On the soul

Do we have "souls?"

  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

What is a soul? How can we prove it exists?

I can think in my head, but are those thoughts simply random neurons firing in response to external and internal stimuli?

What about humans makes them different from the rest of “living” species?

What kind of actions make a person “soulless?”

If one does indeed believe in a soul, where did it come from, what are its characteristics, and what is its purpose?

Is the soul seperate from the body or is it forever connected to it?

Is one soul seperate from the next soul or are they all part of one continuous soul or “God?”

Nientilin wrote :

I think it was Hume who said our mind is a collection of thoughts and perceptions and memories, etc. Well, I think the soul is analogous to the mind. As thoughts, perceptions, memories etc are to the mind, xxxx is to the soul. I haven’t thought about what xxxx is, but I think the answer lies along this path…just as the mind is a manifestion of things derived from the senses, somehow dependent on sensations of the physical world, the soul depends on something too. Remove those somethings, and there is no soul.

A sort refutation in the form of a question: ever been knocked out?

Below is something I’ve been writing for another forum on the Mind-Body Problem, but it seems to apply here. I have not yet finished revising it, but I think it articulates basic points well enough to provide a general understanding…

Gabriel
http://www.wearesaved.org

Maybe the soul was created to keep people in line. You need a good soul to get into heaven right? So if you tell a child "your sins hurt your soul " then they will ofcorse live a life where they try not to sin.
A soulless man is one who just doenst care about the rules of life. He has broken them so many times he has no soul.

That’s why I don’t believe in this all loving god. Where is God for the rest of the world. Why is the bible only about humans? We created the soul to keep us from living a life enriched with sin.

Couldn’t agree with you more about the species thing INoNothing, christianity seems to run dry on compassion when it comes to other animals, which especially post Darwin seems nothing but dubious! I have heard interpretations of the bible (the new testement i guess) which don’t condone the killing of animals. For example there is no mention of jesus ever eating animals (I believe). Also I’ve heard it argued that the ten commandments dont’ specify humans specifically (thou shall not kill, NOT thou shall not kill humans). Also it’s worth remembering that Hinduism differs form the other main theistic religions because it does believe one shouldn’t kill animals or kill them to sufer.

Recommended reading: Aristotle’s On the Soul

I don’t think so ether but Jesus does command his followers to cast there nets on the other side of there fishing boat. Why? Only to prove a point. That led to the killing of hundreds of fish! The fish slowly suffered to death as the disciples followed in aw. Why did the fish disserve to die such a death? It might seem like a silly comparison but fish do feel, the can suffer just like us cant they.

Also didn’t Jesus eat with the thousands of people he fed with only 4 fish and 3 loafs of bread (something like that) if so then ate something that was alive, but I don’t recall any meat eating. unless you constitute fish as a type of meat. Which I think does make sense.

Homunclus stated:

I don’t recall Hume saying that, but you may be right. It was locke who said that who we are is a collection of all our memories from our past. Take that away and who we are is lost.

Nientilin,
it usually helps when the thread starter also contributes in giving his/her own view or opinion on the matter. For instance, in an effort to answer your question I would have to understand what exactly you mean by soul. Coincidentally, it is your first question. As for myself, I will have to say that any definition I have ever heard of soul has not convinced me of its existence (though I am open to new definition of it, as well as, revising my opinion). However, I think there is something to us that has not been found yet. When I say “I am not myself”, I refer to a feeling generally accompanied with everything I do, every second, of every day that has dissipated. I’m not saying that this is the soul, though it may be, but I definitely think that as far as human beings understanding each others meaning when we say “I am not myself” goes, we are like worms trying to understand an a-bomb exploding. Locke, however, has helped me to understand my own curiosity to a certain degree. He speaks of different criteria associated with our defining ourselves. For instance, who we are isn’t simply a collection of memories from our past, but it must be the memories from our past that we have a sense of ownership to. Allow me to elaborate, Locke believed that the memories you have but don’t have a sense of ownership to are not really you. So, all those experiences you have where you wondered at yourself and how you could have done that or the other - usually extreme and stressful situation - are not really you (this has certain legal and moral implications that are beyond the scope of this post). Now, although I don’t really agree with Locke that who we are is simply a collection of our memories (with his allocated criteria - one of which is the sense of ownership) but I do think he was barking up a similar tree as I. For when I say “I am not myself” there is a lack of ownership to the things I do, say, and even think. Moreover, there is a certain disdain for what I am doing, saying, and thinking because its like there is someone else inside me. This isn’t to say that I am not in control, I am, but things are different. picks up shovel and begins digging

I’m going to stop before I dig myself into such a deep hole of babble that I’ll come out in China - and everything I say will be so foreign that I may as well be speaking chinese.

Anyway,
I hope someone can sympathize with my words…

I think our understandings of how our brain functions is pretty strong evidence that our “soul” (aka personality/cognition/sensory awareness …) cannot carry over once the organ called the “brain” fails. We have strong evidence of how the “soul” is impacted by brain trauma.
Corliss Lamont’s “The Philosophy of Humanism” makes an excellent argument for this. Here’s a link for the entire work: http://www.corliss-lamont.org It is a free download about midway down the page.

However, if one wants to centralize the soul as being works of the brain, then I have no problem with that. I think the belief that the “soul” will carry on after death is denial of the end of our experience. However, so what if our experience comes to an end? It isn’t that bad as people think it is. Having experience coming to an end is a heck of a lot easier than contemplating where you are going to spend your eternal vacation due to your specific affiliations. :smiley: or :imp: ? lol

What I said about Hume came from a philosophy of mind book in a chapter talking about Selves. I guess you could take the term self as a synomym of person? Anyway, Hume was an empiricist, which most of you already know. I will quote from my book - “His(Hume’s) view of experience was very precise: It consists of two types of phenomena : impressions (that is, sensory perceptions or passions) and ideas (“faded” versons of impressions, as in imagination and memory). Everything we can know, he argued, should be grounded in one of these phenomena. His question about Self, then, amounted to the question of whether or not we have any impression, and thereby any idea of Self. Put more simply, do we have any perception of the Self?” He gives the answer in Treatise of Human Nature, Book 1, Part 4, Section 6. I won’t type that whole passage, but in effect "Hume was looking for an impression of something that is enduring and unified, and this is what he fails to find. So he denies in effect that the sort of Self that Descartes defended can be supported by any evidence from our experience. Hume goes on to say that the notion of a simple, enduring Self (of the sort that Descartes defended) is a fiction. But then what is it that the term Self refers to? Hume claims, on the basis of his reflection on his experience, that we can only be referring to collections of perceptions, since that is all that experience ever finds. He notes that we often treat things that are variable or serial as if they were one - an acorn that becomes an oak tree, or a boat that has had various of its parts replaced, are still treated as if they were the same objects. From his point of view, all that experience can show us is that the human person is a serious of constantly changing perceptions. But our imaginations have a tendency to lump the series of impressions together as if they formed one thing, a Self. He suggests that memory aids in this by noting resemblances among earlier perceptions and later ideas. "
This was from What is a Mind? , by Suzanne Cunningham from Hackett Publishing Company, Indianapolis,Indiana

There is more, but you guys can get the general drift from this. Hume himself admits there are problems with his view…

Why it is NECESSARY for philosophers to believe in Souls and an Afterlife

Whether or not human beings have “souls” that can survive corporeal death ultimately matters far more than many realize. Ultimately, we need to believe in an afterlife in order to rationally discuss any philosophical topic. Here’s why…

When it comes to the question of whether or not there is an afterlife that our “souls” can experience, there is only one thing an individual can say with absolute certainty and that is: I don’t know. To claim either that there is an afterlife or that there is not one is to embrace a guess that cannot be proven. Neither guess can be rationally criticized for lacking certitude since both of them lack it in equal measure. So why choose either one? Well, we may want to try to simply accept an open-ended state of uncertainty about the topic without qualification, but that is something human beings find very difficult to do. Typically, in the absence of certainty, we can’t help but make a guess. (We may not have a great deal of confidence in our provisional guesses, but we still tend to lean toward some more than others) So which guess should we “lean toward?”

Well, one thing to consider is the fact that each of the choices leads us to different consequences. For example, if we choose to embrace the assumption that there is no afterlife, we are then forced by logic to conclude that nothing we do in this life ultimately matters. Sure, we may find ourselves perceiving meaning or purpose in many of the things we do in our lives, but we cannot escape the logical conclusion that all such perceptions of meaning can be nothing but an illusion if we believe that corporeal death = non-existence. Some will say, “Well, yes, everything we do may be ultimately meaningless, but it is logical right now for us to believe that the meaning we see is real because we are able to experience the desirable consequences that give certain actions their meaning.”

But aren’t all the meaningful acts that we perceive/experience in this life included in a subordinate, constituent way as part of a conceived Meaningful Life? When human beings endure long periods of suffering, they often find themselves wondering if the “sacrifice” they are making is worth the goal that the sacrifices are being made for. If they believe (guess) that corporeal death = non-existence, then logic keeps telling them that there is no end perceivable that can be worth the suffering. They see that if there lives are not being lived for anything, if nothing that they do or experience is going to affect the ultimate outcome in a desirable way, then it is utterly futile to continue to endure the pain of life. It is a conclusion that is logical, given the premises, but it is also a logic that defines all that we do as utterly meaningless. It forces us to conclude that people who make sacrifices in pursuit of some “worthy” goal are merely suffering from one of the bizarre illusional experiences that this meaningless existence foists upon us. Were you a good person in your life? A Hitler? What possibly difference could it make if you were good person or a bad person in your life, if when you die you cease to exist? If you believe that corporeal death is final death, then when you die, as far as you are concerned, it never happened.

Some would say, “Yes, but…the people who survive you will know about you and think well of you if you were good.” But how could it possibly matter if those who survive your death happen to remember you for a little while? When your witnesses die, the memory of you will also die. You never happened. What’s interesting is that most of those who reject the concept of an afterlife also believe that the sun will one day explode, consuming every bit of evidence that human beings ever existed. At that point, how could it possibly matter whether or not there had ever been a Story of the Human Race? If we human beings knew with absolute certainty that there is no existence after corporeal death, then we would have to give serious consideration to the option of committing mass suicide, since it really wouldn’t matter if we did or not. To intentionally end the Human Experiment would be no tragedy whatsoever since we’d know that the day would come when it never really happened, anyway. We might as well spite whoever or whatever it is that was responsible for forcing a meaningless existence upon us if it is true that corporeal death = final death. Ultimately, as far as we are concerned, when/if our personal existence is annihilated, the entire universe’s existence is annihilated.

It is interesting that many scientists and philosophers reject the possibility of an afterlife, even though they value The Truth, and enjoy using their minds to improve their understanding of many of life’s mysteries. Such individuals are living out their lives as profound hypocrites. If they really believe that corporeal death = non-existence, then how could it possibly matter to them if they are able to figure out the answer to any question? What difference does it make if we manage to find some answers in this life? If human beings are able to make any kind of improvements in the ways that life is experienced, so what? You want to know how the mind works? What consciousness is? What difference does it make? Why even bother to argue with someone that there is no such thing as an afterlife? If you believe it, then it can’t possibly matter to you if anyone else does because it would achieve nothing of significance if you could convince them otherwise. You might as well spend your time seeking out every sort of forbidden experience you can imagine that you currently avoid, instead. Whether you were a good person in this life or a bad person whom everyone feared, it doesn’t matter. You might as well be bad. If you sincerely believe that corporeal death = non-existence, you cannot justify being good as a matter of principle. In the long run, friendships will mean nothing, so why bother with them now? Why not just use people, instead? You’ve got nothing to lose. If somebody wants to put you in jail, just kill yourself. It really isn’t going to matter if you do. For all it matters, you might as well be a destroyer of all that others value, because after you die, you never were anyway. Sounds like Nihilism, doesn’t it? It is simply the logical conclusion that follows the assumption that corporeal death = non-existence.

These consequences are painful. That is to say, they are not thoughts that make us feel good. Among the few absolute certainties in this life is the fact that we experience pain and pleasure as a condition of existence. Painful and pleasurable feelings are not experiences that we give to ourselves. They are “externally” imposed on us, just as our existence was imposed on us (at least we do not recall making the request). We find that these painful and pleasurable experiences are the consequence of NEEDS that are imposed on us as a condition of existence. Among the many different types of needs we are forced to deal with are those that fit into the category of Mental Needs. Among our Mental Needs is the need for “perceived purpose”, i.e., a need to see ultimate meaning in the things that we do. When this Need for Purpose is not satisfied, we are punished with the pain that follows perceived Futility. When this pain is experienced, the fear response is triggered. When it comes to questions about whether or not we will experience an Afterlife, the ultimate consequence of “making the wrong guess” is pain and fear. If, on the other hand, we embrace the guess that we somehow continue to exist after our bodies die, we are rewarded with a sense of well-being, of relieved anxiety. We are able to “enjoy life” because we believe that the things we do matter. When we make the right guess, logic gives us permission to fully embrace the meaning that we naturally perceive in the things that we do in this life. It feels good to invest yourself in a cause, to dedicate your life to self-perfection, to become an agent of The Good, to enjoy loving and being loved. It makes sense to discuss philosophical questions because we are free to assume that it serves an important, ultimate purpose.

(Note to all Nihilists/Existentialists: Human beings do not create value/purpose/meaning by “assigning” it into existence. All purpose/meaning in this life is ultimately determined by the NEEDS that are externally imposed on us (external to our Will) as a condition of our existence. There is no “freedom” from the consequences and therefore no freedom from our needs. Indeed, we are slaves to our needs.)

Given that these are the consequences of the guesses we make about the idea of an Afterlife, one has to wonder why some adamantly insist there isn’t one. Well, some atheists probably fear that acknowledging the necessity of an Afterlife would mean that they must necessarily also embrace the idea of God, but that would not be true. Belief in one does not necessitate belief in the other. Belief in an Afterlife—with or without God—is crucially important because it is a condition that must be met in order for us to believe there is ultimate meaning in our lives, but one can believe there is “Ultimate Purpose” without embracing any particular conception of God. Another reason why some people are inclined to reject a “feel-good” answer in the face of uncertainty is because they fear it might be just another example of wishful thinking. It’s a legitimate concern since there are many examples of wishful thinking in human history that obscured some important, sober truths about our experience that we really needed to accept in order to find real answers. It is wrong, however, to reject all wishful thinking simply because it is wishful thinking. We must ask what truth the wishful thinking might be covering up before rejecting it out of hand. (A good deal of my website vision at http://www.wearesaved.org is based on my identification of one particularly damaging example of wishful thinking.) But this concern about wishful thinking does not rationally apply to the belief in an afterlife because no benefit whatsoever can be gleaned from the more “courageous” assumption that corporeal death = non-existence. Ultimately, it makes sense to question an assumption only if one can point out some way we might benefit from rejecting it.

In light of all these arguments, one has to wonder why someone would willfully choose to embrace the guess that corporeal death = final death. Let’s suppose that you are one of those who choose to “believe” (guess) that there is an afterlife and that this life matters. If you then die and find out that your guess was wrong, it could be accurately said that you were happily deluded while you existed on earth and paid no penalty for it. But suppose your guess was that death = non-existence. Then, if you found out upon death that your guess was wrong, it could be rightfully said that you suffered the pain of perceived futility (cognitive dissonance) throughout your life for nothing. You suffered needlessly. If your guess was correct, then you experienced no advantage over the deluded individuals who guessed wrongly for it didn’t really matter what anyone believed about anything. The question I have for those who dismiss the possibility of an Afterlife is simply this: Why embrace such a “stupid” guess when the opposite guess [that there is an Afterlife]: 1) feels good, 2) is necessary in order to pursue any discussion of morality, and 3) is necessary in order for you to rationally discuss any philosophical topic?

Gabriel
http://www.wearesaved.org

Hey Gadfly of ILP:laughing:

Why have you not responded to my response to you on the “Is there even anything left to say?” thread?

I thought you were a patient man who is willing to wait for an answer?

:wink:

Gabriel

I disagree respectfully. “We” don’t need to believe in the afterlife, but it is perfectly fine for “you” to believe in the afterlife.

I have no need to request for more than my mortality has to offer. This is it for me and I can humbly accept it as such. I accept my beginning and I accept my ending. This is something we witness throughout life and is perfectly applicable for us. In fact, it really is quite comforting once you accept it as such. I realize that those who believe in afterlife think that no belief in the afterlife is a horrible thing, but this is a myth. It is quite comforting and the discomfort for afterlife believers is the same discomfort that comes from death itself. No discomfort here with death. I certainly don’t seek it out, but I most certainly accept it as an end to my consciousness. It isn’t nowhere near as bad as many afterlife believers claim it to be. Of course if they realized this, then they probably wouldn’t have no need to believe in the afterlife, but to each their own.
:smiley:

Enigma:

I’m so sorry…

Perhaps some day you won’t be afraid to embrace that which feels good. It really doesn’t hurt, you know…

I thought that I should point out that people do not create their horror of death. Sure, part of what people fear when they fear death is the physical pain that usually accompanies corporeal death. But the part that really scares people is beholding the conceivable possibility that their experience of life is utterly futile (if they assume that death is final).

Fear of futility is something that is part of our fundamental programming. When people perceive futility they are going to experience fear. Period. The fear goes away when to perception of futility ends. It’s that simple…

Gabriel
http://www.wearesaved.org

Gabriel stated:

Is this friendly banter or condescencion?

Quite Friendly, I can assure you…
:smiley:

I was just trying to let you know that I did finally respond to your Hume comments in case you weren’t aware that I had…

Gabriel

So by putting an ending to our experience that makes the entire experience “futile?” Now I understand that this is how you feel, but to me this is simply absurd. Just because there is a begining and an ending, that doesn’t mean what comes in between is “futile.” It is anything BUT that. There is a ton of meaning found between the beginning and ending.
No ending seems futile to me and also goes against everything we witness in nature. The “futility” is found in seeking out what comes after the end. Now that is futile in my opinion. While you are seeking out ways to celebrate eternity (ignoring mortality in the process), I’m only concerned with celebrating my mortality. I find it interesting that one has to conjur up unfounded propositional logic in order to give their mortal life meaning. I certainly don’t have such worries thankfully. My mortal life is enough and is the ultimate prize. For that I am thankful and content. While your hoping for heaven, I’m already there. :wink:

Two Sides of the Story

 [b]A[/b]	

An afterlife!

He said to him,

With great confidence,

Filled to the brim.

This life must be

I know of it

From what I’ve seen

I can tell of it.
B

		But be it not,

		For I say so,

		You have no proof

		For no one knows.


		
		An afterlife?

		Not my concern,

		How could it help?

		I'm here to learn.			
   [b]A[/b] 

Now how can you,

With a sober mind,

Read my words,

And still be blind.

I say to you,

There is no death.

The afterlife is

Reason for our breath.

                                                      [b]B[/b]

		I see your words,

		But still I know.

		What matters to me,
	
		Is how we grow.

		
		I am in this life,

		To make the best.

		I'll do what it takes,

		Who cares about the rest.
    [b]A[/b]   

But you should know,

To be at rest,

Death is not the end,

It is only a test.

Our choices here,

Would be futile then,

If we didn’t exist,

From beginning to end.

                                                        [b] B[/b]

		But YOU should know,

		That I'm just fine,

		I'm know I'm dying,

		And I don't need a line.


		
		I've found my peace,

		In the moment now,

		I'm happy to live,

		Now don't tell me how[i].(characters exit)[/i]

(now sitting separately in their own houses reviewing the conversation similarly)

    [b]A[/b]                        

He could not understand,

    [b]B[/b]                               

He could not comprehend

    [b]A[/b]

He would not listen,

    [b]B[/b]

His words would never end.

    [b]A[/b]

I know that I’m right

    [b]B[/b]

I know that he’s wrong

    [b]A&B[/b]

But either way I know,

Eventually we’re gonna have to get along

To all:

There seems to be some misunderstanding of what I’m saying. Let’s try a fresh approach…

Descartes’ introspective search for absolute certainty was flawed in that he did not recognize the Most Fundamental Truths about his existence before he began talking about God. After noticing that he was a thing that thinks, he should have noted the primary “cause” of everything he thinks about . One does not have to exist as a human for very long before one notices that the experience involves a good many “painful” and “pleasurable” events, without necessarily understanding what is causing them to happen. The pain events vary across a wide spectrum: from agony to “discomfort”, ennui, angst, boredom, or even just a feeling that “something’s missing.” The range of pleasure events varies from ecstasy to joy, relief, contentment, a feeling of “satisfaction” or that things “make sense.” With additional experience and some reflection, one notices that it is possible to “do things” that will make painful experiences occur less frequently and pleasurable experience more frequently. We have come to recognize that these painful and pleasurable events occur because certain NEEDS have been imposed on us as a condition of our existence. Some of these needs are purely physical in nature, e.g., food, water, sex. Other “higher” needs seemingly exist only within the mind. Some of them are “emotional” needs like our fundamental need for approval. Others seem to be related to the structure of our thought. For example, we fear the unknown because we have a “need” to understand, or at least to have put together some familiar ontology. Our continuing challenge as existing humans has been to try to improve our understanding of what these needs are in order that we might be able to better arrange for their satisfaction so that we can minimize the painful experiences and maximize the pleasurable one. With these needs we are given Purpose. Without externally imposed needs, we are devoid of Purpose.

We have found these needs to be a reliable guide in our efforts to understand this life experience. Indeed, they are our ONLY guide to understanding. When our understanding of our needs has been accurate, we have been able to use it to arrange for their regular satisfaction. In those areas where our understanding has remained poor (e.g., understanding emotional needs), we have languished in seas of continuing need-dissatisfaction. How do we know that others have the same needs that we have? It is a guess, a guess that is continually validated as we observe others and communicate with them. They unfailingly show us that they are dealing with the same needs. We are always free to doubt this assumption, but my experience has been that I can always reveal the truth that others have the same needs that I have. I have as much confidence in my assumption that all human beings have the exact same needs that I have as I have in my assumption that I will still be existing 24 hours from now. If someone tells me that he doesn’t have the same need that I have, I will simply smile because I know that I will be exposing the truth to him eventually…

Among our mental needs there is a need to see “purpose” in any of the actions we consider executing. The fact that human beings perceive “purpose”, “meaning”, and “values” is attributable to the fact that human being have needs. If we value some thing or situation, we value it because we perceive it to be a means to obtaining the satisfaction of a need. It then has meaning/purpose. Why should I carry out some particular activity? In order to achieve some desirable outcome. An outcome is desirable if it either provides need satisfaction or reduces the amount of need-dissatisfaction we are enduring. If our understanding of all the variables we are dealing with is such that we believe that a certain action option has a zero percent chance of succeeding in achieving the goal it is intended to achieve, our minds “punish us” with the pain that is associated with perceived futility. This is not a consequence that is optional for some people. When human beings perceive that an action option can only be futilely pursued, their minds will experience pain (and fear that the pain might continue). Period. Indeed, the only way it is possible to discuss the topic of Futility is if those who participate have experienced the same pain when beholding a futile proposition.

It is from this perspective that I have pointed out that when human beings ponder the implications of the proposition that Corporeal Death = Non-existence, they cannot help but perceive that their lives would be meaningless if the proposition were true. Notice that I’m not saying that our lives are meaningless. I’m simply saying that when a mind/brain/whatever perceives that an “action option” will not produce a desirable outcome, or that it will not produce an outcome that is any different from the one that would occur anyway if the option were not pursued, it is going to see that action option as futile and there will be pain and fear associated with that perception of futility. [I know, I know…some of you will insist that you are exceptional… (Smile)]

When one points to this logical conclusion of futility as I have, many of those who insist that corporeal death is final death shift their focus back to the meaning they see in their lives and then insist that it is preposterous to say that life is meaningless, that perceiving meaning in your life doesn’t depend on a belief that Life has ultimate meaning. My response: I don’t disagree that there is meaning in this life. I insist that such is the case. I am merely pointing out that [the brain’s] logic says that in spite of what we perceive in our lives, none of it can actually have any meaning if corporeal death = non-existence since none of it can logically have any ultimate meaning. My point is that there is a conflict in the brain’s/mind’s perceptions/conclusions. It perceives meaning when it thinks about certain variables but it perceives meaninglessness when it considers a few more. What are we to make of this?

Accordingly, I have this question to ask of those who have challenged my arguments: Are you saying that…

  1. Life does have meaning because you can see it, while also acknowledging at the same time that it is ultimately meaningless? or that…
  2. Life does have ultimate meaning, in spite of the fact that it doesn’t appear to serve any ultimate purpose?

If you believe the former, then you are embracing two logical conclusions that ultimately contradict each other. How can you accept that cognitive dissonance? If your position is the latter, then you are implicitly suggesting that the brain/mind is misperceiving the futility it sees. (How so?)

My position is that we can depend on our needs to lead us to an accurate understanding of what we are dealing with in this life. One of the guesses I embrace is my belief that the needs that have been externally imposed on us are ultimately satisfiable. For example, I would say that we have a need for logic because the world is logical. My assumption is that we have not been given a need for logic while also having been placed in a universe where some (many?) things are not logical. These are the kind of assumptions we need to embrace in order to proceed with any of our efforts to understand. (Some “compound” needs may be difficult to satisfy, but their satisfaction is ultimately possible, at least in an historical sense) A short list of some of the ultimate metaphysical needs that I believe are ultimately satisfiable would include:

–Our need to perceive that our lives matter, ultimately, that there is a Reason that is significant to us in the long run.
–A necessary condition of the above is that we continue to exist in some way, and that implies an Afterlife. If you ask me for specifics, I have few to offer. All I know is that we “somehow” continue to exist. I believe that to once exist as an entity that is “aware” of its existence is to always exist.
–We also have a need to believe that what we do in this life matters in the next, in other words, that there is continuity between this life and the next. The next life must somehow build upon the present one, or else this life would serve no Ultimate Purpose.
–I don’t know about heaven or hell, but there is definitely a need to believe that there is Ultimate Justice, that some people are not able to “get away” with evil behavior. This allows for some kind of punishment or at least undesirable consequences, but does not allow for any kind of never-ending torture chambers. There must be some sort of price that is ultimately paid when we behave badly. We need to believe that one is ultimately “better off” for being good, that it is worth the effort.

There is no need to embrace any specifics in making these guesses; that’s when thinkers get into trouble, when they try to get too specific in their speculations about what God, the Afterlife, etc., is like. It is enough simply that we embrace the generalities that satisfy our fundamental mental/emotional needs. In proposing these guesses, I am not insisting that anyone else embrace them. I am aware that there are many who revel in choosing other guesses simply because they can. I would only suggest that they ask themselves how their chosen guesses satisfy their needs? After all, what price do we pay for embracing guesses that “feel good?” There is no penalty. If you can show me how I am better off believing that my life is ultimately meaningless, then I will listen.

Gabriel
http://www.wearesaved.org