Never mind all the wars that have been drummed up since the dawn of time. . . I’m talking about conflict on the most basic level.
If you look at this forum or other talk-sites for a variety of subjects: sports, politics, art, religon, why is it that many people feel they have nothing to contribute unless they are arguing and fighting for a different position. Some people thrive on being part of an opposition. Its like there is nothing they can offer unless the topic at hand illicits an emotionally disturbed response. Somehow these people only see the black and white, opposite nature of everything.
If they are not against something, or they cannot react in an antagonistic way, then for some reason they divert their attention away from the peacfeul and the civil, and search out the more hostile subjects. More importantly they avoid any type of creative imput that would add and build on discourse, no, its much easier to pick apart and destroy and be critical. Maybe even more ENJOYABLE.
People are drawn to conflict, like flies on a dead carcass. If a patient goes to a therapist to talk of problems, once those problems have been exhausted at length, the patient invents problems to keep his visits on track and full of purpose.
Why is this? My theory is that conflict and suffering is a measuring stick for feeling alive and affected. Its no wonder why people cling to their tv sets when the weatherman shows a storm coming, and then we go out and talk to our neighbors about what we heard from the weatheman, because we all want to agree on the level to which we are affected. We all want to share in the experience, however negative
Winning a conflict or argument is alpha male behavior? Feeling like one has the power and is righteous? Being the judge of truth?
People that look for conflict on this site should try ilovealwaysbeingright.com instead.
I’ve never been one of those peeps who feels superior in gainng the edge in an arguement, because I’ve witnessed the resentment it causes in the defeated.
We should probably ask oursevlves what are we really winning and what is the sacrifice of being right.
For some reason I like to agree with people and be fair with them, so that something positive might result. Most people see this as a weakness and sieze upon it. I feel superior to them in that regard. I reverse it on them, but they dont recognize my efforts to mee them halfway.
there many calibers of philosophers. some indeed are like a fly in pursuit of the elusive shit but that does not do well in describing myself and many others.
it may be said we strive for gratification from others or that we are like a mob mentality which simply reassures itself.
but on the individual level we are more than that. personally i have striven not to gratify my current knowledge but to simply gain more.
logic seems to be absolute, philosophy is like each persons subjective take on logic. the collision of our subjective opinions may be as fruitless as flies on shit, but how can you ask a fly to do anything else?
I don’t mind a conflict, however I do think alot of people go into arguments ready to persuade the other person of their righteousness, but unaware of the fact that this attitude leads to denial of errors in their argument. If either party is unwilling to admit his/her faults, we end up with name calling and nevernding arguments, as opposed to useful discussions. I hold the belief that one cannot really believe in something until he/she understands the counterargument.
That was my take on philosophy: objective, logical and emotionless arguments, not an endurance test. Most people seem to disagree.
i agree. without even humoring the counter-argument many people recede into spiked shells of denial where they make a thread drag on in circles with no end in sight.
sometimes it is their own callousness which led them to their shell, sometimes they simply are not mentally equipped to understand the counter-argument. but the collision is inevitable
Nano-bug we live in a world of perpetual repression and with the internet being one of the last places to express anything freely people vent their inner conflict all over the place considering that they are dis-allowed to do so apart from the computer.
The modern age of absolutism, repression, propaganda, fictional moralities and institutional control has made tormented souls out of millions.
So take it out on everbody. People get treated badly at work so the enter the work place of another and act rudely. I worked in a convient store, I saw this all the time. People ready to unleash their nastiness
The nature of philosophy is to disagree! We believe things strongly and we fight for what we believe in. Ideas are a battle.
Why not accept this? There is life in it. There is something beautiful about it. At least people in the world still care to argue about things that matter.
Ad Hominem attacks - why not? If the individual cannot live the righteous or non-righteous lives they encourage, why not attack them?
Philosophy should attack things. It shouldn’t be polite. Otherwise it becomes pathetic, like a bunch of intellectuals sitting around kissing ass at a tea party. At least let us battle with words.
A great book I read recently was Wittgenstein’s Poker. It was about how Ludwig Wittgenstein had a 20-minute argument with Karl Popper about whether there are “real philosophical problems” at a colloquium at Cambridge University. The argument ended with Wittgenstein holding a fiery fireplace poker in Poppers face! I chuckle.
I wasn’t talking about philosophical debates where it is understood that people takes sides while trying to achieve the noble goal of truth. I’m talking about everyday conflict that people flock to for no other reason but to feel hostile, the way T-personality people jump out of airplanes and become cops because the thrill and adrenaline makes them feel more alive
Either you are mature enough to handle the destructive emotion of anger, or you’re just not a sensitve person.
I happen to like sensitive people since they contribute more to the world artisically. I enjoy art more then war.
Good thread nano-bug. I think there is such a strong sense of a lack of reality on the internet that arguments are grounding. We feel like we must be talking to someone real, and therefore we feel more real ourselves. Just a quick pet theory though - not sure if that sounds right to anyone else or not. I talk to the wind…
Haha, yeah, not only do people feel more alive when they are arguing, the also get the sense that someone is getting riled up on the other end. There is that strange abusive connection, like wow i got through to someone, I affected someone through this machine.
I have seen videos of japanese business men renting out classy furnished hotels and being able to trash them. They pay for it and it releases their pent up energy and stress. You get to do things like throw a bowling ball through a tv set screen.
Joker, how do you feel the various institutions repress emotion? When did this repression begin? Is it the kind of thing that causes kids to shoot up their school?
I have fun when conflicting about certain things and at others I try to avoid conflict. It just depends upon what the situation or subject is and who it is that I would be going against.
Not all people are drawn to conflict some will avoid it like the plague. This is a bad thing just as bad as trying to dominate.
sometimes we need to face a conflict. Not doing so could/can/ will harm others.
It began with morality, institutionalism, transhumanism, mass government and also when man gave absurd aims to his own existence where in actuality there only exists aimless relativity.
It began with the restraint of instinct where men turned many forms of natural impulses into vices and conceived sins.
When men created a idealized concept of one single true “reality” where existence became sinful and where instinct was turned into vice that is when all this repressed emotion started showing itself.
It’s not just conflict it is any kind of struggle. People enjoy struggle and succeeding in struggle, it’s part of our makeup. It’s also why we are sitting here discussing things on a computer instead of hooting at each other from tree to tree. Human kind seems to have an inherent need to find something and change it, preserve it, break it or fix it.
Still our means and methods of suppressing inappropriate conflict is a good thing. Those Japanese businessmen who pay to trash hotel rooms are saving people alot of trouble by finding a venue where destruction is acceptable and measures have been taken to contain it rather then just waiting to trash some guy in a crowded subway.
I personally enjoy conflict, so I work as a bouncer. Some people really really like arguing, we call them lawyers. Do you like stealing? Because they pay people to reposess cars, and you won’t even go to jail for it. I don’t know if surgeons necessarily like blood and what not, but it wouldn’t surprise me to find some that do. There are productive avenues in which to channel most human urges, even the ugly ones.
Before someone jumps in and says it, I’ll head it off, No I don’t think there are productive uses for drives like Pedophillia, drug addiction, and sincerely enjoying reality TV.