More Logical Women, Please.

Philosophy Forums Philosophy
1

To make this clear… I’m not trying to opress females, Im just stating a true observable generality. Please be open-minded about this subject and approach it from a rational (not the reactions society has taught you) method.

It seems to be a common notion amongst male philosophers that women (typically) don’t have the higher cognitive function to interest them in the search for ultimate truth. This usually stems from the fact that women have not contributed much to science or philosophy and that women (especially in Western society) are more concerned with the social aspects of life than philosophical ones.

This may be due to the supression of women’s rights in the past, genetics, the social upbringing of women, or just a combination of the conditions of a male-dominated society that has put the evolution of “the woman” at a disadvantage. Obviously whatever it is women are not as great contributers to the intellectual realm as men are.

The women who are of a more intellectual nature tend to be frankly… less feminine.

I suggest that the concept of feminine in our society is by definition irrational, making more of their decisions and thought processes based on intuition and emotion. Men and women have male and female characteristics, but unfortunatly women have more female characteristics. This I think makes them less able to rise “above” to the higher levels of thinking required for the search of the true nature of things.

Not that women are less than men just that they are different and that thieir difference (by definition of themselves) makes them less suitable for rational, scientific, respectable, non-primitive thought patterns.

If you disagree with me please put me in my place but I would like to see what others think or what their experiences have been with females and intelligent (by that i mean non-trivial) thought.

2

have you any proof to back up your claims?

3

Larry Summers, the soon to be ex-president of Harvard, made similar comments. He theorized that there were several reasons we didn’t see more very high-iq women, namely, sexism, women favoring jobs that let them be mothers over jobs that are more “high-powered” and “successful”, and lastly, genetics. He theorized that genetics makes the biggest contribution. He had very good reasons to say this.

Check out what he says here:

http://www.president.harvard.edu/speeches/2005/nber.html

Essentially, it has long been observed that, while men and women have the same average IQ, men are more “extreme”. That is, while the average man and the average woman are just as smart, most retarded people are male, and most genius people are male. It’s also known that men have far more grey matter (brain matter used for information processing) than women, whereas women have far more white matter (brain matter used for interconnectivity) than men. This is a plausible explanation for why men tend to be better at math and symbolic thought, as these are more linear processing tasks, and women tend to be better at language, subtlety, and emotional awareness, as these are tasks that involve a greater variety of areas of the brain working together. This is also possibly why most autistics are male, and suffer “extreme male” symptoms - no social skills, and often incredible linear processing power. This also suggests why even smart women seem less logical and more emotional than males at their intellectual level - it’s because their brains are more interconnected. This makes them more creative, but it also makes them less able to use an isolated brain function without tying it to other functions. They can write a better short story, but they can’t be purely logical as well, without some emotion or intuition or other form of thought creeping in.

Of course, socialization plays its part too, but I suspect it merely exaggerates the existing genetic predisposition.

Thoughts?

4
  1. Being female and being feminine need have nothing to do with one another
  2. ‘The search for ultimate truth’ is a myth - , “’Truth’ is linked in a circular relation with systems of power which produce and sustain it, and to effects of power which it induces and which extend it.” (Foucault, Power/Knowledge p133) Philosophy is about excusing political moves for power behind the mask of ‘reason’ or something similar. This isn’t cynical - it’s actually a far more practical and optimistic way of looking at philosophy than the Enlightenment philosophy of progress toward truth.
  3. Women haven’t made as much impact on/contribution to intellectual culture. So what? Intellectual culture isn’t valuable per se. What is definitely the case is that women have, in almost all cultures that we know of, taken on the majority of responsibility for childrearing, both in terms of labour and in terms of moral education. Now, while this has the amusing implication that all patriarchal society can be blamed on poor mothering it also carries the implication that ‘behind every male genius there’s a great mother’. Consider the importance of this because I don’t think that I’ll be repeating it, yet it’s a point overlooked by almost all sides in terms of gender history.

By habit, not by definition. This is a matter of pragmatics (in the sense of pragmatics being a subset of semiotics) and can easily be solved. It won’t be, or at least not soon anyway, but there’s no inherent reason why women need be or need be conceived of as being less rational and more emotional than men. Indeed, the only measurable difference between an emotional response and a rational one seems to be, quite literally, the time taken before manifesting the decision (in speech, action etc.). This is an arbitrary criterion.

‘Rise above’ is a metaphor, i.e. something that fails in comparison with ‘rational clarity’. That you’d be claiming a position of rationality but rest on a metaphor at a crucial point is less than convincing, and betrays many of the suppositions and biases in your argument.

I’m not convinced - language is neither linear nor an interconnected web so this language/mind metaphor doesn’t hold weight (yes, I’m using a metaphor, but I make no claim to rational truth). Indeed, one could argue that maths is more like an interconnected web and so, according to the ‘evidence’ (i.e. the interpretation of the evidence bound up with a series of expectations and presuppositions), women should be better at maths. I’d also be keen to know how far reaching this evidence is, i.e. how many examples did they observe before concluding ‘women’s brains are… men’s brains are…’

I’m expecting a very low number of people selected entirely from a limited cultural cross-section, which would prove absolutely nothing as far as genetics or innate traits/capacities go. But we’ll see.

5

I would also question whether or not rationality is the be all and end all of thought.

It seems to me that intuition and emotion may be incredibly important in philosophy.

Of course, the other question is whether or not all the things men have been doing have really worked that well. Since men can be credited for most of the intellectual contributions in the current world, they can also be blamed for a majority of the problems.

cheers,
gemty

6

Twiffy - I would say that you have summarised the current science quite adequately.

I have just a couple of comments about the original post.

Riddance:

Que? That which is feminine is defined by the behavior of females - collectively. You give your own definition, which is okay. But it is thoroughly a social one - these women, then, that succeed are merely adopting a strategy. We all adopt strategies. But “the true nature of things”? There is more to life than science and philosophising. You hold this up as the standard, and then fault women as a class for not living up to it. To wit: “unfortunately”. It is difficult to respond to your post without discussing social conditioning - you are so embedded in this yourself.

More importantly, most men have not contributed much to science or philosophy. These are collective endeavors, and most of the players, by far, have played very small roles. You are confusing the class “men” with the members of the class. And the class “women” with the members of that class.

It’s okay to generalise, but we mustn’t forget that we are generalising when we generalise. By your own account, you talk like a woman. Logic 101.

I think what is closer to the truth is that women and men tend to participate in society in different ways. That is a generalisation, I realise. But “science” and “philosophy”, the way you are using these terms, are social endeavors. What makes a philosopher? Getting published. Getting published is not searching for Ultimate Truth. It’s just getting published.

7

Sweet, nourishing anti-foundationalism…
( * auhuhuh, [homer tilts head back] * )

8

Do you have that with jam?

Not in my city.

You’re aware of the women Philosophers though? There are quite a few.

I’m really interested why you said ‘especially in western society’. Could you expand on that? Are you saying, for example, that non-western women are less socially interested and more interested in Philosophy?

It’s true that Martha had a tache.

Which society is that? American?

Finally, why is philosophical thought any ‘higher’ than for example, emotional IQ. Where would you be without women with high emotional capacity? Probably not sitting at a computer.

9

You were saying? There are many more:

Women You Should Know

That Enhanced Science

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    Greece-mathematician
    Theano was a mathematician. She was one of Pythagoras’s pupils as a young girl. However, she soon became his wife. While they were married they started the first coeducational university. This school was based on equality between the sexes. She took over the school after Pythagoras died in a fire. She and her two daughters ran and taught at the school. However, Theano did more than run the school. She discovered her own rule. This rule is what is not called golden geometry. She worked on a formula to derive the golden rectangle. The information that she gave to mathematics allowed Pascal to make his triangle and Fibanocci to derive his series. Theano is one woman that led the way in mathematics but is not recognized.

Links for more information:

cornellcollege.edu/~a-math/Thean … orical.htm

members.fortuecity.com/jonhays/pythagawoman

w3.arizona.edu/~ws/ws200/fall97/grp3/part2.html

galaxy.cau.edu/tsmith/KW/goldenmath.html

formoru.com/theano.html

  1. Aglaonike
    5th century B.C.
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Links

  1. Aglodike
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During her time women were not allowed to practice medicine. They were thought of as incompetent when it came to science. However, she dressed as a man and practiced medicine. It was common for women to say that they enjoyed having her,(him), for a doctor. It was said that she had more of a caring touch. When on trial for practicing medicine, the women of the town came to defend her. These women actually saved her from being put to death since the judge sided them with her.

  1. Hypatia of Alexandria
    370 A.D.-430 A.D.
    Egypt-philosopher
    Hypatia was a noted mathematician and a philosopher. She was not allowed to go to different meetings because they were only for men. However, many people respected her for her knowledge. She was a very beautiful woman and had many men ask for her hand in marriage, but she turned them all down. Although she was respected, she was dragged out of the classroom and killed by a group of men. They brutally stoned and beat her to death.

Links

Hubbard, Elbert. “Hypatia.” polamory.org/~howard/Hypatia … _1928.html

McAlister, Linda Lopez. Hypatia’s Daughters. Indiana University press, 1996.

Suda. “The Life of Hypatia.” cosmopolis.om/alexandria/hypatia-bio-suda.html

  1. Trotula of Salerno
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  1. Hildegard von Bingen
    1098-1179
    Germany-philosopher
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    to become an outstanding scimusician, poet, and her scientific views were
    astonishing. She composed hymns and sequences in honor of saints, virgins, and Mary,
    and one of her famous pieces is Canticles of Ecstasy. Her poetry writings included:
    Ordovirtutem “Play of the virtues”, Liber vitae Meritorum “Book of life’s mertis”,
    and Scivias “Know the ways of the lord.” Her scientific views where derieved from the
    greek cosmology in 3 different areas: the four elements, their complementary
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  5. Emilie de Breteuil

1706-1749
France-scholar
Breteuil was a brilliant child. her father noticed this at the age of only 4 years old. Many tutors were paid to teacher her since education was not a common thing for woman. By the age of ten she read Cicero, did mathematics, and metaphysics. Even more spectacular, by the age of twelve she could speak six languages and translated Aristotle from Greek to Latin. Her greatest achievements are her translations of Newton and Liebniz. She was the first person to translate Newton from Latin to French. Not only did she translated it but she added her own commentary and explanations for his work. She also wrote about Liebniz discoveries and compared them to Newton. In doing this she expressed her ideas on both Newton and Liebniz. Throughout her career she was faced with many gender biased obstacles. These did not stop her though. Finally, although she was busy translating she always had time for her love life. She had many affairs. Especially, a well known one with Voltaire, a philosopher and composer. Bretueil was a woman before her time.

Links

www-groups.dcs.st-andrews.ac.uk/ … telet.html

visitvoltaire.com/emilie_du_chatelet_bio.htm

orst.edu/instruct/phl302/phi … telet.html

odi.iap.physik.tu-darmstadt.de/c … issrev.htm

members.mint.net/frenchcx/origins4.htm

  1. Laura Bassi
    1711-1778
    Italy-physicist
    She was an Italian physicist who had her own lab and studied electricity. Volta (Volts) followed her work.

Links for more information

The Hypatia institute" geocities.com/vidkid_allison … bassi.html
Wertheim, Margaret. Pythagoras’ trousers: God, physics, and the Gender Wars. New York: W.W. Norton and company, 1995 (pp 137-140).
vms.www.uwplatt.edu/~wise/bassi/bassi.html
pinn.net/~sunshine/whm2001/bassi.html
smart.it/Bologna/mappa.html
geocities.com/Athens/Delphi/ … bassi.html

  1. Maria Gaetana Agnesi
    1718-1799
    Italy-mathematician
    She was recognized as a child prodigy and one of her solutions for an algebraic equation is still found in today’s textbooks. The solution follows a curve now called the “Witch of Agnesi”.

  2. Molly Ockett
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  3. Caroline Herschel
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    Germany/England-astronomer
    She and her brother discovered Uranus.

  4. Marie Sophie Germain
    1776-1831
    France-mathematician
    Marie Germain was born in Paris. Her father, a silk merchant, was Ambrois-Francois Germain. Her mother was Marie-Madeleine Grugueli. She was the middle child of three. At the age of thirteen, Sophie was extremely happy to become a mathematician by
    learning about the death of Archimedes (other mathematician who wanted to be who loved math very much). When she started to study math, her parents discouraged her by taking away her clothes and lights. Sophie was determined to be a mathematician, though she had many faults. Sophie parents finally gave in to letting her accomplish her goals and become a mathematician. Sophie got accepted to Ecole Polytechnique with the help of Professor Joseph-Louis Lagrange. Along with being a mathematician, Sophie was a scientist too. Over the years she became a famous mathematician. In 1829 Sophie was diagnosed with breast cancer and died two years later at age 55.

  5. Florence Nightingale

1820-1910
Italy/England-nurse
She was a nurse during a time that nursing was not a popular, looked down upon, job. However, she enjoyed it and gave it her all. During the Crimean War, nurses were needed and she was able to get 38 other woman to follow her to the front and help the wounded. After this war she was considered a hero because of all her effort. Due to all of her work, she came down posttraumatic stress disorder.

Links

florence-nightingale.co.uk

  1. Mary Edwards Walker
    1832-1919
    New York, USA-physician
    She received the Medal of Honor in 1866 for her work in the American Civil War. She was the first and only civilian/woman to receive this medal.

Links

ngeorgia.com/people/walker.html

northnet.org/stlawrenceaauw/walker.htm

lala.essortment.com/marywalker_rbry.htm

  1. Williamina Paton Stevens Fleming
    1851-1911
    Scotland/USA-astronomer
    Born May 15, 1857 in Dundee, Scotland, Williamina was an extraordinary astronomer,
    wife, and mother. In 1877 Williamina wed James Fleming and she and her new husband
    immigrated to Boston, MA. In 1879 Williamina,now a single parent, became employed as a maid in the home of Professor Edward Pickering who was the director of the Harvard
    Observatory. Williamina’s great astronomical career started when Prof. Pickering
    found his male students to be incompetent and decieded Williamina was to take over
    the clerical task and mathematical calculations. She devised a system of classifying
    stars according to their spectra, which is a distintive pattern produces by each star
    when its light is passed through a prism. She discovered 59 nebulae, over 300
    variable stars, and 10 novae, which are today classified as the Draper Catalogues of
    Stellar Spectra. In 1906 Williamina became the first American women elected to the
    Royal Astronomical Society. She went on to publish a total of 222 variable stars
    that she discovered in 1907. Williamina never attended college or recieved any type
    of training from Prof. Pickering and she died on May 21,1911 at the early age of 54

  2. Kate Gleason
    1865-1933
    New York, USA-engineer
    She was the first woman to be admitted into the Cornell University engineering program. She was also the first woman member of the Rochester Engineering Society. She received full membership into the American Society of Mechanical Engineers. She was also given many other awards. One of her biggest influences was the American Susan B. Anthony. She did not have any huge discoveries, but her awards out weigh this small fact.

Links

winningthevote.org/KGleason.html
astr.ua.edu/4000WS/GLEASON.html
gleason.com/GWR/GWRhistory.html

  1. Beatrix Potter
    1866-1943
    USA-mycologist/writer
    Beatrix Potter is best known for her many children’s storybooks, such as, “The Tale of Peter Rabbit” or “The Tale of Benjamin Bunny.” These stories have enlightened us for many years. Did you know that besides being a gifted writer and painter, Beatrix was also a scientist?

Beatrix Potter was born July 28, 1866 in London, England. At an early age, Beatrix had an obvious talent for drawing. She made detailed drawings of plants and animals. Her interests in botany, entomology, geology and paleontology were only surpassed by her interest in mycology (the study of fungi). For years, she collected specimens, identified and dissected them, then painted them in minute detail, creating over 300 drawings of mushrooms alone. She even developed theories on mold spores and lichens.

Encouraged by her uncle, Henry Roscoe, Beatrix published her first scientific paper, “On the Germination of the Spores of Agaricineae.” Her paper was presented to the Linnaean Society of London by a man, because in those days women were not allowed to attend the society meetings. Unfortunately, her paper was rejected. The rejection was terribly disappointing to Beatrix, but it propelled her creativity into another direction…writing her wonderful children’s storybooks.

Denyer, Susan, At Home with Beatrix Potter, Harry N. Abrams, Inc., New York, NY, 2000.

Grienstein, Alexander, The Remarkable Beatrix Potter, International Universities Press, Inc., Madison, CT, 1995.

Biographical Dictionary of Women in Science, V 2, p. 1044-1045.

visitcumbria.com., “Beatrix Potter”

  1. Marie Curie
    1867-1934
    Poland/France-chemist
    Marie Curie was born in Warsaw in 1867 she was the daughter of secondary school teacher she received her education in local schools and some scientific training from her father. In 1891 she went to Paris to continue her studies at the Sorbonne where she obtained her license in physics and mathematical sciences. Later she met her soon to be husband Pierre Curie a professor at the school of Physics in 1894 that following year they were married. Her husband and Marie began to work in the same lab together until one day her husband was killed in a tragic accident. After that she began to work in the lab by herself and pursued her discovery and discovered a new element Radium. Marie won several awards. She was the first woman to win a Nobel Prize for her discovery. In fact, she won two Nobel Prizes and her daughter also won a Nobel Prize for her scientific discoveries. Marie Curie was a very prestigous woman of science.

  2. Emily Noether
    1882-1935
    Germany-mathematician
    Emmy Noether was born in Erlangen, South Germany on March 23, 1882. In 1889 she
    attended the Stadtischen Hoheren Tochterschule (Municipal School for Higher Education
    of Daughters). Emmy had an challenging education life due to the fact that the
    University of Erlangen did not accept women into the university. In 1900 she
    transfered to Gottingen where she enrolled as a Hospitant (auditor). On July 14,
    1903, Emmy took the Reiferprufung which is, an examination entitling the graduate to
    enter a university of his choice. On October 24, 1904 she enrolled in the university
    of Erlangen matriculating as student #468, women were now being accepted and had the
    same rights as men. In 1909 Emmy was granted the second degree given to a women in
    mathematics. After World War I, Emmy was offered a position at the University of
    Gottingen inwhich she helped 2 collegues define one of Eintein’s theories, but she
    was not paid for her work. Three years later, Emmy was offered a salary and began
    teaching as a lecturer for the first time. Emmy Noether later taught at Bryn Mawr
    College until her death in 1935. Her work was on abstract algebra, which she paid
    special attention to rings, groups, and fields. She published over 40 papers
    throught her life time.

  3. Maria Mayer
    1906-1972
    Germany/USA-physicist
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  4. Rachel Carson
    1907-1964
    Pennsylvania, USA-environmentalist
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Links

lkwdpl.org/wihohio/cars-rac.htm
dep.state.pa.us/dep/PA_Env-Her/rachel.htm
webtext.library.yale.edu/sgml2ht … cke.carson.
sgm.html
rachelcarsonhomestead.org/rebio.html
edf.org/pubs/EDF-Letter/1994/May/n
earlyedf.html

  1. Dorothy Crowfoot Hodgkin
    1910-1994
    Egypt-chemist
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Links

engr.psu.edu/wep/engcompsp98/aclausi.hodgkin

nobel.se/chemistry/laureates … odgkin-bio

members.aol.com/jfallon302/hodgkin

  1. Chien-Shiung Wu
    1912-1997
    China/USA-nuclear physicist
    She was an Experimental Nuclear Physicist. Born outside of Shanghai, China in 1912, Chien-Shiung learned the importance of family. Her father opened the region’s first school for girls, and her mother begged parents to stop binding their daughter’s feet and send them to school. Chien-Shiung’s parents did all they could to give their daughter the education she needed. After graduation, Chien-Shiung sailed to the United States to go to graduate school. Once she got her Ph.D., Chien-Shiung became Princeton’s first female professor. She then went to Colombia University and got onto the scientific staff for the Division of War Research where she worked on the Manhattan Project. Chien-Shiung tackled subatomic particles and developed an experiment to investigate their decay. The men leading the investigation received Nobel Prizes for their work, but Chien-Shiung did not. Over the course of her life, Chien-Shiung! received many other awards such as the National Medal of Science in 1975. After retiring from physics in 1981, she continued to lecture in Taiwan and China to encourage women to go into science. Chien-Shiung died in New York City in 1997.

  2. Gertrude B. Elion
    1918-1999
    New York, USA-chemist
    She discovered many anti cancer drugs. Contributed greatly to the area of cancer research. Given many honorary doctorate degrees, and Nobel Prize Winner. Lived from Jan 23,1918 to Feb. 21, 1999.

  3. Rosalind Elsie Franklin
    1920-1957
    England-molecular biologist
    She shared her research with James Watson and Francis Crick who later discovered the structure of DNA and won the Nobel Prize for it. Although this discovery was due in part to her work she never received any of the credit.

Sayre Anne: Rosalind Franklin and DNA. W. W. Norton & Company, Inc. New York. 1975.

crystal.csufresno.edu

rdg.ac.uk/~scsharip/refpubs.htm

physics.ucla.edu

eden.rutgers.edu/~cluther/paper.html

library.thinkquest.org/20465/franklin.html

busd.K12.co.us/schools/cent/ … es/frankli

  1. Jewel Plummer Cobb
    1924-present
    Illinois, USA-biologist/physiologist
    She studied the bodily effects that chemotherapy had on normal, non-cancerous cells.
    She also researched the effects that other drugs had on the human body. Cobb is a great women and minority advocate that has helped many discriminated individuals find the funding to attend school. Finally, she is honored with 41 horary doctorates as well as numerous awards.

  2. Evelyn Boyd Granville
    1924-present
    USA-mathematician
    She was one of five valedictorians in high school class. Her favortie subject through all of her schooling was math. She went to Yale, where she received her Masters. She was only the second woman in the United States to recieve a Ph.d in mathematics. Her most memorable achievement would be that she worked for IBM on a team that was responsible for the formulation of orbit computations and computer procedures for NASA.

Links

program.astr.ua.edu/4000WS/GRANVILLE.html

princeton.edu/~mcbrown/displ … ville.html

agnesscott.edu/lriddle/women/granvill.htm

  1. Jane Goodall
    1934-present
    England/Africa-wildlife researcher

Jane Goodall
Jane Goodall was born on April 3, 1934, in London, England. On her second birthday, Jane’ s father bought her a life-like toy chimpanzee named Jubilee. Even now, Jubilee is part of Jane’s life.

Jane’s fascination with animals began at an early age, and she dreamed of going to Africa to study and live with animals. When she was 23 years old, Jane traveled to Kenya to visit a childhood friend. While there, she was introduced to Dr. Louis Leakey, a renowned paleontologist and anthropologist. She studied with Dr. Leaky for a year, and she astounded him with her endless knowledge of animals and their behavior. Dr. Leakey asked Jane to study the chimpanzees of the Gombe Stream Reserve in Africa. Though she had no scientific training in animal study, Dr. Leakey realized that she had an insatiable curiosity about the animal world, a strong determination to find answers, and the necessary patience to await their discovery. She would spend the next 30 years in Gombe learning the ecology of wild chimpanzees.

Jane challenged scientific protocol by giving the chimps names instead of assigning them numbers. She was the first to discover the concept of “tool use” amongst animals, when she witnessed the chimpanzees using straws to pull termites from the nest.

Nowadays, Dr. Goodall spends almost 300 days a year lecturing, teaching and encouraging young people to take informed and compassionate action to improve the environment of all living creatures great and small. You can visit her website at janegoodall.com to learn more about the mission of the Jane Goodall Institute and what steps you can take to help chimpanzees.

References/links
Goodall, Jane. Beyond Innocence, The Later Years. Houghton Mifflin Company, New York. 2001.

Goodall, Jane. Through a Window: My Thirty Years with the Chimpanzees of Gombe. Houghton Mifflin Company, Boston. 1990.

Lindsay, Jennifer. Jane Goodall: 40 Years at Gombe, A Tribue to Four Decades of Wildlife Research, Education, and Conservation. Stewart, Tabori & Chang, New York. 1999. :sunglasses:

10

When I was playing chess in college, we didn’t have women players like this. Logic and grace; what a fine developing combination.

Now if I were sitting across from one of these, I may say “Mate in Three,” and wink. :slight_smile:

ishipress.com/fidegirl.htm

11

=D> =D> You go Nick. Many of my brother’s female friends were quite beautiful and avid chess players.

With regards,

aspacia

12

It is well known that women use their right hemisphere of the brain more intensly than men; where as men use the left hemisphere more.

They are both required if we’re to have any of the knowledge we have today but they do play an important role in building an individuals character.

Also you should consider the environment in which women as opposed to men are raised in.

13

you have any source for that… as i recall that conclusion was based on some old, groundless assumptions

14

actually i dont and i just realised it; i was thought or told that that was so when i was quite young and i considered it as true without ever questioning its validity. I’ll try and find out more on the matter.

In the meantime i think this could be a great example as to how young children never question anything they are told and simply regard ir as true because adults told them so. Point prooved by Richard Dawkins also reffering to religious dogma as a “virus” being taught to young children.

15

I refuted Dawkins claim easily and simply. Move on.

16

please copy/paste the argument; thank you

17

The existence of ODD proves that children can and do contradict, rebel against and be suspicious of what their parents tell them. And that the argument as stated confuses ‘children can’t test everything that they are told’ with ‘children can’t test anything they are told, and so believe all of it’.

Also, the argument is patently absurd - what if the two parents contradict each other? Oh, dear, Dawkins’ argument can have literally NO reasonable answer to this without becoming contradictory. Is it possible? Yes. It is in evidence? Yes.

Another piece of moronic non-philosophy from Dawkins that a child (sic) could refute, swallowed up by the apparently ‘critical thinkers’ that are his audience.

Two words. Book. Sales.

Dawkis couldn’t give a shit about the truth, that much is certain. He’s interested in glorifying himself in the most shameless and stupid way available to him. I actually dislike spending time discussing him.

18

Twiffy i guess your love for God is what making you give as i do of what we can to say what He did, thank you for inspiring me of the truth i don’t have, to say better my part of the truth i feel or i am, as the absolute is i believe who give life to things as limited or small they would appear, it is like a matter of reaching the depth even if you feel it is a drop of what you think are, this drop could be the source of all and God made it that if you really want to get off your limits i feel you can, this drop could be like a door to get out of yourself, i seem to be near the buddhist here but they miss the sense of means to be outside the body of the conditionned man in body that God will force him to choose the best in his condition of God word on stage to become real,

i think men are more likely who create because they have as you said the ability to fly in logical constructions to make, they can picture it from the begining to the end, that is how men create robots or thoughts who can rule the world, thank you for the truth of women i didnt saw, the reason of my frustrations infront of men, that sometimes i could see it as a curse i cannot understand why do i feel such an extraordinary force who want to limit my mind to think only points, this interconnection factor that may allow the thinking process to be in women brain is that what make her stay on the ground, as all conections will point out the sense to be in the condition of beasts animals who must love to be, but here what i like the most the ways of God to think, women stuck on the ground of the condition could fly to God of the depth they could reach in being god of being the perfect breath of the condition and its sense He thought, mainly because of the sense LOVE i guess, it is the sense that touch God depth and the spirits ruling our feelings will make her fly to touch His, men who thinks of the will to make, coming of always the truth of cant make, reaction to not be God, think to say their will always detached of the condition responsible of feeling being slaves, this is what will make them love being fake and give their life to proove the lies, make them feel so happy to fly in illusion of being like God alone doing the maximum his mind allow, this what explain how ower is al what men really want, this is where God is saying something of Him in men, but ways of God to make his wills incredible ways to make always Him in opposites that join of same Him, one truth, for one sense to go that will never shake of any contradiction in the most reality of symetrical beings saying both they are and being right of the same neutral factor they have and dont see, God Himself who is beyound neutrality and all, so God is saying of men illusions to fly to God being that you are flying to the void if not to the underground when you show hating so much the truth

19

i completly dissagree, but arguing on this topic is redundant

20

this is how the weakest is the powerful being on earth who give life by touching the soul of the truth, again the ways of God by marx who said of the neutral factor God, the truth of power is in the slaves giving to means of being from the feelings to will, he said the truth without knowing that it is mostly of women giving in not being, without knowing that it is God word he is saying, thinking of his evil desire to create a system that will allow him to rule men thoughts giving him the pleasure to achieve as if he was a god denying Him, the weakest is the power of life from what he feels willing love, the will of God, but also from the truth of being who we are, slaves to be the words of God