self fulfilling prophecy

Philosophy Forums Philosophy
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I wasn’t sure whether i should post this here or in psychology or who knows where, but here goes

There’s no proof in this post, so if you need that you can stop reading now

There’s probably like 10 million other posts like this on ilp, i’m too lazy to search

So i’ve been pondering for a bit recently about the self fulfilling prophecy… or perhaps a narrow interpretation of it

if one believes something positive about oneself, the belief becomes a reality … or the same with a negative idea… positive/negative ‘self’ feedback

Assuming the self fulfilling prophecy is true… can this methodology be imposed upon another person, and should it?

Let me give a specific use case where i’d like to try it:

My younger brother is bad with money. He makes insanely good money for a 19 year old in my opinion (roughly $25/hr usd), but he throws it all away on stuff he doesn’t need (again in my opinion), such as fast food, weed, and 17%-interest-on-a-car payment. In fact, he often asks our parents for money, and they usually oblige after a fight.

So since he began to make poor decisions (lets say 4 years ago), my parents, myself, my other brother, my cousin, have told him how is decisions with money are not very good.

Would it be a good idea to suggest to my brother that he makes responsible financial decisions, to hopefully encourage responsible financial decisions? Or would it be a bad idea because its based on a false premise (a lie)? Neither? Both? Another option? Impossible?

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I don’t see how this relates to self-fulfilling prophecies tbh.

Either way, what is the false premise? It is obvious he makes poor financial decisions because he has to go to your parents. Tell them to stop giving him money. End of.

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sorry i was overloading the word self… self is being used to reference the idea itself and the individual who perceives the idea, hopefully i am not confusing the two too much

and perhaps i should have gone into depth about my line of thinking

I’m not convinced the majority of ideas are formulated independently of influence of others

I believe I’m an intelligent person, but perhaps that’s because my parents told me I was smart when I was 3, and I’ve clung to the idea for a couple of decades. Regardless, if the self fulfilling prophecy is to be believed, my current belief that I’m intelligent is only strengthening the idea that I’m intelligent.

My friend Steve is good at the drums. He won his high school battle of the bands, and now his band is playing several good gigs in D.C. and Baltimore. He knows he’s good at the drums, but perhaps his belief in his skill can be attributed to his parents saying that his garage band garbage sounded “good”.

What I’m getting at is - a self fulfilling prophecy - insofar as that its a belief that appears to cause itself to come true (‘i am good at the drums’, ‘i am smart’, ‘i am bad/good with money’), … (they coincidentally are views held by one’s ‘self’, perhaps this could be extended to others), is perhaps set into motion by some imperceptible external influence (argument).

If this is the case

Should knowledge of this be practiced when dealing with others, in effort to change another individual? For the better? As perceived by the holder of said knowledge?

If Steve’s parents told him the truth - that his drumming was horrible and annoying (back when it was), perhaps he would not be the good drummer he is today.

Should I “encourage” a premise which I believe to be false (lie), such that the self-fulfilling prophecy will have a more profound impact towards (my) desired result?

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Your friend isn’t good at drums because he believes he is good at drums, he is good at drums because he has been playing for x amount of time and invests his time and energy into the playing of them. Maybe the early belief helped him to continue playing…but it was the playing itself that has shaped his current ability. Results speak for themselves, your brother needs to borrow from your parents, he doesn’t need to believe he is bad with his money, he obviously is, he’s just ignorant of it. I tend to think of self-fulfilling prophecies as relating more to the perception of things rather than the fact of things i.e. I believe today will be a very bad day, this belief shapes my attitude and perception for the day, and lo and behold, the day is a bad day. But it’s not an actual bad day of course…