I’m not entirely sure that the actual attendance percentage-wise is greater in America than Europe, but to be honest, I have no idea. You’re probably right about not just Philosophers, but many other political activists in the 19th and 20th centuries speaking out against Religion having some influence. Russia/U.S.S.R. is also another good example of religious freedoms being taken away, so what you end up with is a couple of generations of people there that would have otherwise been brought up in a certain religion that were not.
I’m not sure to what extent WWII comes into play regarding the feelings of Europe towards Religion as I am American, but over here I don’t think we read a whole lot of Religious connotation into it.
I think that there may have been a more abrupt exodus from religion in the case of Europe for the reasons that you mentioned, while in America I think it may not have been quite as pronounced as it was largely social evolution. I think that social evolution also comes into play in Europe as well.
As far as America having a wider range of choice when it comes to religion and therefore filling pews, I’m kind of on the fence about that. When it comes to filling pews, I tend to look at religion as more of a business where the religion (and hierarchy thereof, particularly with the Catholic Church) is the franchisor and the individual churches are franchisees. The most important thing to do is to put your church where you know you have a market and not too much competition from comparable churches or maybe even churches of the same denomination. You have to have a good pastor/reverend/father or whatever who is able to be charismatic, informative and also manage his time to make sure he has time for people that need answers from him. The most difficult challenges these people face is trying to convert someone into becoming a member when they first come into the church and also handling members that are starting to question their faith.
I understand to some people this could be an unwanted display. There are many different approaches of people who do this. Some being viewed intolerable to being less so. In any case those that take that admonishment seriously can do nothing else.
My wife and I haven’t related our our sadness verbally or in action. She being a sensitve person I’m sure senses it. Parents usually have deep vested interest in their children and worry about them to our grave. If her comfort zone or coping mechanism lies in that direction, it will be her decision to make.
There again we must try as Christians to tell of God. Once this is accomplished, the decsion will theirs to pursue God or not.
I can understand people’s concerns about God’s Message being delineated over time. Is it possible the Bible could ward off the diluting effect of the message to some degree? Is the message as important as the spiritual connection we can have with God? It’s what we take with us from our teachings of God and nurture it that seems to be the important thing. As we grow spiritually and interact with others through our lives is where our ‘works’ will show fruit for those to build on. Maybe this is god wants?
I was talking about the self-reinforcing aspect of the religion: requiring the believers to spread the word and promising harsh punishment for leaving it.
What would you tell someone? Let’s say I’m just some average Joe and I see a jesus fish on the back of your car. I say to you, “So, what the hell is this christianity thing about?” What would you tell me? I can guess…
That aspect of Chrisitianity does occur in one religion I know of. But it involves losing status in that particular church. I know of what you are referencing though, the possibility of eternal damnation by turning away from God. I’ve heard of that in happening in some churchs. I view those as inflicting fear based doctrine which Jesus (to the best of my knowledge) never alluded to. The Bible does speak of the consequences of sin which due to God’s discretion will judge people’s actions. What happens after that, God only knows. I prefer to focus on the positive aspects of my Christian belief.
If someone approached and somehow recognized me as a Christian then asked me about Christianity or Jesus, I would be happy to talk to them. I would ask them if they had ever considered looking to Christ to learn about God. If they answered to the affirmative, I would speak about the blessings of becoming a Christian. Then if they asked salvation at that moment, I would help pray with them to ask Jesus to accept them and forgive them of past sins. If the conversation didn’t progress to that point, I would bid them goodbye and try to keep God in their minds and heart. Different people though would inspire different scenarios on how such instances would be approached.
C’mon Litenin’, surely there are better ways to strengthen your faith than that?! There are communists out there still who place their faith in Das Kapital, preferring the rosy vision. What’s the critical difference?
For instance, is it a sin not to believe in God/Jesus/Bible, as it is amongst orthodox marxists not to believe in Karl?
OK, that’s fair, but dropping the other shoe, wisdom is the antithesis of mysticism. Wisdom is the recognition of Truth, and that wisdom is employed by finding the balance between reason and passion (Jefferson’s head and heart) each in their domain.
And agnosticism only means being lost if one is an agnostic only.
What do you think the effect would be if you told them:
Do you think they would be as receptive? Of course you’re selling your religion, of course it’s recruitment. You tell them of the ‘blessings’, you don’t tell them of the weird shit they have to buy into.
I think you gotta be more careful there, Stumps: I know lots of Christians who don’t know what Christianity is, …depending, of course, on what is meant by “knowing” (…and even then, in pretty weak senses of the term, it’s amazing how clueless people can be about their own club memberships).
I’m not referring to any view a serious theologian holds as the authentic variation of Christianity; I’m meaning that they don’t know who Jesus is as an icon, or what Jesus stands for as an icon.
Hey, you’re preaching to the choir on misinterpretation.
I don’t even hold Jesus as divine.
The divine Jesus is like the difference between Babe Ruth the icon and Babe Ruth.
But I said the above considering that the dominant population of Christianity is based on “Babe Ruth the icon” and not “Babe Ruth”.
Because I don’t feel it necessary to dwell on things like going to hell or the bleak prophecies stated in the Book Of Revelations. Those take the back burner where God is concerned for me. The one deals with a possible result due to sin and the other mainly visions to look for signs of the end times. Unless I get a desire to get a degree in theology in the Bible, then I might focus on it.
Apparently our perceptions on Christianity are polar. I don’t gain anything sharing what knowledge of God I posess…at least nothing of any worldy value, which I wouldn’t accept anyway. I knew before hand I might be ridiculed for expressing my beliefs and accept that possibility. Nonethess, it will not stop me telling of God if people wish hear.
I can appreciate what you are saying, though I wasn’t meaning to imply simply “dwelling on the unpleasantries”. Rather, of having a critical perspective in general.
For instance, as a matter of maturity of faith as a “quest” (or is it a static arrival?), is there not at least some necessity for placing the parameters of Belief into radical question, albeit “in the name of God”, if you would. If so, then acknowledging that at least some inanities in the Bible are indeed inane and not worthy of Belief wouldn’t seem to be unreasonable, would it?
I’m just asking for an inch, Litenin’, just give me an eensy weensy inch…
Nothing inane in the scriptures comes to mind. If you are speaking of what people do through their interpretive reactions from their understanding of the Scriptures such killing an abortionist, then yes, I consider that an inane response. There are people who do heinous things on both sides of the tracks due to their skewed justifications. A few religious people are responsible for misguided actions. Sadly, some of those dupe gullible people to follow their fallacious agendas. But it isn’t relegated to just religious people; folks from all walks of life perpetrate criminal acts on others. It’s the religious the light gets shown on with passion. Because they are supposed to held to such high standards. What is forgotten it appears the brush for them paints a wider stroke than the non-religious.
I do, he was a good pitcher but grossly overrated as a hitter because he could hit home runs. Did you know that Ty Cobb hit five home runs in two games just to prove a point?
