The Absolute Truth

Philosophy Forums Religion and Spirituality
21

The thing is, the accumulation of knowledge islamisabsolutetruth has probably taken him/her years of study to get where their thinking is now. For that matter there is possibly other subjects discussed at this site which has taken years of study which might be hard to get across.

So, if one’s mind leans toward skepticism against certain ideologies, then asking someone to get their point that is acceptable for everyone to agree to presents a terrible onus on the presenter. Would it not be easier (if not better) if one doesn’t care to try to understand just to leave the thread alone instead? The premise behind ILP should be of one of tolerance of different lines of thinking as long as what is put forth is done with thoughtfulness

If everyone thought the same at ILP, then what would be the point of having this site? Instead of being dismissive, how about trying to learn about others beliefs? Because if you run people off from this site because of different belief system, chocks are applied upon knowledge.

22

Hey, we’re giving him an opportunity to defend his position, we’re just not going to read thousands of pages for him. That’s reasonable.

23

He could cut and paste till doomsday off of the net, but I doubt it would be received with anymore enthusiasm than what has been posted previous to this. Honestly, would the receptiveness from previous responders be greater than what has already been said? How about asking or getting him/her to explain the previous points that was made? If there is nothing you feel has merit from what he has previously stated earlier, then don’t focus on them. At least he/she is not flooding this topic with pages of text.

24

Litey, I hear ya to a degree, but it’s never been a standard at ILP to condone proof by verbosity and leave it at that.
That’s hardly a conversation starter for anyone.
And yes, the entire Quran is definately a proof by verbosity.

To then further this by a backing argument that many people believe it as truth is nothing but throwing an argumentum ad populum on top of a proof by verbosity.

I could accomplish the same net affect by saying that you have the right to free speech above nearly any law we have; throw down every law book in your local law library at your desk, and then assert that it must be true because a large population of the American common holds this to be true.

But again; around here…that’s not a good conversational provision.

You have to condense and push forward something appropriately sized for a forum to push the assertion into a discussion.
If you can’t; then rather than asserting that someone else shouldn’t respond if they don’t agree or don’t want to read the entire over-sized proof, I would assert that the originating poster should probably not bother posting the content.

It is no different than we hold for those that do nothing but provide a link to an entire website and say something like, “This is truth”; and that’s it, and then bang everyone on the head for not reading the entire site before remarking.

Yes, it probably did take years for IIAT to reach his conclusions and justifications, but if he wants to discuss them here; then he really should find a way of communicating in a forum-friendly format rather than begging people to read extensive volumes for the next few years out of the begging assertion that there are a few billion people on the planet that agree with it.

Now, I’m well open and welcoming for Islamic discussions; have been really wondering if we would ever see it pop up in the Religion section actually.
But I would ask, IIAT, that you actually engage in the discussion and not just tell people to go off and read the Quran.

Firstly, as a Muslim, you should be truly aware how incomplete that advice is to grasping Islam in the first place.
There are hundreds of discussions that Muslims themselves carry on with great debate and disagreement regarding their own interpretations of the Quran and their faith; obviously just reading the Quran will not achieve the ultimate end of everyone finding your understanding of it’s absolute truth.

Therefore, why not try to elaborate somewhat on why it appears to you to be absolute truth, if you want to assert it here as such?

25

I think that there is a lot of anti muslim/islam feeling here. Is this forum a popularity contest?
If you don’t like the topic don’t post anything. I don’t see the leader removing the topic.

26

Ah, turtle, how you misunderstand me. Why is another question. No human immersed in flux and conscious of the pain of experiencing changes can do more than hope for the sort of finality an absolute proposes. It’s a demand for finality, closure, the final end, the ultimate finish. Maybe when we die we get that. I’m the last person to challenge someone’s religious grasp for permanence and succor from the horrors of an isolate sense of self, whether the grasp is for Islam, Christianity, or any other such belief. That is, unless the belief is as isolating as an ego. Tolerance is eclipsed by self-serving remedies for universal diseases. I see all religions as providing comfort for the sort of grasping for anything permanent in a sea of change.

27

IERR-------I was not referring to you.

28

It is, of course, a fair request but it isn’t fair of you to ‘expect’ one to read it simply because you make the request.

If truth were only to be found in the Quran or in the bible, we would all be screwed as they are so open to interpretation. That can be part of the beauty of it, in a poetic and also in a personal journey of sorts. But that truth is only subjective and different for everyone. Truth is far more immense and ‘beyond’ than the farthest outstretched reaches of the universe…and as that expands, so also does truth or Truth.

When someone says" "You shall find the truth there, that is when I run the other way. Let’s not box ourselves in.

29

Ditto with what Arc said. If its your truth great but that does not mean it is my truth. Allah may be your God and so that is your truth , I have no God and so that cannot be my truth. Just think on this. why would any god want every human to be the same , to think and believe the same? It does not make sense. Would you want all of your children to be identical in everyway?

30

I am not seeing anything that is specifically anti-Islamic; and definitely there is nothing anti-Muslim.
All I saw were some posts by some anti-theists that were about on par for any post on any theistic assertion in the past by anyone.

In fact, I would personally like to see more Islamic, and specifically Muslim written, posts as we are lacking that perspective and it is an important perspective to understand more and more.

31

Where’s the anti-muslim/islam feeling?

Also, what the hell kind of philosophy forum would it be if you were only allowed to converse with people you agree with? That’s dumb.

32

I think turtle wants us to have respecting language when we are debating with others. He does not want us to hurt others feelings.

33

Since some people have some bad experiences with the Bible, they even do not want to try Quran.

The Bible and the Quran are not same. Some people mistakenly think so because of some common words. For example,

Through the Bible, some people understand the Oneness of God, but most people understand the Trinity.

The Quran talks about the Oneness of God, and He is the owners of everything that existing in the universe and all worship is due to Him alone.

The stories of the prophets also is not same even though the names are same. For example,

In the Bible: Prophet Lot committed adultery with his daughters. And, Prophet Noah became drunk.

In the Quran: Lot and Noah are Holy Prophets of Allah (God). They and other prophets did not commit that kind of sins. They all are above those kinds of sins. They were guided by Allah (God). They never committed adultery nor they became drunk.

34

Thanks IIAT. I just couldn’t think how to put it.

35

Philosophers:

Are you all tired of knowlede and reading? if mathematicians know that, they will laugh at you.

36

Throuth my reading and understanding, I believe the Islam is the Truth.

Truth can not be proved. If you can prove something, it is just a discovery. The Truth must be find by oneself by open mind and reading.

37

But if you stop searching, you will exclude yourself from the philosophy world.

38

Does submission not mean obeying Christ? Did Muhammad not find submission to Christ too much, so tried to find an easier option?

39

As any fool knows the Truth is in the Heart. I can attest to the Truth because it is written right here in my Heart. But the truth can be fully expressed only in relation to its opposite. That is why Niels Bohr said, “The opposite of a profound Truth may well be another profound Truth.” As you may have noticed, (islamisaboutruth) some of the posters here are shallow and childish and dont possess the faculties to recognize truth or the human heart of even higher levels of being. I would agree that, We are all mouth pieces of God
When you talk about the Peace that comes when ones life is surrendered to God you are really talking about a higher faculty a way of understanding something about yourself as well as phenomena with which you are involved call it self-awareness. What makes a truth universal is how it answers questions about your own behavior. There are many traditional wisdoms that are shared equally amoung all peoples that look to know themselves.

40

Ah, geeze, back to elitism, back to ego. Shallow posts? Not always; just different ways of seeing the same thing. If your heart is pure, as described by most religions, it is not engaged in the business of putting others down in order to substantiate yourself.
Turtle,
Do you read what you post?