Pain and Philosophy

Does pain sow the seeds of philosophical thought?

It depends what kind of pain you are talking about, here.

Some forms of pain make a person especially aware of problems, as this pain is meant to direct and put to use one’s problem-solving skills. But, if the problems stack up, all un-solved, it becomes depression and such.

A question often exists due to the wonder of distrust, in the human mind.

If they do not trust eachother’s words, they may soon become the philosophers…?

Yes.
All necessity forces an overcoming.

The truly content have no reason to act.
The truly blissful have no reason to strive.
The truly pleased have no reason to think.

Activity exposes dissatisfaction.
Dissatisfaction exposes suffering.
Suffering exposes need.
Need exposes incompelteness.
Incompelteness exposes lack.

What about celebration, overflow, and giving?

Let’s please not deal with absolutes here.

If I’m relatively blissful, content and pleased, I can still be productive, but I no longer feel stress during my production.

I think that a strong man would be more likely to exercise his body then a weaker man who needs that exercise more.

In the same way, I think a complete and content man would be more likely to make his life complete and fulfill himself, as he is in a better condition in the first place, thus action is easier and softer, compared to the force of necessity and dispair.

Then should we dig deeper and welcome more pain or sit back and hope things get better?

Isn’t the acceptance of pain as having this ‘positive side’ ( ie evoking philosophical thought) just another manifestation of the ‘sour grapes theory’?

Aversion does not tell you how to change, or what to do, in just demands that you make a change, and stop exposure to that which yee hath aversion to.

Forms of suffering are often connected to problem-solving, but not always…

I think you should embrace and accept your pain, in the same way that your right hand should be willing to hold your left hand close. It’s all just a part of yourself, and has meaning/reason.

Dan~

What about them…?

Humeirah

“…hope things get better…”?
You mean…pray?

Here’s a metaphor:

You can either: sit there and hope, pray things “get better” when you are overweight or you can embrace the costs of creating and striving and overcoming by suffering starvation and exercise.

How so?

Look around you.
If you think those that have escaped suffering, to some degree in relation to you, are enviable then: yes it’s all sour grapes.

I guess a fat slob can say that you envy his pleasure in eating whatever he wants, as much as he wants and then sitting on his ass all day, when you tell him that to achieve a physical ideal you must suffer.
Or he might tell you that he doesn’t buy into your physical ideals but then….isn’t that also sour grapes?

ilovephilosophy.com/phpbb/vi … asceticism

So does it make it better to watch ‘joy dancing in the dusk’ and have it disappear right before your eyes, rather than having it always before you, forever promised to you?

No it is not “better”, but, alas, I am condemned to forever watch it dance away……

It makes its next reappearance all the more remarkable and awe inspiring.

why do you use negative words such as ‘condemned’? Aren’t you happier that this added pain is a better springboard for your ‘philosophical leap’?

I am condemned because I had no choice in the matter but only have choice after the fact.

Happier would be a contradiction…… #-o

Life is suffering.

I embrace it as the thing that makes me possible…that necessitated my existence.

I am truly grateful for my suffering (past, present and future), especially when I witness what the avoidance or shielding from it produces.

I am what I am today because of what I and my ancestors suffered and how I and they coped and dealt with it.
This is my pride.

What good is reading Nietzsche or commenting on him when you haven’t shared his pain?

Then that doesn’t make it legitimate for any of us to comment on each other’s thoughts because these are a direct product of our own individual experiences… Right?

We share to compare our experiences and find solace in the sharing.
We share to unburden ourselves from our solitary journey and to distract and comfort ourselves from the suffering.

Each of us can experience the same event in different ways or at different depths, determined by our awareness and interests.
Then we compare notes to see if we missed something.

Words are approximations of the indescribable.
We offer them in the hope that another will relate or approach our experience and absolve us from the burden of bearing it alone.

Do we? I thought you once said, a few months ago, that finding similitudes with others’ experiences was just a journey towards self-effacement?

(per Satyr)

Yes.
We escape self, life, the condition of being alive, by sharing.

We unburden ourselves from suffering (life).

Solace is the self being escaped or denied. I feel pleasure when I’m temporarily distracted from life (suffering) by an extreme moment of fulfillment which floods my brain with chemicals, emotions and/or sensations.

I feel comforted when I unburden myself and my responsibility upon the other or through the other, using words.
When the other “understands me” he claims to share in my burden.

So there is an equation for pain that can be logically deduced by analysing the works of others and finding any ‘missing links’? That would omit pain of its ‘illogical’ nature, wouldn’t it?

In that it is a shared experience.
Shared by a unity with common ancestry and biology – a species.

How is pain ‘illogical’?

The very fact that we still need to turn to others for ‘solace’ and are still trying to, according to some people, find missing links by comparing our experiences, shows we have not yet mastered and fully understood the variables in the equation that gives rise to pain- that’s why it’s ‘illogical’…

This “fact” only proves that we are weak and imperfect and incomplete.

What gives rise to pain is lack.
What all the variable of this lack are, is a secondary matter.

If I aim and shoot an arrow to a target what matters is if I hit or miss the target.
What variables went into my aim are not understood but only generally.

So doesn’t the archer on his next shot, master (or try to master) knowledge of those variables so as to aim perfectly?