Just a quick note; Nazis I have spoken to think their philosophies are in line with evolution in terms of survival of the fittest. Yet if there were two main ideas in evolution, then perhaps strength would be one, and yet evolution also finds strength through diversity, spreading the seed! …and this is in total contradiction to Nazi philosophies.
So are Nazis strong or weak?
Without diversity don’t we end up with duelling banjos [aka deliverance/inbreeds etc]
Did you ask them to explain which of their philosophies were in line with evolution? Or did you just hear vaguely that they think their philosophies are in line and then come and make this thread with your own assumptions about what they meant, without bothering to find out why they think that?
The Nazis are probably the last people to consult about scientific theories, or anything else for that matter, but it’s worth pointing out that even in their own terms, they were the weaker. They believed that might is right, and the Germans would dominate Europe and the world by being stronger, and therefore superior. In the event, they lost, and were therefore proved weaker.
Like many people, the Nazis had an over-literalist interpreation of the term “survival of the fittest”. In fact, human societies prosper in times of peace and co-operation, and those societies that foster such conditions tend to do better in the long run. In other words, those societies are “fitter”, because they succeed.
IMH/SO, you can’t take a single incident, event, battle, or war and imply any evolutionary concern from it.
IMH/SO, the fact that the Nazis almost won two world wars implies that they were anything but weak. But the real contest was between the “superman” and the “invisible man”, the bold versus the insidious. Europe wasn’t aware of who was pulling the strings of conflict and chaos or exactly why or what to do about it. The Nazis were the result. So in that sense, they were the properly perceived Nietzschean master arising from the chaos (and associated with evolution). But the real truth is that the “chaos” was not natural, so true evolution doesn’t really apply. The game was rigged.
IMH/SO, But then that means that even their apparent strength was also tainted by them being supported unwittingly (or at least during WW1). That gave them the impression (and everyone else) that they were stronger than they might have actually been. Again, a rigged game disqualifies all conclusions.
IMH/SO, Generally speaking, the Germans are noted for boldness. That behavior has its strengths, but also has its weaknesses. I would say that they are definitely not the weakest group of people on the planet. But who wins any war is largely circumstantial (who had the advantage at the time for whatever reason).
IMH/SO, The evolutionary principle of the survival of the fittest can’t actually be determined until the entire game is over. That is going to be quite a while. I personally don’t expect homosapian to be in the running.
Btw I don’t think Germany is or was weak, quite the opposite.
Flannel Jesus
Many things, but my son was watching a documentary so we got into a bit of a debate. Of note was where Hitler belittled the Jews, stating that they lived everywhere and nowhere ~ they had no homeland etc. the complaint seamed to contradict the evolutionary notion of strength through diversity [spreading the seed].
People at a Nazi forum often spoke of complete economic and industrial independence for Germany [or given nation of birth], such that their race wouldn’t have to globalise and would stay pure.
Just listen to any of jokers stuff and it sounds similar.
James S Saint
So who do you think are pulling the strings?
Why is WWI included, germans were not Nazis back then surely?
IMH/SO, They weren’t called “Nazis” at that time. They were the “German Workers’ Party”, but after WW1 adopted a nationalism emphasis, probably to exclude the notion of being the underclass of the nation and include officials sympathetic to the cause, hence “Nationalsozialist”. I’m certainly no expert on the social details, but on the higher level, it was obviously an oppression reaction and they learned a lot after the first go around.
No, I mean that what you’re doing just looks like the internet equivalent of a facial tick. Nobody cares if you have some private reason for producing a fake facial tick.
IMH/SO, Perception is very largely the aberrant effect of the perceiver.
How about perceive what the topic of this thread is and stick to it (and I’m not it)?
But the German aristocracy etc were not socialists as far as I know, hence at most I am assuming ‘Nazis’ [or former] to be a small underclass and not the basis for the war effort.
Either way, back to the philosophical point; we can surely state categorically that strength can be found through diversity and weakness from the lack of it?
The only reason the Nazis lost was because THE ENTIRE WORLD ganged up to stop them. And the Nazis still almost overcame THE ENTIRE WORLD against them. Like you could do any better?
Diversity doesn’t entail strength, that’s like saying we should include more people born with severe genetic defects into the gene pool, in order to make us all stronger. Diversity doesn’t entail strength, as long as you’re not copulating with your 2nd cousin or more familiar, you won’t increase your odds of producing offspring with genetic defects. It’s like saying racial hybrids are superior to the racial purebreds, as far as I’m aware, there’s no evidence to suggest this. mongoloids won’t increase their iQs by mating with negroids, they’ll likely lower them, if indeed negroids have lower iQs on average due to genetics rather than environment (they certainly have smaller brains). If it were possible to mate with gorillas, would the outcome of such a union produce superior beings, or would they gain some of one advantage (strength) while losing some of a more important one (intelligence)?
Keep in mind what distinguishes Nazis isn’t merely their race, it’s their ideology. They lost because people from America, Britain and France defeated them, and Americans, British and Frech were descended largely from European Stock. It was a battle of ideologies, not races.
Like James said, although I tend to agree with you, it’s not an absolute, as Europeans increased their prosperity by colonizing the Americans.
It was the Russians who made the single biggest contribution to defeating the Nazis, and they were regarded as subhuman by them, fit only to be exploited and killed.
[aka deliverance/inbreeds etc]
