07.06.06.1368
Can nothing be glorified or affirmed anymore?
Has the world become so caught up in the aspect of reason that it no longer acknowledges meaning in anything?
I believe I’m begining to lose my faith again; this time not in a religion, but in man, life, country, and philosophy.
Have you ever expirienced a recession of faith other than through religion?
How does one muddle through such an absence of meaning?
Shit Sage, of course there’s glory and meaning in the world. It’s always there, as necessary as the nullness and the fear; it just must be found. The world does not create glory and meaning for you, you create glory and meaning for the world.
well, you’d need a fundimental meaning or goal for yourself i guess. a foundation to build your beliefs around.
a meaning in life.yah, mine is/was religion but hey,nothing else could possibly give me meaning in my life anymore. too much damn pain and horror.
my prior meaning was isolationism+hendonism.but those could not be sustained anymore come the hellstorm.
also consider this:to truely answer this question you must answer this-
is the ‘meaning’ of life objective or subjective?
I’ve been through all this. Just when you think the world can’t get anymore meaningless, along comes something else that will confirm that it is more meaningless than it was before. It’s at the point now where I just laugh at the absurdity of it all.
“Meaning” is a sensation one gets within agreement.
Agreement is subjective.
As regards: “mine is/was religion”. With enough mobility, one can find anything.
Interdimensionals. Other realities. Etc.
Within the lowest dimension, there is no time or measurement, no distance or area, no mass. For this reason, lowest dimensional data is omnipresent. Higher dimensions are made of the lower dimensions. The lowest dimensions are the elements.
Due to the infinite existence of potential, somewhere within all, anything & everything exists somewhere, somehow. Infinite existence of potential insures the actuation of anything and everything.
During the Delta brain wave state, the lowest and the slowest algorythms of the brain lead to the lowest dimensions. From these deep dips in the brain wave, omnipresent data is sifted and brought up into the higher dimensions in tiny bits and pieces.
Imagine a hardboard box, originally flat. A truck drives over it, but it is not crushed. Later someone folds it into a box, which can be crushed by the truck. Depending upon the dimensional state of the variable, other dimensions will effect that variable in different ways. The key to teleportation lays within the ability to self-form from out of a lower dimension.
Interdimensionals can only materialize or form when their teleported, live-structures are able to enter into pleodimensional, living energy.
Today, from all that I have yet found, only certain forms of mental/spiritual energy are partially pleodimensional and living. Within a reality or universe, there must be a receptive, pleodimensional, live-energy before the interdimensional being can materialize, and just barely.
Any form of structure has order, thus all realities have dimensions.
Outside of our universe there is the exverse. Within the exverse there are infinite universes. Outside of the exverse there is the chaosphere.
Belief is like a funnle, your spirit is the water.
Realize what I’ve just said above this reply, also.
First one must unlock a door, and then what was behind the door floods in.
Next what floods in must be tasted, felt, touched and injested.
Finally there shall be the manifestations, the changes, and the neo.
In my view, quite the opposite: anything and everything can be, should one so desire.
I can’t speak for the world, but I, for one, could care little of ‘reason’ and ‘logic’; they serve their purpose from time to time, but ultimately fail to bring about the highest in life. The contradiction inspires as much thought as does the deepest truth.
So be it, Sage. Does it really matter - your faith in these things? Or does it have more to do with you and your experience here? People often speak of delusion as this inherently negative thing. I tend to go the other way, even if it makes me unpopular, philosophically: Life should be ecstasy; to soak in its negative aspects is to defeat one’s self; indeed, better drunk in delusion than sober in pain.
By prescribing it where it is needed!
Absurdity? Contradiction could imply non-reality, but absurdity seems to imply chaos; chaos can be real. Reality is strong enough to be assigned meaning indefinitely, whether absurd or stagnant.
It’s our meaning, not a universal one–unless anyone can presume to identify a universal meaning–so it’s subjective. Ultimately, meaning is applied, experienced, and destroyed by the individual.
Which is where I interpret this thread to begin, as it happens. The question doesn’t seem to be “can we have faith?” or “is their meaning to be wrought?” but “why does nobody seem to apply meaning to anything anymore?” I think that, in this age of dichotomies of affluence, decadence, and ignorance, the culture of the extreme end of this dichotomy (mostly, us; those saturated in wealth, information, and idleness) is markedly out of balance. Which brings me to Daybreak:
Without contrast, one cannot see; without challenge by which to guage success, one cannot be assured of its meaning. Suffering in general grants order to our perspective; it may not be what we apply meaning to, but it allows us to better understand what meaning is by showing us what it is not. I think Sagesound is seeing people’s apathy toward the concept of meaning–their tendency not to apply it to anything–because those people can’t see the world in such a way that meaning makes sense to them.
For example, someone who is rich and doesn’t need to work for his/her wealth cannot easily understand, per se, the value of a dollar. The concept of hurting someone for money would appear superficial–meaningless–from such a perspective. Whereas someone drowned in poverty might be similarly engulfed in a need for money to the extent that the entire meaning of his/her life equates to–in his/her mind–money; hurting another for such would seem quite reasonable. What’s necessary is to find balance between the two, not so that objective meaning can be determined–it can’t be–but so that subjective meaning is applied with integrity; integrity meaning not simply honesty, but structural competency.
Sortof to go off onto a tangent, do you mean agreement as in something like “alignment between two or more parties’ interests, structures, or otherwise qualities”? In this sense, would your interpretation of meaning apply to my previously stated model by which–to use my past example–a man with too many riches could be in danger of being out of alignment with his own needs, perhaps to the extent that he cannot be in “agreement” with himself, and thus cannot apply meaning to himself? (sorry, run-on question)
What a person does not agree with, feels meaningless.
Meaning is an emotion which only exists internally, not externally.
Learn to live outside the cave.
Ah the venerable one has doubts?
He is human after all …
Logically reason your discontent, in reverse order, back to its’ origin.
Is it the objects?
Is it the process?
Is it the viewer?
Some conjunction of the variables?
Inquire as to your base value system. Is it changing? Or are you unwilling to allow the change, that life has forced upon you?
Sometimes, the best thing to do is to sit quietly and let the answer come to you, in pause, in sleep, in study. Allow the mind to filter the unnecessary, and it will discern the best path, without our interference of forced thought.
Just a suggestion.
well, the answer to my riddle was this:(objective meaning)
Matthew 11:12 “But from the days of John the Baptist until now the kingdom of the heavens is the goal toward which men press, and those pressing forward are seizing it.” -Jesus
and as for meaning/desire:
1 john 2:17 “Furthermore, the world is passing away and so is its desire, but he that does the will of God remains forever.”
I use too many words and say too little. Anyway, I didn’t mean to go against the subjectivity of value; I mean that “alignment” is the determining factor for the individual to apply meaning. As in, someone agrees with something when it correlates to the context of their perception of reality; they are in alignment, and so they can apply value. Mostly, I was just wondering if you meant what I thought you meant.
Drift, one of those quotes, when you take it out of context, says the ultimate purpose is to pursue a blissful afterlife. This is selfish, and in turn subjective. The other isn’t an answer at all, because we still can’t understand what “the will of God” is, and so we still don’t have an objective parameter for meaning.
Riddle me this, why did you bring religion into the discussion? (not meant to be hostile, I’m actually asking)
I know this is not the religion board,so i’ll stop the preaching on this thread.
It just gets to me.As i feel god is synonymous with meaning.Other than that,meaning is indeed subjective.But i merely answered your question
“can anyone identify an objective meaning?” and i feel us merely wanting to continue living is not indeed selfish, but a humble dignified even reasonable want/need.
As far as the will of god,why,would i ever bother to preach to others,running the risk of ridicule,if i indeed did not know what the will of god is???
I could quote to you from the good book all day,and accurate knowledge there of. But.#1 This is not the religion forum#2 apathy.#3 I do not want to inflate my post for the sake of brevity and coherence. I’ve given the answer i wanted to.
07.09.06.1370
Such was the case on the fourth of July. As I regret sharing such a personal topic with the forum (my problems are my own after all), I will resolve not to publicly disclose the details of my brief interlude into meaninglessness. However I will say that the brief loss of faith that once existed has now been surpassed by a renewed meaning; a revaluation of sort. Twas I once was Bacchus, now I shall become Dionysus. In the end, I shall become neither.
The begining of a revaluation, starting with the nihilistic deconstruction of old values, rises with an explosion of life and possibility. Ergo, as the spirit and mind is made anew, so shall the body.
I did, but when the gust comes to blow you off your feet, should you not return to that which you came from? A revaluation comes with it a renewed appreciation for that which was abandoned.
I stated that this thread should not be about religion. Please refrain from making it such lest it should be moved.
Sagesound, is this thread about the purpose of meaning? Can you elaborate on what a “nihilistic deconstruction of old values” means and is–how are old values deconstructed with a reference point that doesn’t accept value in anything?
07.09.06.1373
This thread could be about a number of things, and one of those things could be the purpose of meaning. I don’t believe any elaboration is needed. What I stated pretty much sums it up. I had values which I no longer consider useful, thus their disposal was of nihilistic fashion; anarchismic, violent, depressive… The values were deconstructed, as in being broken down to their basic principals of usage and then reconstructed to become something useful. I never said anything about a reference point that doesn’t accept value in anything… This thread started as I was within the nihilistic deconstructioning of my values… before they held meaning.