Origin Of Organized Authorities And Government.

Comments on above quote welcomed.

look at the ‘animal kingdom.’ there is organized athorities and ‘governement’ in ‘animal’ societites.
which leads me to believe ‘it’ was present in earliest homo
and before that as well

I think that guy is wrong.

Authority started when the first bully was big enough to intimidate his first victim.

Their organization is informal and of the physical based.

Our state governments are a result of religious idealization combined with the mythology that men must control dominion over the entire earth.

Reasons being?

You are talking about the informal physical based existence.

On those grounds I agree.

I am specifically talking about the ideological.

Informal?
‘animal’ societies are as formal or informal as ‘human’ societies

all authority is physical based.

fear is an emotion which one use’s to control one’s self

no one can control someone else by just using fear it just does not work

it is a motivator, and can cause stress but in the end fear itself can not control someone.

in the end it is the individual that makes the decision to do or not do something based on fear.

authority started before the three things listed.

do you think there was not an alpha male in hunter/gather groups
do you think there were not customs and rules that governed mating, first to eat the food, and such?

To winverawin

Animal hierarchies are purely physical centered around emotional instincts.

The hierarchy of men is entirely ideological.

What was the first organized ideology of men? :slight_smile:

( I’ll give you a hint. Many people were killed for a wide variety of elaborate taboos in this first organized form of ideology.)

I think authority started when one ape realized he was stronger than another and when social groups evolved to naturally form hiearchies in some species, which pre-dates priests and shamans, but they were a very early natural progression of an intelligent ape.

The ideology of authority as a structure began the when the bully figured out he could delegate his intimidation to others while still maintaining his intimidation of them.

I do not care about the “Origin Of Organized Authorities And Government.”

I prefer the End Of Organized Authorities And Government much more.

I want the end of them too.

However it helps if you know the origins of their existence though.

You keep forgetting that a superiorly strong creature doesn’t require justification.

It doesn’t need justification like that of the government to impose its will on another.

The need for justification is a religious construction.

Again.

Why does a superior organism or creature need to delegate anything?

Why would a superior organism need justification for anything in its daily existences?

No justice is just a concept that humans are want to envoke while dealing with certain concepts of ‘wrong’. The concept of justice exists outside religion.

Humans everywhere don’t like to be cheated, humans everywhere have tit for tat mechanisms to and cheater detection mechanisms to deal with cheaters, when cheaters are punished (just by human means outside of religion) the people call that type of emotional satisfaction at the end of a situation ‘justice’ or the concept of fairness being forcefully applied. ‘justice’.

Its just a concept/part of some kind of complex fairness striving social adaptation.

I think authority began with brute physical force, and only after they were outwitted did the shamans and priests rule. Priests are ‘smart’, by that I mean cunning. A cunning person will always beat and deceive those who are honest. The brutes ruled with force and they and their subordinates knew it. But the priest rules through treachery by creating morality; by claiming to be representing a ‘higher authority’, that of God.

that is suggesting that the priests/shamans actually knew better (and they probably didn’t) so, it could be said that human nature manipulates all envolved, even the priests/shamans.

o.k. if you want to talk about just ‘humans’ then o.k.

Some of the earliest documentation of human activity is that of hieroglyphics.

The ‘egyptions’ were organized and yes paracticed ‘religion’

However, what would lead you to believe that an organized ideological heirarchy did not ‘exist’ before ‘writing’ or ‘documentation?’

and more important there is no way of telling what form the ‘ideological heirarchy’ came in.