I wrote a short article today, entitled Does Society Need Prisons?
Basically, my contention is that society does not need prisons because we can release anyone who does not have a psychological defect making them so dangerous to others as to warrant putting them in a medical asylum.
What do you think? Do you think society needs prisons?
no the only prisons society needs are prisons of the mind. The best slave is the one who is unaware he is being held captive. Listen to the faint jingle of the shackles of thought, and please wake the fuck up, friends.
Big brother isn’t watching, he is singing and dancing–chuck palahniuk
No prisons, more propaganda! GO GO GO
Scott, where on earth do you live? Do you really suppose that you have covered all the people who are in prison? All the types?
Society needs a means of removing those who would do harm to others from the others whom they might harm.
Society does not need anything.
No. Pretty self-evident, actually.
…Hey, you showed up on RL!
And yes, society does need things. Individuals make up a society. Individuals need a method of removing danger from themselves.
I live in the United States, where most people in prison are in for non-violent offenses. Yes, logically, I believe I have covered all people who fall in prison. There are the ones that did not hurt anyone and pose no danger; they can be released. There are the ones who only hurt someone due to extenuating circumstances (i.e. external conditions) that would have made any normal, sane person do the same; these people need to be in prison no more than you or I. Finally, there are the psychologically disturbed people, these are people that have an abnormal tendency to choose to hurt others; they need to be restrained, but in a medical facility by medical professionals–not by vengeance-seeking brutes.
Maytacera, you say society needs a way to remove those that would do us harm. I agree, but those who are psychologically disturbed in a way that mean they would do us harm need medical treatment in a medical asylum. The ones that are as psychologically non-dangerous as you or I need to be put in prison no more than you or I.
Okay, Scotty. So a career thief can be released. And if he continues to steal, then what do we do with him? Say he cons you out of your life savings - say it’s two hundred thousand dollars. And some of your friends and neighbors. It happens. How do you address this?
Hey, Faust! Ever heard of credit bureaus or reference agencies??? They can pretty much demolish a person’s ability to function in society in any financial capacity and they do so non-coercively.
Scotty, I will give you a few hints.
– with his name, address and crimes published.
– ostracize him and ostracize anybody else who does business with him.
Say you are stupid enough to do business with a known criminal.
Say they are stupid too.
Birds of a feather tend to flock together.
Well, by “stealing” your money back. That would be a good start.
No! Wait! I have a better idea! Put him in jail! That will get you your money back!
Scott,
People do not need prisons. Rather, they need to be more responsible in how they protect themselves.
People need to stop believing that nebulous social structures and concepts will magically protect them. They also need to be a little creative too – that is what separates humans from animals.
Ah, so the trick is to change human nature. I see.
Ah, no. You can not see.
The trick is to unashamedly point out moral inconsistencies (or, you could say to demand moral universality) in social prescriptions. In fact, it is one of the most honorable methods to attempt social change or to shut people up who spew out nonsense.
Obviously you’ve never been a victim of crime. Jail is where you put people who don’t deserve the freedom to be out on the streets. You do it to punish them, and you do it to protect people, and property from them.
If you’re going to get rid of all the jails, I’d suggest burning them with the inmates locked inside. Then you might actually get some workable results.
It sort of depends on what your definition of is, is.
When you put someone in a mental asylum, it is only semantically different from a prison.
There are those psychological disfunctions that have very poor prognoses.
I am entirely in favor of mental health care for inmates who might benefit from it. And for the elimination of victimless crimes, which would significantly reduce the numbers of incarcerated.
The complete elimination of prisons is a bit much, and as you suggest, only a semantic change with a tremendous increase in, mostly useless, psychiatric care.
In the US right now, there are a great many people in prison who needn’t be - I will grant that. In fact, this is becoming the mainstream view. The War on Drugs quickly became the War on People who Couldn’t Afford a Good Lawyer, for one thing. We won that one. Now we have to win the peace.
Obviously, you have no idea what people are locked up in jails and why they are sent there. Shame.
I am comfortable with abolishing prisons for various reasons, practical and moral, mainly because I believe everybody has the right to private property and because I believe it is wrong to coerce anybody, except in self-defense. Keeping a person in jail is not self-defense. Therefore, instead of putting people in prison (a ridiculously expensive method of dealing with a “criminal” – so ridiculously wasteful that only a government could afford to promote it), it is morally correct to simply banish that person from your property or to shun them.
The threat of being shunned or ostracized is a morally correct tool to deal with crime.
Most violent crimes are committed in unguarded public property.
Banish them from your property? You see no practical problems in this?
I have been watching this thread develop it has been interesting reading. Now???;
Ban or shun a criminal from your property? 
I propose you take that theory to the inmates and see what they will tell you what they would do. Oh and be ready for them to lie. I certainly would lie if I thought it would get me out of prison. I would tell you anything that you would want to hear and I am a relatively nice ethical human. Samuel I think you are a good person who is woefully lacking in knowledge of the human beast. You be careful around humans or sadly, you will end up a statistic.
Really?
Have you ever heard of a market before? Do you know what a market is?
Do you have any idea how incentives operate in markets? Hint: competition has something to do with it.
Yes: it would provide competition in the “policing” industry. Oh, such a bad thing! since, competition in the market of a service is a problem.
State-controlled monopolized markets are the cat’s ass, right?
Samuel could you explain yourself in more detail because you just are not making any coherent sense. You have an idea but, are not fleshing it out properly.