# My genes making me this way?
**URL:** https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705
**Category:** Philosophy
**Created:** [August 1, 2013, 12:51am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705 "2013-08-01T00:51:33Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Dan1](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Dan1)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 2:41am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/21 "2013-08-01T02:41:05Z")
> [@eyesinthedark](#):
>
> Some things may just be, for example, gravity may just be, it doesn’t need a cause. Now, if we discover heat, light and magnetism were caused by blue elephants, then it may be reasonable to believe gravity, another force, is caused by blue elephants, or perhaps green elephants, or red, but other than that, there’s no need for gravity to have a cause. Gravity may just exist, any speculation as to what, if anything, is the cause of gravity, without any empirical evidence behind it is nonsense. Ultimately, the cause of everything is Chaos. Every conceivable and even inconceivable thing has an equal potential of existing. Our universe happens to be governed by certain laws. There’s no reason why other universes, if there are any, would not be governed by completely different physics than ours. The dark matter thing, for example, bothers me. Why dark matter at all? Perhaps gravity behaves differently at that scale for no reason at all, or for another reason. Ultimately, Chaos is God or, the origin of all things. The Greeks got it right.
The greeks had city states, customized miniturized government.
Nationalism is different. There’s less unity of ideas in a nation.
We live in a world of strangers, and that causes corruption, in allot of ways. I think kriswest would understand and maybe even agree.
Chaos has multiple meanings also.
It could simply be an omnidirectional meta energy. It doesn’t have to be thunder and fire and f- it all up chaos. That is disorder, or one order destroying another order. Either way, when things diverge, change always happens. I have not seen one single thing that does not change. It seems everything must flow and circulate.
The greeks were one of the best civilizations in certain ways, but in a few ways they also failed.
We come from white cultures here in canada. There is a bit of greatness in it but it’s all watered down too.
I’m going a bit off topic on my own thread here but, I think it is very common to go off topic in ILP. It’s the only way we can keep it interesting.
---
### Author:  [@Dan1](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Dan1)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 2:47am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/22 "2013-08-01T02:47:59Z")
A strong and true soul can transcend reality.
I believe definitely in a minority of magic-capable human-shaped peeps.
These peeps I am 100% sure about.
It’s taken me time to get there, but I’m there.
Now, they tend to sense energy better, and have more energy in their body, in general.
I think it might be that a soul is only energy. It is the building block of all, therefor it makes sense that at our roots we are not people but instead we are energy.
Maybe a strong and true soul only builds up bunk around itself. It transcends only to instantly submit to whims and principals.
I do not consider the powerful more free than the weak, even though I used to think that way.
I still think it’s possible that I don’t have a soul.
I think it might actually be highly possible.
I almost welcome it. I hope I don’t go through the recycling machine when I die. All that crap.
Ancient culture is all about humanity, and humanity is all about ancient culture.
That is why I’m talking about magic and the soul.
That is the most ancient stuff. Self understanding in that form only.
The modern twist is to abort “primative culture”. Evolution popped up in the classical age. Refined bastards effected it. It’s changed allot, but still, we’ve got refined bastards.
---
### Author:  [@eyesinthedark](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/eyesinthedark)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/23 "2013-08-01T21:17:50Z")
> [@James S Saint](#):
>
> > [@eyesinthedark](#):
> >
> > Ultimately, the cause of everything is chaos.
>
> Nope.
How do you figure?
---
### Author:  [@Dan1](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Dan1)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 9:25pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/24 "2013-08-01T21:25:14Z")
Maybe it’s not a battle between good and bad dna, but I feel a battle inside of me between sickness and health, garbage and gold, foolishness and wisdom. I feel that the conflict will only end when I die. However, I feel like the good parts of me are in control. Also I am on some good meds. I have meds power. It’s hard to mess with it. I hope one day they make a med that can fix a person from an asshole into a non-asshole. That would be some good medicine.
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### Author:  [@Dan1](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Dan1)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 9:26pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/25 "2013-08-01T21:26:39Z")
> [@eyesinthedark](#):
>
> > [@James S Saint](#):
> >
> > > [@eyesinthedark](#):
> > >
> > > Ultimately, the cause of everything is chaos.
> >
> > Nope.
>
> How do you figure?
If he said “there is some chaos, in some places allot, but, there is also order”, it would mean allot more than the word “nope.”
Even though I’m not a relativist, almost everything exists in relative degrees. Relatively chaotic, ordered, etc. Those are all relative things.
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### Author:  [@Orbie](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Orbie)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 9:30pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/26 "2013-08-01T21:30:18Z")
I think a truly strong “soul” can withstand the test of jest, or implicated hocus focus ideas of relevance, and retain a sense of reality without needing to rely on a counter reality test of meaning by approximating that reality.
This sense is kind of like a 6th sense, where wrap around ideas seem to trump any common sense for basically esoteric reasons. This type of idea has been established long ago, the most interesting example of this type is personified in the character of Saint Germain
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### Author:  [@eyesinthedark](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/eyesinthedark)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/27 "2013-08-01T21:34:48Z")
Dan
> [@](#):
>
> Chaos has multiple meanings also.
> It could simply be an omnidirectional meta energy. It doesn’t have to be thunder and fire and f- it all up chaos. That is disorder, or one order destroying another order. Either way, when things diverge, change always happens. I have not seen one single thing that does not change. It seems everything must flow and circulate.
I’d say chaos is pure chance.
Our universe is the way it is by way of pure chance.
Chance tends to give way to multidirectionality as opposed to monodirectionality.
As multidirectional or monodirectional as our universe is, it could be infinitely more multidirectional or monodirectional. If other universes exist, there’s no reason why they wouldn’t have completely and utterly different laws than our own.
Therefore, pure rationalism is untenable.
> [@](#):
>
> The greeks were one of the best civilizations in certain ways, but in a few ways they also failed.
> We come from white cultures here in canada. There is a bit of greatness in it but it’s all watered down too.
Canada is a nice, but boring place.
Cold climates have an effect on people, keeping them indoors, and cerebral and introverted. Canada has no metanarrative. Curiously, having no metanarrative has become its metanarrative. It’s difficult to unite so many disparate classes, colors and creeds behind anything other than, freedom, money and security.
> [@](#):
>
> I’m going a bit off topic on my own thread here but, I think it is very common to go off topic in ILP. It’s the only way we can keep it interesting.
So long as we get back on track at some point.
---
### Author:  [@Orbie](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Orbie)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 9:45pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/28 "2013-08-01T21:45:52Z")
One way of getting back on track is to accept/ ignore-
Ance, of certain aspects of reality as hierarhically more determinative. Some of these in a seeming chaos, are not apprehendable, or open to interpretation. For an enlightened soul it matters little, one way or the other, but for others, unrealised hierarchy they project certain pre determined sturctural breaks.
These breaks are not totally of chance, but equally determinative. Pure chance is only appearant because of a limited probability field.
(Ance has a meaning too+it’s not advertant sloPpy writing)
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### Author:  [@eyesinthedark](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/eyesinthedark)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 11:03pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/29 "2013-08-01T23:03:21Z")
If I understand James, he believes the world is the way it is because of logical necessity.
The way it is, is the way it had to be.
I believe the opposite.
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### Author:  [@Orbie](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Orbie)
#### Post date: [August 1, 2013, 11:28pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/30 "2013-08-01T23:28:20Z")
May be the way we learn is seemingly in ordinate. A baby has very few choices. As a matter of fact the only choices he has are in control of the mother. Either get the milk or not. The start is based on binary needs. A total reduction of inverse probability has logical base. Certainty is based on existential need. Reductionism (entropy) is a reaction to chaos(redundancy)
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### Author:  [@Dan1](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Dan1)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 1:45am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/31 "2013-08-02T01:45:32Z")
> [@eyesinthedark](#):
>
> If I understand James, he believes the world is the way it is because of logical necessity.
>
> The way it is, is the way it had to be.
>
> I believe the opposite.
“Had to be” what is it doing. Is it forcing itself to be forced to be a certain way? If it’s not forcing itself to be a certain way, only some kind of god figure could force it to be a certain way.
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### Author:  [@Ben\_JS](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ben_JS)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 3:23am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/32 "2013-08-02T03:23:49Z")
> [@James S Saint](#):
>
> > [@eyesinthedark](#):
> >
> > Ultimately, the cause of everything is chaos.
>
> Nope.
+1
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### Author:  [@Helandhighwater](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Helandhighwater)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 10:17pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/33 "2013-08-02T22:17:30Z")
> [@Joe Schmoe](#):
>
> > [@James S Saint](#):
> >
> > > [@eyesinthedark](#):
> > >
> > > Ultimately, the cause of everything is chaos.
> >
> > Nope.
>
> +1
-1
1 word answers are like someone farting and sniffing it, there should only be one person in that room that is going to feel satisfied by their efforts.
I said yep for irony value. Although I must admit my farts don’t stink so I am the exception that proves the rule. 😉
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### Author:  [@James\_S\_Saint](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/James_S_Saint)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 10:39pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/34 "2013-08-02T22:39:13Z")
> [@eyesinthedark](#):
>
> If I understand James, he believes the world is the way it is because of logical necessity.
>
> The way it is, is the way it had to be.
>
> I believe the opposite.
You understood me right in that regard. 🕶
Nothing is possible until something is impossible. And you can’t get more consistent, reliable, and orderly than impossible.
To have chaos requires a degree of order. Absolute chaos is absolute nothingness. Chaos is formed by having small specs of ordered somethings randomly ordered or randomly behaving. If those specs were themselves only chaos, there would be nothing to randomly order or to randomly behave. In more mathematical terms, the sum of truly all frequencies is zero.
The propagation of light, for example is neither random nor chaotic. Light (or better termed “radiant energy”) travels at one specific speed (in a vacuum). That speed is set due to the logic of the propagation of any affect. It is logically impossible for any affect to propagate at an infinite or arbitrary speed. There is mathematics behind exactly why that is. Even when there is absolutely nothing to impede the propagation speed, no affect can travel at an infinite rate. The only thing preventing it is logic itself (I can go through the details if necessary).
That speed of light then becomes the standard by which all physical things obtain their size. Sizes are relative to the speed of light or the “speed of affect”. Thus literally the size of those specs is fixed, not chaotic at all, although perhaps randomly distributed. If those specs also have a vector, that too can be randomly distributed and thus create chaos. But if it had not been for the logical impossibility of infinite propagation, those specs wouldn’t have a size and wouldn’t even exist.
Without order, there can be no chaos. But the logical impossibility of infinite propagation requires no chaos to exist.
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### Author:  [@Helandhighwater](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Helandhighwater)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 11:04pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/35 "2013-08-02T23:04:50Z")
> [@James S Saint](#):
>
> Without order, there can be no chaos. But the logical impossibility of infinite propagation requires no chaos to exist.
Without chaos there can be no order then, to define order we need to have a mark by which something is more or less ordered, for such a mark to make sense there needs to be disorder or chaos which is a tendency to disorder, just as there needs to be a form or order to distinguish disorder or your terms are pointless? Also infinite propagation in an ever expanding universe leads to constant attenuation and eventual disorder, the only way your conclusion would make sense is if you could prove the universe is static, does not expand and will not eventually attenuate into something approaching disorder, what is now is what will always be. Your conclusions seem to be at odds with all physical evidence and logical reason.
It’s better than nope, but not by much.
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### Author:  [@James\_S\_Saint](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/James_S_Saint)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 11:21pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/36 "2013-08-02T23:21:21Z")
> [@Helandhighwater](#):
>
> > [@James S Saint](#):
> >
> > Without order, there can be no chaos. But the logical impossibility of infinite propagation requires no chaos to exist.
>
> Without chaos there can be no order then, to define order we need to have a mark by which something is more or less ordered
What chaos brings into the existence of the impossibility of infinite propagation (for one example of any proposed impossibility)?
I assert that the impossibility was there regardless of any notion of chaos and doesn’t even require the concept of chaos itself.
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### Author:  [@Moreno](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Moreno)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 11:23pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/37 "2013-08-02T23:23:29Z")
If Everything is pure chaos, I can’t see how it could evolve into even partial order. A universe of pure chaos would be impervious.
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### Author:  [@Helandhighwater](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Helandhighwater)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 11:23pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/38 "2013-08-02T23:23:58Z")
> [@James S Saint](#):
>
> > [@Helandhighwater](#):
> >
> > > [@James S Saint](#):
> > >
> > > Without order, there can be no chaos. But the logical impossibility of infinite propagation requires no chaos to exist.
> >
> > Without chaos there can be no order then, to define order we need to have a mark by which something is more or less ordered
>
> What chaos brings into the existence of the impossibility of infinite propagation (for one example of any proposed impossibility)?
>
> I assert that the impossibility was there regardless of any notion of chaos and doesn’t even require the concept of chaos itself.
Your argument uses chaos to form an argument, rendering your argument meaningless since it does not exist. You can’t have your cake and eat it James.
You can’t use chaos to formulate an argument that chaos does not exist.
Example God does not exist cannot be proven by using a concept of God in your argument. Proving things don’t exist, James you should know better than that.
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### Author:  [@James\_S\_Saint](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/James_S_Saint)
#### Post date: [August 2, 2013, 11:47pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/39 "2013-08-02T23:47:32Z")
> [@James S Saint](#):
>
> > [@James S Saint](#):
> >
> > Without chaos there can be no order then, to define order we need to have a mark by which something is more or less ordered
>
> What chaos brings into the existence of the impossibility of infinite propagation (for one example of any proposed impossibility)?
>
> I assert that the impossibility was there regardless of any notion of chaos and doesn’t even require the concept of chaos itself.
> [@Helandhighwater](#):
>
> Your argument uses chaos to form an argument, rendering your argument meaningless since it does not exist. You can’t have your cake and eat it James.
My “argument” didn’t use chaos at all other than to assert that it wasn’t required.
So what are you talking about?
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### Author:  [@Orbie](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Orbie)
#### Post date: [August 3, 2013, 12:29am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/my-genes-making-me-this-way/36705/40 "2013-08-03T00:29:16Z")
If chaos and order is reduced to possibility and impossibility, then, order is sufficiently and necessarily prioritized, and temporalized.
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