Philosophy of Perception

I posted a thread like this a bit ago but it didn’t get the feedback I had hoped for. Because of this, I am going to summerize my previous post and bring up new concepts so that I may get the feedback.

Everything we apprehend in any way at all - whether it is a perception, a feeling, a memory, a thought, or whatever it may be - is apprehended by us through our bodily apparatus , namely our five senses, our brains, and our central nervous systems. Therefor anything that this apparatus can deal with is capable of being experience for us. But anything it cannot deal with can never be experience for us, for we have no way of apprehending it. A video camera cannot record the sound of a scene and a microphone cannot record the images of the scene.

Our eyes can do certain very important things, but not anything else. Ears can do quite other things, which eyes cannot do. Our taste buds can register things that neither eyes nor ears can detect. Our brains can do innumerable different sorts of things from any of these. When all our faculties have been enumerated the sum total of what they are able to deal with is the sum total of what we can apprehend. This is not to say that nothing else can exist. As far as our knowledge goes, anything else may exist. But if anything else exists, whatever it may be, we have no way of apprehending it.

The point here is how do we know that there isn’t more? Logically, beings would posses only the senses that they NEEDED in order to survive in a physical world like ours which would explain why we aren’t being killed off by some creature or force that we can’t apprehend.

I think you all can agree with me when I say that our perception is simply our bodily apparatus picking up some sort of energy or electrical signals through our 5 senses and then sending them to the brain where they are interpreted. This point alone makes me doubt my own perception. We apprehend something and we only pick up the forms of that object that we NEED to apprehend. Now I am not at all saying that perception is an illusion and should be taken for granted, on the contrary, perception keeps us alive. Perception, to me, is only part of the truth and as a man of truth I strive to get the whole truth.

I came across a thing called Tensegrity a couple years ago. I am not going to go into much detail because Tensegrity is a very controversial subject and I don’t have time to explain every little detail out to convince everyone and I have no need to. Eventhough, it does talk about people who have found a way through meditation and years of training to see everything without the human senses. They don’t actually see with their eyes. It is more like how you see in a very vivid dream. This other seeing allows them to apprehend energy directly instead of waiting for the body to translate the energy for thier body to understand.

I have no reason to prove this to you. I only mentioned Tensegrity as a theory on what we may be able to do when we realize that our human bodies are limited when it comes to perception. On the other hand, I am stating that there is more outside of our NEEDED perception. Everything outside of our needed perception I will call WANTED perception and when we sit on the edge of the abyss of what wanted perception may consist of, Tensegrity has been the only thing that I have found that can explain it with some sort of logic. I recommend sitting on the edge of that abyss if you want the whole truth. Find your own theories if you have to, I really don’t care as long as you get the whole truth because as long as we only use our limited senses to find the truth your truth will be limited and not whole.

We can’t experience anything beyond our bodies senses. Its an impossibility. Mind and body are a symbiotic relationship. Nuff said.

I believe you can experience it but in a different way. Experience without the human body. You just have to go “outside” of your body. You aren’t actually leaving your body, as some get confused, you more or less go deeper within and finding the source of all things. I will use a computer hooked to a database as an example. You have a personal computer which has all your files etc. on it. Then, you have the database in which your computer is hooked to which consists of many other computers. There is a way to metaphorically tap into the database and have all the files of every computer. I thought I made it clear that through meditation and years of training did they learn how to do this. Meditation does not apply what you are refering to at all. See that is the problem with this forum. I have realized that this forum is dominately western philosophy oppose to eastern philosophy. We cannot ignore the other side of the world! To achieve what I speak of you have to go beyond your human body because humans are frail, limited and very stupid.

Why meditate when you have drugs?

[size=75](For the record, I do not use drugs, nor do I have the desire to explore what is derived as an “out of body expirience.”)[/size]

Drugs are good for a little time but then they get boring and old. You already know the answer to this. Learn how to do all this without drugs, that is the hard part.

It should be said that we can aprehend things beyond our bodily senses like IR radiation, radio waves etc. But each of these phenomena are reinterpreted in terms of our senses. So in a way, we can extend our perception beyond the limits of our flesh.

I think it has something to do with broadening your conceptual schemes so that you have heightened perception. While your body’s various components allow you to perceive and experience different things around you, it needs a conceptual component to link up the separate experiences from each part to form a linking concept.

However, I think that while your body has perceptual components that experience things, your mind has conceptual components that expand with more knowledge and more concentration on exceeding its normal limitations (of just interpreting common perceptions). I think there are parts of your mind that have its own specialized sensory perceptors, except they experience things that are not necessarily externally perceived.

C’mon all you “philosophers”. There has to be some disagreement. I made it somewhat controversial for a reason.

In your example of the computer though, its still within its limits. Take for example a personal computer that is not hooked up to the databases, its beyond the first computers limits to tap into.

Go within?? It doesn’t sound like what your describing is percieving something outside of what your body/mind can percieve.

The philosophy I most agree with would be Krishnamurti’s, and he was not western whatsover. Heres what I think; you can’t go beyond your body, but you can achieve a state of awareness that is far beyond what we normally use, or the state that we westerners are normally in.

Heres what I am open to. That conciousness is not individual. That our organs, and our brain evolved so that this conciousness, could be percieved. From reading Rudy Ruckers infinity and the mind recently I’ve been calling it the mindscape. What I am open to, or rather I actually believe is that the mindscape encompasses all, and that we can percieve it.

Now I forget where I first read this, but there was a experiment carried out in England where a quiz was given to a large group of people. This quiz was then put out in a paper, and later the quiz was given to another group of people who didn’t have access to the paper. The second group did far better on the quiz then the first. This I believe is because the quiz was already in the collective “mindscape”.

I believe through awareness, a state that comes about through negating thought that we can experience the mindscape. So basically you can experience the mindscape through holism. Thought being finite cannot experience the infinite.

That being said, It is still the brain that percieves it. We could not percieve the mindscape if we do not have a brain. Its a symbotic relationship. If I stick a grenade in your mouth and pull the pin, then your experience is over my friend. Nothing can be experienced without the brain, and therofore any experience that is percieved is within the ability of the brain to perceive it.

The body is part of our experience, and I do believe we can seperate ourselves from our body’s to varying degrees, ei; live in illusion or fantasy, but I think that this state is a state of conflict, and is less aware, and less capable of experiencing the infinite. A holistic aproach is to experience, all including the body.

So in essance anything that is beyond the perception of body/mind cannot be percieved. Yet do believe that body/mind is capable of percieving a great deal.

Using the brain restricts you from getting to the mindscape. I believe you have no experience of what you may call the “mindscape”. You only read about it in a book. You have to seperate from your body completely, even your thoughts.

thats bull. Seperating your body from your mind is not what I would call an enlightened state. It is not of a state of awareness/intellegence, because you lack body awareness. Body and mind are part of a whole, theres no reason to seperate them, and to no end would that be benificial. There is not a state where being seperated from your body would be more benificial, in doing so you are in a conflicted state, you are not using the entire potential of body, and mind, but only a fraction of the intelligence/experience that is available to you. Its just silly, you may trick yourself, or convince yourself that you are having some religious experience, that you are transcending the body, ya might even give it a fancy name like “Tensegrity” :wink: and make your own little church, but in essence any seperation results in conflict, a fragmented state, which by no means would allow you to act to your full potential.

Do you have a reason why you say this? You have many concepts with nothing to back it up. It is very beneficial to seperate because our human bodies or brains cannot comprehend your mindscape. Humans are too stupid (you give us too much credit). Thus, you must go beyond your human body to obtain superhuman qualities that allow you to comprehend your mindscape. You are borrowing a higher intelligence or more like tapping into the combined intelligence of every-thing. Most western “philosophers” get to this point and take an Aristotle point of view by saying that there is no point in going beyond your human body because we should only concern ourselves with the things that we can comprehend like day-to-day life. Everything else, to them, is “pointless”. Life is pointless but we still live it. To strive to become famous is pointless but people still do it. You dont HAVE to give that extra effort, but when you do, you are rewarded.