Hello F(r)iends,

Is there any room for spirituality in science?

Einstein was not a scientist, he was a soul.
Do some of you flinch at hearing that word soul?
Do you instictively aim to put a stop to it?

Does spirituality have scientific value?


Yes, spirituality is a part of science. Those that wish to help others and are driven to find answers, seem to have a deep spirituality. Spirituality is a wrenching of your soul that guides you to make life choices and decisions. So in the drive to help humanity, this world and universe, a truly caring scientist will have spirituality.

Regardless of who you are or what you are trying to achieve, faith, hope, spirituality, vision, imagination and so on are integral, like it or not.

Well said!

One things that is all to apparent these days is the quickness to dismiss something, particularly spritual souful imaginative aspects of life, people watch scared rituals with the same indifference as the news the weather some sitcom or soap.

Most people who take such matters seriously as apt to be shot down in flams, either as not convincing, dubious, or as simply spouting cliched rhetoric/dogma/ideology with studied intent.

We see matters of the ‘soul’ as merely metaphorical, connotative…fanciful. Perhaps they are. Perhaps the method with which we have approached such matters so far has only been ridiculous.

We view any notion of sprituality as ‘not proven’ rather than something that has to be created through experience perhaps.

i was at the local folkfest, watching the Drummers of Barundi. During an adjustment of instruments, one band member took the time to describe to the crowd the meaning of the drum, the skin of the drum like the mother’s skin to the nursing infant. It struck me that language is like that; was like that, i should say. You learned language from your mother, in your mother’s context. Writing was different; did it have a different mother?

The point of the quote is for me to agree with Colinsign; i strained over a crowd of 300 unanimously uninterested people to hear every word of that description. It is one of just a few reasons i count myself the luckiest man in the world.

There are two places where spirituality is directly relevant to science. One is fundamentally, in the nature of Truth as the fountain of coherence. Redundancy is a test of coherence, and how it appears to fail is directly an issue of sampling frequency (harmonics are important here.)

The other is how language shapes awareness into experience; it’s an issue of feelings. And i’d suggest that that aspect of Being that causes feelings be called spiritual.

What’s going on here? I’m the soft and fuzzy guy and you people are going left of me!

OK. I’ll go the other direction. You can stick any label on it you want, but spirituality is nothing more than a metaphor to explain genetic evolution. Those feelings of spirituality are buried in layer after layer of basic survival instinct and all the variations that support survival and passing our genes to progeny.

Does spirituality have scientific value? Not really. That science cannot fully explain the source and pathways of our affective states yet doesn’t mean that it won’t be explained eventually. Then all the spirit, soul, and other metaphors for the as yet unexplainable will evaporate. Dawkins will win in the end.

It’s interesting that because we don’t know everything yet that we have to invent phantasmic concepts so as to pretend we know. No way is anyone going to say, “I don’t know”. So it’s OK to have spirit, and conscience, and soul. It’s harmless and a real comfort to say we know.

Science might not be able to explain spirit, but spirit can explain science.


Science will explain everything. Just be patient.

Hello F(r)iends,

So sensitive, Tentative… Unlock that thread of yours!
For the sake of Science!



I disagree. Dawkins is wrong, in the end. The metaphors, spirit, and soul; they make more sense, in the end, when science has explained it all. If you find a key, a legend, you might be able to use the spiritual record as a predicitve tool; maybe prophecy. The tree and its fruit.

I don’t say we know. We will, and some people have; and right now it makes sense to use what we’ve got rather than coming up with all sorts of phantasmic concepts. i agree.

Cultural evolution, i think. That’s why it’s such a short story.

A very long lineage; not devoid of meaning. What do the feelings really mean? How do they compell? What? Toward where?

Modal music notes are used to mimmick our brain’s wavelengths and induce spiritual enlightenment. Science is spiritual lol.

What do you mean by ‘induce spiritual enlightenment?’

Elevated mental state, nothing magic.

It’s just that ‘enlightenment’ seems to suggest a progression toward a goal, toward the ‘lighter,’ the brighter. I imagine it to be extremely context sensitive.

To be placed, by mechanical means, into an elevated mental state does not imply enlightenment; experience, maybe. Not that enlightenment wouldn’t be possibly triggered by such a mechanism; i’d expect it to be a rare case.

My bad, enlightenment wasn’t the right word.