# So… “Ship of Theseus” follow-up question
**URL:** https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005
**Category:** Philosophy
**Created:** [October 31, 2025, 4:28pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005 "2025-10-31T16:28:29Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [October 31, 2025, 4:28pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/1 "2025-10-31T16:28:29Z")
Ship of Theseus follow-up question: When did the ship of Theseus begin to exist or be true or have an essence? Simultaneous concurrence is triune — but think about this in light of the fact that God cannot create himself.
Background:
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### Author:  [@seeds](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/seeds)
#### Post date: [October 31, 2025, 6:55pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/2 "2025-10-31T18:55:33Z")
> [@Ichthus77](#):
>
> Ship of Theseus follow-up question: When did the ship of Theseus begin to exist or be true or have an essence?
Well, if you’re going to speak of Greek (Athenian) mythology, then according to one of the most famous Athenians of them all (you know who, starts with a “P”), the true form of the Ship of Theseus resides in the **“World of Forms,”** and that the rotting boards (and whatever else) that have been completely replaced here on Earth are but mere **“shadows”** of the **real** ship.
Now, how about we all chip in and take ol’ Theseus down to the Goodwill store to buy him some pants…
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [October 31, 2025, 7:03pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/3 "2025-10-31T19:03:25Z")
I’m mentally dressing him without even looking at him.
Shadow. As in an ever increasing revelation of eternal being?
Are we living in the foreshadowing or … aftershock… or is there a bigger one coming… and then another? Is there gonna be a final one … or is that one ontologically/thetically/deontically prior?
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [November 22, 2025, 3:28am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/4 "2025-11-22T03:28:55Z")
> [@On another topic](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/84070/6):
>
> Even if all the boards of the ship of Theseus passed away, the ship of Theseus will never pass away, doofus face. Which is exactly why it must be built again. So it can be/do its essence. Wake up & smell the salt water in the breeze!
This & stuff, etc.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [November 29, 2025, 9:27am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/5 "2025-11-29T09:27:01Z")
Question. If the Ship of Theseus was generally intelligent (the g factor)… would it identify with its clones? If not… it can’t be reduced to its physical pattern. “See” identical human twins.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [December 2, 2025, 4:58pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/6 "2025-12-02T16:58:51Z")
Relevant: [Open Invitation to Prom: Creative Discovery - #13 by Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/open-invitation-to-prom-creative-discovery/84082/13)
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [December 8, 2025, 1:31pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/7 "2025-12-08T13:31:33Z")
Pretty sure this ship floats, man.
> [@The Harmonic Triads](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/the-harmonic-triads/48486/497):
>
> and and and and and
Still with this:
> [@Analytic/Synthetic Distinction is really about…](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/analytic-synthetic-distinction-is-really-about/84156/11):
>
> Think with: …also think the incarnation, and:
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [December 23, 2025, 12:17pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/8 "2025-12-23T12:17:40Z")
> [@The Harmonic Triads](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/the-harmonic-triads/48486/507):
>
> _shipness_ predicate (valuing/enjoying)
>
> **is not**
>
> _ship_ category (being/understanding)
>
> **without**
>
> _shipping_ example (doing/demonstrating)
I think the great programmer in the sky might enjoy all the stuff that does stuffy stuff.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [December 26, 2025, 12:19pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/9 "2025-12-26T12:19:32Z")
The Ship of Sisyphus would have no tiller or rudder to direct it anywhere, and have zero way to slow in order to arrive at zero destination. It would run on nothing and have zero structure. “No One” would get into it intentionally; They would just wander into it on a random whim.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [February 19, 2026, 7:37pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/10 "2026-02-19T19:37:13Z")
> [@On another topic](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/84764/71):
>
> So
the body has a plan in the DNA (which came first, the body or the plan?). It starts small and it grows into an adult via a process of aging/maturing (which came first, the process or the plan for it?) (the process or the body?). The information formed in the genetic code communicates the plan — the material behaves the communication — your body changes according to the plan and interactions with the environment and the input from your own mind. Otherwise, people wouldn’t be able to prevent sexual maturity or chop off their sex organs. …because physical maturity and spiritual maturity are two very different things, but they need each other in order to express each other — in alignment with each other or out of alignment with each other. The situation gets more complicated the more individuals you add to the scenario. Which came first, all the messed up individuals, or the perfect alignment of individuals?
This is **The Flying Sandwich of Edvard Munch** , close cousin of **The Flying Spaghetti Sandwich** :
It appeared ex nihilo without a plan by nobody, and nobody prepared it or ate it, either directly, indirectly, or vicariously. Any appearance of bite marks is merely illusory and does not reflect an inborn hunger in your own psyche for teleology, real or imagined.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [March 17, 2026, 6:08pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/11 "2026-03-17T18:08:17Z")
…tie in the difference between action/reaction and willful action… between mass/energy and thought… between purposiveness without a purpose and intentionality.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [March 18, 2026, 12:42am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/12 "2026-03-18T00:42:23Z")
time-in-Eternity
created-in-Creator
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [March 19, 2026, 10:36am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/13 "2026-03-19T10:36:14Z")
> **[Logos, Leibniz, Kant … and … Copilot.](https://copilot.microsoft.com/shares/9oRaPB6Rqee6eTq5A73oq)**
>
> Shared via Copilot
Final Thought: They pride themselves on being evidence-based progressors of what actually works. They don’t want to acknowledge formal pattern/structure unless it’s in the matter (hard to deny). They’re OK with acknowledging it in the matter because it makes them feel a little bit less responsible to anyone outside their own self. And they don’t want to acknowledge final because it makes them feel more responsible, accountable to every end-in-itself, not just the final end—which makes them feel less “free” (at peace, Luke 19:42). That is why they say they don’t care about Truth with a capital T. In saying that, they acknowledge everything I am saying is true—they just can’t buy in to it. They have other commitments/cares they are not willing to break. It is a paradigm shift they are not ready to undergo.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [April 7, 2026, 6:30pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/14 "2026-04-07T18:30:47Z")
More: [Three Types of Definitions](https://copilot.microsoft.com/shares/ZBxXk5jkGeRQqkkWPUt9j)
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### Author:  [@Nausamedu](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Nausamedu)
#### Post date: [April 7, 2026, 8:49pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/15 "2026-04-07T20:49:13Z")
> [@Ichthus77](#):
>
> When did the ship of Theseus begin to exist
The entire problem is a fallacy to begin with that is answered by the question itself.
What makes the ship a ship of Theseus?
The material that went into it? The wood, coating and nails? The form? The matter?
Thats the suggestion isnt it?
If you replace half of the matter that makes the ship of Theseus, then is it still the ship of Theseus?
And the answer is that it was never a question of the matter or form.
The ship of Theseus is the ship of Theseus because it belongs to Theseus.
You can replace 100% of the ship 100 times over so its not even the ship of the ship of the ship of the ship, and because its still linked to Theseus, it remains the ship of Theseus.
Take Theseus away and you will be left with just a ship.
Break it apart and its no longer a ship either.
Add Theseus back to the picture and he can point at the rubble of wood and say that its his ship.
Form and matter is of no consequence here because the identifier was linked to something outside of it. Theseus.
As such the answer to the question “When did the ship of Theseus begin to exist” is “When Theseus claimed it as his ship”. Before that it was just a ship. And before that it was the wood of trees. Before that the elements that eventually became the wood, and before that the dust leftover by the bigbang.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [April 7, 2026, 10:12pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/16 "2026-04-07T22:12:02Z")
Theseus designed it (or procured it by the one who designed it) even if he dies, but there’s one designer that doesn’t.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [April 7, 2026, 10:16pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/17 "2026-04-07T22:16:52Z")
> [@Nausamedu](#):
>
> he can point at the rubble of wood and say that its his ship
No, but he could say “That is what is left of my ship“. Or he could say that, if instead of a pile of rubble, they turned it into a casino.
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### Author:  [@Nausamedu](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Nausamedu)
#### Post date: [April 8, 2026, 8:26am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/18 "2026-04-08T08:26:23Z")
> [@Ichthus77](#):
>
> No, but he could say “That is what is left of my ship“. Or he could say that, if instead of a pile of rubble, they turned it into a casino.
Theseus’s casino.
I like it.
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### Author:  [@Ichthus77](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Ichthus77)
#### Post date: [April 8, 2026, 11:08am UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/19 "2026-04-08T11:08:56Z")
Nausamedu’s cruise ship, more like.
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### Author:  [@Nausamedu](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/u/Nausamedu)
#### Post date: [April 8, 2026, 12:24pm UTC](https://www.ilovephilosophy.com/t/so-ship-of-theseus-follow-up-question/84005/20 "2026-04-08T12:24:38Z")
Im sea sick so i will stay at the casino.
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