders. One cannot conceive of an infinite thing because things are defined by their finite nature; a rock is a rock due to its strict borders and an infinite rock is no rock at all, merely a shapeless mass. To even begin to conceive of a being than which none greater can be conceived is to start on a task that cannot end by definition. The second problem and the second reason why the definition fails is that the consequences of such a position entail a logical acceptance of the existence of any perfect thing. A perfect twig is not considered to exist in reality by virtue of being conceived in the mind. A possible counter-concern is that of there being an ultimate perfection or extent of all things but this does not come about until the early modern period and as such is of no relevance to this analysis of the medieval objections.

That existence is not a property [3] deals with Anselm’s initial appeal to the idea that God necessarily exists due to how God is defined. The process of defining an object is one where the particular or special qualities and attributes of an object are identified so that we can separate it from other objects that have different or similar attributes. It is these distinguishing features that can legitimately be used for defining the object in question. By saying that God exists we are not saying anything of importance, in defining terms, about the object ‘God’. Anything that can be referred to exists in one way or another, be it conceptually or actually. With this in mind we cannot include the notion of existence in the definition of ‘God’, a realisation that is ultimately damaging for the ontological argument.

To be certain of the problems that exist with the argument we can allow the notion of existence to be used in the definition and defining of ‘God’ while still finding a major fault with the argument [4]. Even with the acceptance of the definition of God as including the notion of existence it would not logically follow that God as defined does exist. This is simply down to the fact that we cannot define something into existence. We can concoct concepts that define in many ways but nothing will guarantee that the thing referred to by the concept a priori actually exists in the actual world (or any actual world!). It is this gap between the concept and the actual that caused Anselm his gravest problem, and one that Scotus was not blind to in his use of Plantinga’s shift to cross the void between concept and actuality by means of possibility. However the transition can only be achieved via observation, so Scotus is forced to accept the argument as only persuasive at best.

[Conclusion] It would seem that Anselm borrowed from Plato without making proper sense of Plato. He effectively asserts that the more perfect something is (the higher its place in the chain of being) then the more actual and real it is. By definition God would be the most real entity in the world. What is unclear at this point is what Anselm means by perfect. He certainly intends for it to mean the same as it did for Plato, but this is entirely indefensible when used as a foundation for an a priori proof. We are not born with an innate sense of what perfection is, and hence we cannot know, a priori, what perfection means. It becomes steadily clear that Anselm has joined separate concepts into causal relationships that independently have unsatisfactory definitions. As Anselm can create a definition for a perfect and necessary being and label it as ‘God’ then it is fair to presume that his logic is valid for me if I create a definition for a necessary perfect pebble and label it as ‘the perfect pebble’. If Anselm’s proof was to be defended against the objections of Aquinas and Ockham then any deity in any faith could become actual simply by conceiving of it. I can hardly imagine this as being Anselm’s intended consequence (far from it).

Effectively what Anselm and later Scotus are attempting to do is will God into existence. No matter how much mental energy I put into the task, my perfect pebble will still not appear. Should you be unsure of the ontological argument’s failure then simply find my pebble; therein lies the answer.

Have you considered that in Anselm’s proof, ‘conceiving OF that which none greater can be conceived’ and that ‘conceiving THAT that which none greater can be conceived exists’ have two different meanings? I have a paper I wrote which makes sense to my friends and I (not to any prof though, I haven’t shown it to any) which may help. It should be our mandate to help eachother be the best we can, so I’ll try and post my paper.
PS - I’m not a philosophy major. I’m in pure math, but I still think I can contribute, that is if you don’t mind. Just give me a couple of days to post. I’m busy studying for exams.

I’d be interested in seeing your work, please do post.

I’m posting so that I get an email when light_eclipseca submits his paper.

Thank-you for waiting so long for me to post my thoughts on Anselm’s ontological argument. My exams are finally over and here are my thoughts on Anselm. Feel free to comment and complain about my thoughts. I don’t have a professor to look at my philosophy papers. So thank-you in advance to whoever reads this.

Here goes…

Anselm’s argument does come from “Proslogion”. What I have done is used Alvin Plantinga’s interpretation of Anselm’s argument in “God, Freedom, and Evil” [pg. 87-88]. Every other idea in this paper is my own.

Anselms argument in simplicity is as follows (with a couple of modifications for convenience of words):

God is that being which none greater can be conceived.

(1) God exists in the understanding but not in reality. (premise)
(2) Existence in reality is greater than existence in the understanding alone. (premise)
(3) God’s existence in reality is conceivable. (premise)

(4) If God did exist in reality, then he would be greater than what he is. [from (1) and (2)]

(5) It is conceivable that there is a being greater than God is. [(3) and (4)]

(6) It is conceivable that there be a being greater than the being that none greater can be conceived. [(5) by definition of “God”]

But surely (6) is absurd and self-contradictory; how could we conceive of a being greater than the being which none greater can be conceived? So we may conclude that:

(7) It is false that God exists in the understanding but not in reality.

So, to start off for rhetoric reasons I say that if this argument holds, then that would make the existence of God logically necessary. What if we use this same argument for the devil though? I do not suggest a perfect demon, but rather a being which none worse can be conceived.

The devil is that being which none worse can be conceived.

(1) The devil exists in the understanding but not in reality. (premise)
(2) It would be worse if the devil existed in reality rather than in the understanding alone. (premise)
(3) the devil’s existence in reality is conceivable. (premise)

(4) If the devil did exist in reality, then he would be worse than what he is. [from (1) and (2)]

(5) It is conceivable that there is a being worse than the devil is. [(3) and (4)]

(6) It is conceivable that there be a being worse than the being that none worse can be conceived. [(5) by definition of “devil”]

But surely (6) is absurd and self-contradictory; how could we conceive of a being worse than the being which none worse can be conceived? So we may conclude that:

(7) It is false that the devil exists in the understanding alone.

This argument thus makes the devil essential to logic. So as long as logic is the devil is, which makes me quite upset, because I know according to the scriptures that the devil was supposed to be a created being. I take the assumption logic was not created but always is (otherwise I cannot argue that the devil would not have been created if this argument holds; but most pre-suppositionalists hold this anyways).

So, making this argument truly made me think that there MUST be a problem with Anselm’s argument somewhere because I am a firm believer in the Christian Scriptures (not that the “devil argument” disproves Anselm’s argument–because it doesn’t).

The “devil argument” should be used only as rhetoric to loosen some Christian’s grip on Anselm’s argument.

Here is where a flaw in Anselm’s argument actually lies:

Anselm does a little play on words.
Between (6) and (7) there is a statement which exposes Anselm’s argument as a reductio ad absurdum proof. However, I would like to expose this statement as a twisting of statement (6).

Conceiving THAT there is a being greater than the being which none greater can be conceived (*)

is different from,

Conceiving OF a being greater than the being which none greater can be conceived. (*)’

When one says (*)’ one actually means conceiving OF WHAT A BEING greater than the being which none greater can be conceived IS.

So, conceiving THAT there is a being greater than that which none greater can be conceived OF is not self-contradictory.

I can conceive THAT there is someone better than the someone that I cannot conceive OF anyone better. I just cannot think OF what that being is like.

Basically, Anselm is saying that it is contradictory to be able to conceive of a being greater than the being which none greater can be conceived. But if one looks at (6), one can see that that is irrelevent. Conceiving OF the being which none greater can be coneived is different from conceiving THAT A BEING EXISTS which is greater than the being which none greater can be conceived of. One CAN conceive that there is something better than that which they cannot conceive anything greater. They just cannot think of what exactly that is, for then they would be concieve OF that thing. //

Thank-you again for reading this short though of mine.

Sorry, but a brief 2am skim of the thread suggests to me that there is no reason that we cannot just respond that “existence is not a predicate or a perfection” (Kant) and be done.

I am looking forward to your post.

My article isn’t about solving anything other than a medieval objection to a medieval problem. It’s purely an academic exercise - Kant has nothing to do with it.

Thanks for your post light_eclipseca. I wanted to add some further thoughts and changes I have made to my original article before replying to yours:

Self-criticisms:

[1] I’m not entirely sure that Arg. 1 in Pro is sufficient.

[2] I think Arg. 1 in contra needs to be explained in the argument summary first.

[3] There needs to be made explicit a reason why Aquinas and Ockham do not raise the objection in Arg. 2 in contra.

[4] Possibly there is no special need to differentiate between Arg. 4 in contra and Arg.3 in contra.

[5] My Method of Procedure might be taking liberties with Scotus. It would depend on your viewpoint. I also claim to present 4 arguments but that might only be 3 thanks to point [4] in criticisms.

[6] I claim that Ockham demonstrates that plurality is not to be posited without necessity but actually I think it might be safer to say he insists this without particularly condoning a demonstration.

[7] I’m not entirely happy with a couple of expressions I use regarding god and immediate motion in an immediate instant. Maybe this needs rephrasing.

[8] It is of course not God that gains and loses property x in an immediate instant, but the object He is changing.

[9] Perhaps I need to go into Platinga’s shift a little more as to the viability via observation.

You make a distinction between conception and thought. Isn’t the former a more detailed, rather than less, example of the latter? Could you define conception precisely to help fit your thesis? Or am I missing the underlying implication?

Hello F(r)iends,

He posted his response only one post BEFORE your own. The link is below.
http://ilovephilosophy.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?p=1711894#1711894

-Thirst4Helping

Let me try to be clearer…I don’t know if I know how to be, I can sometimes be a little confusing in the way I present myself. Tell me if what I type makes sense or not.

I make a distinction between thinking that there could possibly exist someone greater than I could imagine, and considering what that someone greater than I could imagine is. These are two completely different concepts. I’m almost sure of it.

For example:

Conceiving THAT there is something out there that I have never seen before, is different than conceiving OF the thing I have never seen.

Conceiving that there is something I have never seen before does not require that I define what it is I haven’t seen. The concept needn’t be defined in my mind, just that I can understand that there is something I haven’t seen.

However, conceiving of the thing I have never seen before requires that I define the thing which I haven’t seen. The concept must be defined in my mind.

Also,

Conceiving that there is someone greater than I could imagine does not require that I define EXACTLY who and what that “someone greater than I could imagine” is.

Conceiving of the someone greater than I could imagine requires that I be able to define exactly what and who that “someone greater than I can imagine” is.

And come to think of it, I think you are correct by saying that conception is more detailed than the thought, “that the thing exists”.

For instance, any Christian might say that heaven will be more wonderful than can be imagined. They can conveive THAT heaven exists, however they will admit to you that they cannot conceive OF (ie. everything it consists of) that heaven which they conceive exists. Does that make sense at all?

If it does then we apply it to the argument at (6) and at the small paragraph between (6) and (7).

(6) It is conceivable THAT there be a being greater than the being than which none greater can be concieved.

But surely (6) is absurd and self-contradictory; how could we conceive OF a being greater than the being than which none greater can be conceived?

Do you see how Anselm (according to Plantinga’s interpretation of his argument) switches from “conceiving THAT there is a being” to “conceiving OF the being”?

Basically I’m just showing that Anselm’s argument (if accepted) forces the reader to agree that conceiving that something exists implies conceiving of what that something actually is–which it doesn’t logically.

Sorry for the delay - I am going to reply to this eventually! :slight_smile:

It’s cool OBW. I’m pretty busy myself with school and work, so I can understand. I work at my University bookstore so everyone is coming in to get their books this week and next, so I’m swamped.