Madness as Spiritual Suffering

During my daily Bible study a few months back, I ran across a very interesting verse which hit home:

Deuteronomy 28:28: “The Lord will smite you with madness and with blindness and bewilderment of heart.”

No doubt there are too many suffering folks today, walking around in a haze, or in haze-rejecting madness, who would benefit from knowing they are spiritually suffering and only the One who made them can heal them… and all they have to do is draw near.

That isn’t to say that everyone who suffers is being punished by God (suffering builds character and yields positive results, after all). But everyone who suffers can definitely find healing in Him. “Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest,” (Matthew 11:28).

Jer 23:19-20 “Behold, the storm of the Lord has gone forth in wrath, Even a whirling tempest; It will swirl down on the head of the wicked. The anger of the Lord will not turn back Until He has performed and carried out the purposes of His heart; In the last days you will clearly understand this.”

Jer 30:23-24 “Behold, the tempest of the Lord! Wrath has gone forth, A sweeping tempest; It will burst on the head of the wicked. The fierce anger of the Lord will not turn back Until He has performed and until He has accomplished The intent of His heart; In the latter days you will understand this.”

anutter butter, peanut butter sandwich cookie from Nabisco

Kropotkin

Anne’s House of Nuts – place that puts nuts into bags and sells them in the store.

– Ichthus

Jer 23:19-20 “Behold, the storm of the Lord has gone forth in wrath, Even a whirling tempest; It will swirl down on the head of the wicked. The anger of the Lord will not turn back Until He has performed and carried out the purposes of His heart; In the last days you will clearly understand this.”

Jer 30:23-24 “Behold, the tempest of the Lord! Wrath has gone forth, A sweeping tempest; It will burst on the head of the wicked. The fierce anger of the Lord will not turn back Until He has performed and until He has accomplished The intent of His heart; In the latter days you will understand this.”

Here’s another one for you…

“Wackadamia nut.”

Came to me in a dream last night/morning. Can’t remember what I was dreaming alongside it.

Actually thats pretty interesting that this is in the bible although you didn’t show context so I don’t know what this was in reference to. However I have felt this Truth myself and would explain it as a natural side effect from rejecting the Truth that God is displaying in your heart as I have seen it in action. Those that refuse to accept something that is plainly obvious and true will go mad fighting it. Fort instance, a cheater or liar that is repeatedly caught in the act and when confronted they deny it over and over, after a while their demeanor in this denial is more and more irrational to the point that they are absolutely and completely illogical in all they do and say, I’ve seen this exact thing in action. It seems to even be present here in some arguments, some will just not admit when they have been proven wrong or illogical, they will go to such extremes and straw man building that they become completely irrational and down right MAD.

Again, this is not a direct punishment by God, this is a natural effect of the cause that is one of Gods laws but unfortunately the bibles verbiage doesn’t translate well or is just wrong, God don’t smite you, his natural laws do.

– kingdaddy

Although I’m glad you understand in principle, I think we need to be careful about distinguishing between God and His laws (fundamentally the law of love). Let me use an example from history to illustrate… I’m quoting from Zinn’s “A People’s History of the United States / 1492 to the Present” (1999, Harper Collins) – page 133:

I just read this today and am still processing the chapter… so I’m glad you brought that up.

So why didn’t you distinguish between God and his laws to show me where and why to be careful, as it stands you said nothing relevant.

kingdaddy – obviously I have been extremely vague, because I communicated the opposite of what I actually meant…

I did not mean we should distinguish between God and His law (the law of love). I meant we should not. By “be careful about” I meant “be wary of it” – don’t do it. The principle behind the fact that God’s law is not distinct from God, is the same principle behind God’s name representing God’s character (I may be over-using or incorrectly using the word “principle”). God is love, therefore God’s law is love.

In the example from history that I used, the law became a scapegoat, a way for persons to misplace the burden of responsibility. Remember (or research) that Sartre called this “bad faith”. You can be sure that God (even though he transcends cause and effect, as it concerns responsibility) is not guilty of bad faith. He paid the price for us all.


Slight tangent… but essential…

Your reference to natural laws reminded me of C.S. Lewis’ “Mere Christianity” wherein he mentions that the moral law (the law of love) is not one we naturally follow… which reminds me of (I forget who at the moment)'s (I think Dan’s) mention that Christianity tries to destroy the natural. But, while I agree in principle with C.S. Lewis, I don’t think God’s law (of love) is unnatural. I think it is what nature is created for, but nature has been corrupted – the well poisoned (and forgiven, depending on which side of the faith-fence you are perceiving from). It is unreasonable to call anything you experience unnatural, because if it really were, it would not be experienced in the natural universe. Therefore, supernatural does not equal unnatural – it means there is more to nature than our conceptual frameworks have allowed for previously. (Even hallucinations have their basis in the already-experienced natural universe, or we would not be able to recognize them – which is what happened to me… I couldn’t make sense out of a lot of what I was experiencing until I experienced it… but that wasn’t because I was experiencing the unnatural… but was supernaturally experiencing the natural that hadn’t happened yet. Not that there weren’t genuine hallucinations mixed in with it… I was certifiably mad, though I did escape diagnosis. Atleast, I hope they were hallucinations.) I think it was also Dan (or was it Nietzsche, I just skimmed him recently?) who said Christianity gave “world” a negative connotation. But that only applies to one use of the word “world”. He left out that God so loved the world… (John 3:16). The “world” with a negative connotation is the one that sets itself against the law of love (God) (that is the “world” that hates those who follow God… the law of love… but, though God is not “of them” – He still loves them). You got more than the short answer ‘cause I have all this floatin’ around my brain and I’m worried it’ll fly off before I actually have time to answer the Sin thread… consider this a … preview, perhaps.

04.11.07.2174

During my bible study this past month, I learned (to my own astonishment) that the entire bible is a giant work of folklore. Would you care for some examples? If you want to find out for yourself, check out this book.

The irony of this is… here in this thread, you have already given an example of this folklore Ich!

Repetition is a prime indicator of folklore… welcome to reality Ich.

Repetition is used in memorization, Sagesound, when it is important for the listener/reader to remember that which is repeated. An excellent tool of many teachers and students.

Repetition is used in memorization, Sagesound, when it is important to the listener/reader to remember that which is repeated. An excellent tool of many teachers and students.

I already mentioned in the “Against Gnosticism” thread, and I repeat, that I won’t be reading any more of your external links.

Something that helps me when I’m ‘down’ is to remember that His love never changes with my moods… helps to lift me out of them.

Hi Sagesound,

This is written in the rezension of the Book you mentioned. This fits in with much of what I have been saying for a long time now, which really has no great bearing on spiritual life, but does clear up the question as to whether the Bible is an anthology of spiritual writings - of course it is, but folklore has always been far more important that just to amuse people.

Shalom

…or at least ride them out without over-analyzing them.

I keep forgetting to recommend B-complex with a multivitamin/multimineral supplement after your first meal daily. I take the liquid/chewable versions. I forget most days to take them, and can really tell the difference between when I remember and when I forget–it’s really hard for me to break routine and add something to it. One o’ these days I’ll start going to bed on time and exercising regularly, like my dad keeps recommending. Then, after I’ve got that down, I’ll learn healthier recipes that don’t bore me. That’s what I’m shootin’ for, as concerns physical health/mood. The old pattern I easily fall back into is to beat myself up if I don’t do well in this area, and bum myself out even worse. I have to keep returning to being with God and seeing myself through His eyes… then the pressure is off, and the joy returns.