Great idea. Apart from completely ruining the English language, which you’ve already made a good start on with the crap tv you send over here, you could also bring your guns with you so we can all shoot at each other.
ROTFLMAO Can I be the one to tell this person about Zinnat??? Puleeeeaase!!!
If you do, will you do it in proper English, please?
Oh hell no
Due to the cultural gap of Zinny trying in a unknownst to him most humorous manner to counter a satire, quote by quote, I’ve decided to skip the homoerotic buttjokes made possible by the above counter by Zinnati. Just know, it would of been a really great joke.
There obviously was logic in my statement Zinnati, just reflection and catharsis is required to set in once you begin the process of “getting it”. You’ll find it’s very common in philosophical systems around the world, particularly heavy use in fact from India.
I got a copy of S.S. Suryanarayana Sastri’s translation of the Samkhyakarika of Isvarakrsna next to me, I know Indian logic accepts inference, and has well prior to both Vedanta and Buddhism. You can’t blame a cultural gap for not knowing humor has always been a favored tool of the logician.
You would have to lay to waste half of philosophy, including some great names, before we could land in a position of logic of your meager acceptance.
The ability of someone to make a funny statement, and achieve a laugh consistently, is proof of logic. There is no other way around this.
I don’t mock you statements anymore than I self depricate myself, or others. I know foreign"ness" keeps some deductions from linking up quickly, so I have gone rather easy on you, compared to others. But when you start making stock, worn out statements like you did, it’s my responsibility to mix stuff up and turn your expectations of political insight on “correctness” upside down. Obviously, I was never planning on moving in with you. I merely implied the discomfort on furthering arguments based on race and identity, and took it out of your safe zone, made you a part of it under contemporary rhetoric in your own homeland, seeing where the repercussions occurred if your point was taken to it’s logical extremes. Many on this forum can’t tell the difference between race and language. Its been a problem since 1808.
And I can’t stand ghee’s look. The Indian community in the area makes it, bottles it, I don’t think I could eat it. I’m extremely picky, have passed up food when starving and losing weight… my inability to overcome food avoidance upon seeing it on sight is too strong. Many people can logically reason cultural openness to food, I have no cognitive control, sight sees, accepts or rejects. This aspect of my mind is unfortunately primitive, for I would like nothing better than to eat oysters and sushi, but the idea of doing so, and sitting and doing do is very different, and I turn pale white and start sweating like crazy, looking like I’m about to die before it even gets to my lips. This being said, it happens with even very American foods (beans I cant eat, can’t eat meatloaf), but meat loaf I can eat many foreign foods, and like Indian Restaurants. Just can’t eat the jello looking South Indian crap passed off as food. It is neither plant nor animal as far as I can see, just some sea jelly from the deep slapped on a plate. Many in San Francisco eat it, offered it to me, I nearly vomited. My vomit has more texture and consistency than it.
You needed to know that as much as I needed to know your milkman delivery service, or boiled milk. It all interrelates in the end… or not. Just assume it does.
(P.S. Zinnati is a Gun Rotting white lumberjack from Montana with a large semi-automatic gun collection, and feels the need to move to Europe with it, and spit chewbacco on your artwork in your museums, saying “Owhhh shit, just another fat chubby chick in a garden in that paintin’. We got hoes just like her back home. Reminds me, jus’ like my ol’ Samantha, before she left me for that other fellore.”
You so showed up on this site and just fucking nailed shit Harbal.
Sorry Turd,
There is not even a single sentence worth replying in the whole of your post.
By the way, I am well aware that you cannot even think in the dreams about moving here.
With love,
Sanjay
So your saying I wouldn’t ever consider moving to a hill station out in Darjeeling with fresh access to fresh tea, cool winds, and food that looks like food, staying in a winter cabin, going on excursions across India, Sri Lanka, Mynmar, Nepal, and Pakistan, to collect and read local philosophies and history, all because your xenophobic and respond to every post about any philosopher from India, any criticism, from a position of predictable, ill formed nationalist rants?
Of course I hate India, Its why Ive read half of Gandhi’s collected works, read translated historical works of it’s history, and know the works and concepts of a great many philosophers across it’s history, and follow it’s news, investigate its constitutional issues.
The vast majority of philosophers in my nation struggle even with Shankara, thinking themselves intellectuals for this, or culturally enriched for being abke to describe what bhakti is. That is about the extent.
I don’t go walking into Indian Temples and Cultural Centers kicking over shit, etc. I treat India and Indian Philosophy as real and worthy or considerarion… but this also means criticism and a willingness to call bullshit on it when its found inapplicable to current affairs.
There isnt much reason to talk about Indian philosophy on this forum, because no one, especially you, ever bring it up. But it is NOT a sacrosant area if the world of the backwards and the weak, and not every thinker has to play along with the storyline emphasis of the majority.
Let India be a real place. Dont stereotype it, or knee jerk move into protectionalist stances to defend it purely from nationalist motives.
And if you ever throw that overused, bad oneliner at me again that India can absorb any invading culture or entity, I’m going to snap and start listing all the countries India once controlled that clearly reject India’s authority now. Nationalist propaganda needs occasionally updated to remain responsive.
Its not guys like me who hate Undia, I clearly have a love and respect for it, wouldn’t bother to read up on it otherwise, its people like you who hate India, because all you want to do is isolate it, keep its ideas inert, dead, unassailable, unresponsive.
Your view of India is like dead wood floating in the sea… you won’t let it live, but want it to remain bouyant, floating in a sea of ideas forever exactly as it is. It doesn’t occur to you day by day it becomes saturated by water and decays, sinking more and more.
Water… Ideas, is only harmful to dead matter, not vibrant living matter. You exemplify in your behavior here on this forum decaying, saturated wood. Where have you shown evidence of vibrancy, a capacity still lingering to shoot off green leaves? Is all dead inside you? Do you hold all ideas in India in utter contempt by denying them their idea, their furtherance, in comoetitive dialectic? Is there not one philosopher in your whole federation contemporary, your whole history not worth talking about Zinny? If you were to speak of them, would it be right or wrong for us to speak of their ideas critically?
If you dont challenge ideas, you desresoect them, you kill them, they become dead forces. Should India remain intolerant and isolated against the currents of the world, decaying and disrespecting itself, or shoukd it have faith in itself and uts in its own worth, see value in the potential strength of others, and boldly engadge?
In a Cosmopolitan world, where the centuries will hence forth creep by, borders and language will no longer be enough to stop the silent creep of universal homogenity. Foreigners will increasingly look native, and what is native is foreign. Land becomes land, wherever, seen commonly as similar, not exotic, the same under tbe flowing movements of the sun and the moon. In one thousand years, do you expect a house in India to look or be differently equipped than one in Africa or North America, beyond climatic necessities? Do you think tbe furniture will much differ? Do you think the knowledge base of philosophers will remain alienated, or will it be very similar?
Fast foreward 10,000 years. Will it occur to someone that a white person unable to eat Ghee doesnt belong in India? Will race even be that apparent in that era as it is now? Will someone visiting india from another continent be any different from someone within India visiting from one state to the next? Will they be allowed food preferences in 10,000 years without being met with intolerance, and Paleo-Nationalist Rants?
At some point, the ball has to get rolling in each of us. India is as worthy as any other nation, and from now on, I will exhibit this truth by acknowleding you as a nationalist who is full of shit, unable to adapt to the freeflow of Ideas, and I will defend the right of indian ideas to be discussed freely on this forum, and in the world in general, without men like you moving in, hate mongering, trying to destroy India’s vitality and ability to continually strive. India isn’t a museum, it is a people, one of many.
For the larger context of the thread, it applies to the racism inherent to. It doesnt matter where you send other races in the short term, its allready too late. WW2 was lost, the races are already combining, so are cultures, alliances are extrending, trade carried farther each day. There is no stopping it, every action to stall it is futile. We are slowly becomming one.
I may very well move in with Zinnati now to make him mire tolerant. We can reinact the TV show “The Odd Couple”, till I break him of his intolerance.
So tired of hearing about America being native land… They immigrated here just like the rest of us. Most likely from brazil or southern America, mayan/aztec culture.
On top of that, they couldn’t defend their land, they had no structure set in place for a society to flourish. So of course they lost their land… A pack of fuckin wolves could of drove them away just as europe did, because they had no structure, no defense. So that’s their fault, not Europes.
Rofl that would technically still make them Native Americans. The Aztec, Mayan ancestors immigrated from Asia on the now submerged land bridge between Asia and North America. Descendants can be natives not immigrants.
Actually, the linguistic evidence points to the Indians in North America actually come from South America, as the oldest dialects are found in the southern hemisphere. It was believed for a long time because the Indians, when they first moved in from Asia, hugged the west coast, and went all the way south, then expanded in the Southern Hemisphere first, while sticking mostly to Alaska, despite obvious openings in the glaciers, never bothering to move into the main portion of North America for the longest time.
The theory always stuck me as rather odd and backwards, what kept them from colonizing North America for so long?
One theory is that a people who looked like Polynesians occupied North America, and some stray Europeans made it over from Europe by hunting along the Arctic ice cap which covered central Europe to North America unbroken.
However, most specimens don’t exhibit European traits, save a few red heads mummified corpses, but that could of came via Siberia, and is hardly suggestant of a large population. Likewise, we have better evidence of these ‘polynesians’ but again, not much evidence they had a particularly large population. Furthermore, they definitely were not Polynesians, as advertised… they originated in Taiwan 10,000 years ago. I honestly have no clue where this older aboriginal strain came from, have yet to see DNA evidence, etc. Just makes more sense to point to them to explain why the current north American Indians took so long to move into larger north America than the southern hemisphere, and why the evidence points at a southern to northern migration linguistically.
Id prefer to dump the Polynesian evidence all together, but evidence is evidence, and it’s the only thing I can point at to fill the obvious awkward void. Its only at very rare locations in North America, like where I live (Meadowcroft Village) within walking distance from me, that we have early evidence of north American habitation. It wasn’t from a lack of food or shelter, I can point to five similar locations in my town that fits meadowcroft’s description, only two show evidence of habitation from long term fire use in the rock face. Rest, empty.
Just… seemed rather empty and low populated. Midden Shell heaps are rare, both on and above the Ohio River… a lot of people point to Columbus bringing disease wiping out the Indian population, but from the actual known sites, they always had a very low population density, well below what food sources allowed for. Whites in this area adopted somewhat different farming practices initially but could sustain a much higher population density that the natives could from day one, despite both populations dependent on a mixtures of rural agriculture and hunting with similar weapons. Blights hitting crops were common, so might explain a natural check as to why the natives couldnt maintain a large population… scurvy hit the whites hard despite meat being regularly available during the winter and spring.
Im kinda lucky… the only frontier philosopher we produced during this era lived here, so I know his writings, he talked about these things, nobody else noticed.
Scurvy is lack of citrus
No, Vitamin C to be exact (can be gotten from more than just fruits), but also other kinds of Vitamin Deficiencies can cause scury like conditions if you lack them long enough, such as Beriberi (a few philosophers in Africa got this during the colonial era) and rickets.
It was common prior to the American Revolution to hear of reports of troops in ad hoc, colonial mitias dying from starvation on marches as few as twenty miles.
I take it they mean electrolyte imbalances, but can hardly rule out actual starvation given the state some families lived in. If your eating just bread, jerkey, and water, it’s quite possible to die if you suddenly find yourself trying to keep up at military March. You might be a supurb hunter and backwoodsman at your own speed, but really suck at other peoples. They did die that easily back then, cause of death given Starvation. What to make of it?
Likewise, the over consumption of meat made some frontiersmen incredibly fat, one of the Dutch colonist here got over 300 pounds. Plenty of meat, not so many vegetables. I feel sorry for his horse.
So ownership is only valid if it is permanent. A house in the family for 100 years is the same as a place you started subletting last month. And Americans when reacting to intrusion from those they consider outsiders, do not assume in their reactions ownership not simply based on power but on having been there for a couple of centuries. This latter is justified, but thousands of years means nothing.
They were physically healthier than Europeans, had time and the insight to treat children not as miniature adults and flourished in their way. What was seen after contact was what remained of cultures after disease ravaged them. This does not mean they could have defended against Europeans had they not been so vulnerable to European diseases but in fact their cultures were flourishing more than has been realized. But then primarily in other ways than European. Two cultures meet, one decides it is simply better and decides to learn practically nothing from the other while taking the lands of the other. This is a self-abusive approach, forgetting what it does to the other culture(s). Of course some people did learn from them, often without attribution - in fact parts of democracy and individualism came out of European exposure to native temperment and Eastern tribal politics. But, in general, an idiotic heuristic the Europeans, used before by empires that then later fell.
I can only hope that when you are fucked by some entity, later in your life, you will remember that any hard feelings on your part are mere reluctance to forgive the inevitablity of the person fucking yous fucking you. YOu seem to feel victimized by people framing this issue in a way you disagree with. Why that’s just a nothing problem compared to what life will hand you from behind and already you are crying victim.
No not victimized, just annoyed. A lot of people say it.
I’m not going to get fucked, guy.
with love,
sanjay
with love,
sanjay
While agree with the sentiment, if you want to keep your land, you need to defend it, I really do think the North American Indian population had a significant uphill battle as far as reforming and adopting new ideas, some overwhelmingly radical and not obvious in importance at first blush.
They did have a comprehension of territory and warfare, and trade. They did instantly grasp the usefulness of our weapons… and that’s about it.
They would agree to treatises, but never had a concept of eternal land ownership… how long would selling land actually last, a generation or two? No concept of plantations, docks, villages and cities would pop up. No clue how many white people were potentially able to come.
They figured this shit out about time the whites were approaching the Appalachian Mountains, and started building up alliances and massing troops from all over (seriously, from Mississippi to Canada, would come up the river valleys and join together for attacks)… but the need to build a solid base on sedentary populations in a ordered, protected rear… completely oblivious to them. Likewise the White Settlers approach to fortifying literally everything… houses we’re fortified, sometimes which mechanisms on the doors… they had nearby forts, first could call for help from other forts… a endless stream of unrelated whitefolk, people who usually could care less about one another, come rushing down using tactics and even weapons they never seen, like cannon and river ships, and Calvary.
It was while the whites we’re at the Pennsylvania, Ohio and West Virginia border that the Indians started to realize the fortifications and lay of the ordered villages were useful, and traders as well as Quakers showed them the basics… but it didn’t work out too well.
For starters, they quickly grasped log cabin construction, but didn’t get the orderly layout of the rows and streets… some insisted on building the cabins in the roads, cause that’s how they always did it with long houses, just walk around. Schools outside of church were a joke, they built walls and guard towers, but didn’t take it seriously… they still fought with regular Indian bravado… they got mangled once the started a failed offensive into white territory, whites rushed in… just pushed them back for a while.
After the Revolutionary War, the Canadians we’re exiled, but some went to Ohio and kidnapped the tribes there. A few years later, some were allowed to return, many stayed. By then, the White population was pushing well past those points.
In other words, they never quite solidified their concepts, and once they did show evidence of starting a sedentary lifestyle, both the British and Americans (earlier the French) made efforts to nab them and get them to join their perspective sides.
Wasn’t till halfway into Illinois when this effort started up again, that the plain Indians arriving in the woodland Indian camps for trade, saw what the deal was. They used teepees, already had adopted Calvary tactics and understood fighting from horseback. They lasted longer, but had less to fight for (honestly, treeless plains).
I would of expected say, had a civilization like the Aztecs existed in Wyoming or Nebraska… once they started getting arms, and a century or two preparation, it would of ended differently. Not saying they would not still of been conquered, but it would of been a hell of a lot harder, with more concessions. They would have a much stronger identity than say, the Iriqois “Nations”. It be like a Midwestern Quebec or Barcelona.
But they never got to that point, so all we have are these near misses, and how we treated the Mormons, Hawaiians, Alaskans, Puerto Ricans, and Filipinos we conquered/bought the territory of who did have at least rudimentary command over these things, to varying degrees. In many cases, we barely interfered, and stuck to garrision after occupation, with very quick sufferage given to the population so they could vote, hold property, run in elections. The current constitution of Hawaii was written by the last king of Hawaii, and in Alaska… we never had any kind of oppressive squabbles, the tribes opted out of The Department of Indian Affairs and designed a corporation system, works very well for them, and they coincidentally have very similar hobbies to most military personal, and so join the military willingly in large numbers.
It was those early Indians who got fucked hard. I don’t see how they could of realistically of built a military, civil and industrial order of repelling us in the beginning.
Aztecs could of, but pissed off literally every tribe around them, so the region was already on the breaking point of all out war… imagine a Alien ship landing in Europe in 1939… they could carry the war whichever side they pick.
In Peru, the cities were centralized under a emperor, and the road system they used was heavily stocked with provisions. The Spanish landed at just the right time, took it at it’s weakest point, the state crumbled on the very strengths it built itself up on. Had they been a messy, less centralized state, or several opposing states, Spanish would of had a difficult time. Still would of been conquered, just taken longer.
Its states like the Mughuls or China I get pissed off with. They knew damn well the developments of what was occurring. Japanese knew what was going on (they got newspapers from the rare Dutch trader), but snapped out of it once the first US battleship showed up, and went full motion in reforming their culture for catching up. If Japan grasped this, rest of Asia should of. Many parts of Africa had sedentary, city based civilization too, but they dragged as.
I don’t defend economic and military ideologies like Fascism and Imperialism, but I gotta say, societies really need to make an effort to develop themselves like the Japanese did, if they have a basic civilized capacity, village, cities, and states humming… to make certain they don’t get conquered. They have no one to blame but themselves if they do.
And yes Zinny, Sankara and Bhakti isn’t hard, we had comporable systems in the west, and our systems aren’t descended from Vedic roots (though some from Iranian stock admittedly). Its only amazing if you put it on a pedastool.
We do have a lot if translations and commentaries of medieval Buddhists from India, very easy to find in US. We have a pretty large Vietnamese (my Step-Grandmother is one), Korean, Tibetian, Japanese and Chinese Diaspora.
Only reason I don’t ask you us, you mention Buddhism in India as sites you visit, but I know most sites are of recent Sri Lankian influence, due to the conversions in the 20th century of untouchables. I generally have a headache of Buddhists with too eastern of a flair of asking questions… Tibetians, when NOT under the Dalai Lama’s Authority (not all are, especially in San Francisco, they got their own guy) are weird as fuck. I would walk into a temple, and expect to be told about the eight fold path or karma… a woman in a business suit would come up to me and start shoeing me pictures of monks having their skulls cut into and gems being pulled out, and then show me a creepy foam filled aquarium made to look like a cave with the stupid “gems” and stones pulled out, inside it like it was magical. Every time I would ask a question, Id get positioned in front of some stupid tibetian God, with a moneybox in front of it, told to ask it questions.
So some groups I just don’t ask questions to. Sri Lankuans come off as militant, especially the Buddhists right now. I was saving up money in Hawaii to fly down to Colombo, but decided not to… the Tamil Tigers we’re getting Randy, then the Buddhists started picking on the Muslims, and land mines still all over. I pretty much just want early history information related to Greeks, Romans, Persians, and any major local philosophers they developed. Also have a suspicion all the Veddas living in the woods have cellphones, wanted to see if it was true.
In regards to India, I want to know more about state histories. The biggest sect we have here are the Hare Krishnans, but discovered over time I really dislike them… not because they are Hindu, but because they are ignorant of their own writings for the most part, anti-intellectual. They aren’t producing philosophers. You ask them about a philosopher in their lineage, from the middle ages, they just blink at you, look at the paper, say they don’t know… nobody knows… ever. But other sects, smaller, do have intellectuals. There is a big monastary on Mali, in Hawaii, big library.
We also have a lot of Sikhs (especially in my town, they formed a cultural group, started publishing books) and Muslims.
Thankfully, I haven’t heard of the wild lesser known animal torture sacrificing groups… it’s all we need is for our Satanists like Primal Rage to see them dance around with blood on theirbface, sticking screaming piglets down poles in some sacrifice.
I wish some of the puranas, as well as variations on regional epics would be better translated or made available. Some exist, only in book form for $500 bucks and up. I’m not paying crap for that.
Many Vedanta teachers coming from India are shocked we already had aspects if it existing in the rest via Neo-Platonism. It was a Egyptian adaptaion of Plato’s ideas, with Vedanta ideas coming from the Indian trade. It flourished in the 300s AD on, was partially incorporated into Christian Philosophy.
But I also know it wasn’t one direction, and India incorporated ALOT. I also know not to be intimidated by the size of Indian Philosophy, it’s hardly insurmountable. I get thrown off by some terms sometimes, but try to find parallels with what I know, and zero in on what I don’t, figuring out the mechanics.
Bhakti really isn’t that hard. If it was, it wouldn’t work. The apologists for it more or less summed it up, easy code to break.
Did you ever see the Sanskrit movie of Sankara? I used to own a copy.
I’m also a member of several Indian groups. Just, I’m also a member of a lot of other groups that have nothing to do with India also. I’m a bit like Liebniz, have my hands in everything.
And I always take a very long term approach to everything. Individual life is ephemeral, a philosophers ideas are meant to last. I can’t help looking past everyone and into the future, it’s why I am so careful with the past.
The only one talking about girls being raped is you. Everyone immigrates, get over yourself. They didn’t have a society built up.
Also that girl had a father, he should be protecting her. Anyone can get tasers and mace these days, some even guns or knives.
Didn’t say it was justified, but that is nature, deal with it. Ever hear of natural selection? The weak and not advanced die while the more intelligent and stronger live? We were smarter in terms of technology, society, etc. They may have been physically healthier but that is because they were tribes people…they dont go buy from grocery stores, obviously. They harvest the freshest foods.
Go learn what natural selection is before you try to paint me as a brute. Consumerism world, that’s what happens. You consume or be consumed, now stop crying.
If a fallout ever does happen, you guys will be the first to get fucked due to not understanding nature and how consumerism this place is. Survival of the fittest, how it has always been and will be, part of evolution.
Also, I didn’t realize there were rules for immigration. So 100 years staying here makes them not immigrants anymore? Than neither are us europeans and vikings, so be quiet about it.
Didn’t we give france canada, for help in rev war?
Since a full scale deportation of the negrolopithecus is as impossible as it is impractical, I think a much better question would be “should africa be sent to blacks”.
For the record I am pro-whiteification and think the race should be fully assimilated. We’re seeing that now. Just a moment ago I saw a black adolescent male with emo white kid pants on and pastel green colored shoes. This is a step in the right direction.
In fact since the eighties we’ve seen a general transition from the dashikis and those red and gold plastic crown air fresheners that sit on the dash board, to polyester shirts and a more modest air freshener. It was the eighties pop scene that began the whiteification of black folks I think. The militant malcolm x brand nationalists came to a simmer in the late seventies and this is right about the time consumerism exploded. Since the dominant culture is white in this country, minorities naturally follow its example. The last thing the fashion industry over here wants to start is african clothing trends so it’s safe to say that the negrolopithecus will be fully assimilated. AS LONG AS imports from africa are stopped. Once in a while you still she a dashiki on an old black dude in a McDonalds but this is just the habitual dressing habits of a man from that pre-eighties generation… not an active philosophical/political statement like it used to be. In those days an acrimonious brotha wore a daskiki with a sense of pride and dignity. He knew a few things about africa… like three or four things maybe… and he wasn’t about to wear one of those plaid izod shirts with the pocket or one of those gay ass burgandy turtle neck sweaters that the white dudes wore back then, either.