The Bible Codes, mathmatical proof that we are not alone.

Philosophy Forums Religion and Spirituality
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I have just read The Bible Code, by Michael Drosnin, and it was amazing! To fill you in I will provide and excerpt from the book:

“For three thousand years a code in the Bible has remained hidden. Now it has been unlocked by a computer-and it may reveal our future.
Events that happened thousands of years after the Bible was written-World War 2, the moon landing, watergate, both Kennedy assissinations, the election of Bill Clinton, the Oklahoma City bombing-all were foretold in the code.
In a few dramatic cases detailed predictions were found in advance, and the events then happened exactly as predicted. The date of the Gulf War would begin was found before the war started. The Rabin assassination was found a year before the murder.
And the code may warn of unprecedented danger yet to come-perhaps the real Apocalypse, a nuclear World War.
The Bible Code is the first full account of a scientific discovery that may change the world, told by a sceptical secular reporter who became a part of the story. It forces us to accept what the Bible itself can only ask us to believe–That we are not alone.”

“But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book until the time of the End.” Book of Daniel 12:4

Nothing is taken on faith in the Bible Code, the reporter and author is not religous nor does he believe in God.
" I met with great scientist in the United States and Israel, and I confirmed the Bible code with a senior code-breaker at the U.S. National Security Agency, the spy agency that makes and breaks codes for American Military intelligence. I learned Hebrew and worked with an Israeli translator to confirm every code finding.
I met oftern and talked weekly with the mathmatician who discovered the code, Dr. Eliyahu Rips, one of the world’s leading experts in group theory , the field of math that underlies quantum physics.
I confirmed the mathmatical significance of every major encoding with Dr. Rips in addition to checking the odds calculated by the computer program he developed with his colleague Dr. Alexander Rotenberg.
I heard the clamor of critics who challenged Rips. I even hoped that one of them might find proof that the code was not real–it would free me of a terrible responsibility I did not want and did not feel equal to.
But no critic found any evidence that the Bible code was not real, and indeed the evidence that there was a code in the Bible that revealed the future kept getting stronger.
And now the search has become urgent. Because the Bible code warns that we may only have three years to survive."Bible Codes Intro.

“A cryptogram set by the Almighty,” the “riddle of the Godhead, the riddle of past and future events divinely fore-ordained.”
“That’s what Sir Issac Newton called the Bible Code. Three hundred years ago Newton, the first modern scientist, the man who discovered gravity and figured out the mechanics of our solar system, who single handedly invented advanced mathmatics, searched for a hidden code in the Bible that would reveal the future of mankind.” Bible Code2 pg.10

But when Eli Rips began his search for the Bible code nearly 20 years ago, he was not thinking about the “End of Days”. He was just solving a mathmatical puzzle.
“I found words encoded far more than statisctics allowed for by random chance, and I knew that I was on to something of real importance,” recalled Rips. “When I applied a computer, I made the breakthrough.” Rips discovered the Bible code in the original Hebrew version of the Old Testament, the Bible as it was first written, the words that according to the Bible itself God gave to Moses on Mount Sinai 3200 years ago.
Rips eliminated all the spaces between the words, and turnedd the entire original Bible into one continuous letter strand, 304,805 letter long.
In doing that, he was actually retoring the Bible to what ancient sages say was its original form.
Rips wrote a computer program that searched the strand of letters for new information revealed by skipping any equal number of letters. Anyone could make up a sentence that would tell one story on the surface, but another story hidden in a simple skip code. For example:
Rips explained that each code is a case of adding every fifth or tenth or fiftieth letter to form a word.

Now read that same sentence as a four letter skip code:
Rips ExplAineD thaT eacH codE is a Case Of adDing Every fifth or tenth or Fiftieth letter to form a word.
The hidden message–READ THE CODE. page 11. Bible codes.

THis book is truly amazing and it just re affirms what some of us have always know, there is a God. I read the Bible Code2 the Countdown first, and the first book second. THe second book starting with President Clinton last days in office. I hope you can all have a chance to enlighten yourselves, no matter what religion you are from.

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I hate to break it to you, but…

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Did you know if you put the telephone book of china in a super computer you would have more interesting results than the bible?

It’s all in the eye of the beholder.

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I’ve read both books and was facinated when I first read them but now I’m quite skeptikal. I remember from the first book that I read in 98’ or 99’ that there was a prediction that communism would fall in China in 2006. If that happens then I’ll be rather freaked out and probably very inclined to believe.

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there are two problems with the whole idea of the “key”. How do we know God wants you to skip four letters? why not eight or seven or whatever?

The second Problem is Charlie Manson and the White album. get a copy of Vince Bugliosi’s book Helter Skelter to see what happens when the search of secret messages or crypto-hermeneutics goes awry.

bahh that’s my answer. Bahh.

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Until you’ve read it, how can you understand it?

Underground, that’s what the author said about the assassination of a Prime Minister and watched as it came true. I like discussing with you, this subject, for you are well educated on God and his principles. What arose in my head as I read this was what the actual Bible or Torah tells us about false prophecies so we can be aware. My skeptism read in front of me, yet it all seems to follow the rythm set in the Bible.
I once heard a very wise Bible teacher say that true sciences are math, chemistry and physics which if used correctly without human error will never go against the priciples of the Bible. Wouldn’t you know it would be a mathmatician to discover the Bible Code. I love when Dr.Rips discovers the Code of Life. The DNA code and the Bible code were the same double helix structure and that the Mercy of God was intertwined around Judgement of God presented in exactly the same form as the double helix. I’ve heard pastors say that Noah’s Ark was really the DNA of animals that God gave to Noah and not the actual animals. And when I read this in the Bible code, it reiterated that. Noah had the Code of Life. The DNA.

I guess, all I can say is that denial is a powerful tool. Even the author, would rather give credit to aliens than to God. Why must we always underestimate things?

7

This sounds like populist nonsense, designed to send copy from shelf , rather than soul to heaven.

Dr. Rips??

Where does this ‘distinguished mathematician’ work? I’m willing to bet it’s not a ‘distinguished’ institution.

Why has no one argued against his claim?

Because it is so absurd that no serious academic would trouble themselves to waste time doing so.

MOREOEVER,

As has been pointed out in previous posts, the methodology he uses in his 'experiment ’ sounds unbelieveably open to question.
Why SHOULD we join up every letter of every word in the hebrew bible in order to find a word? Ancient writers certainly didnt write in monoscript, so why shuold we impose this form on their work?

I know you will have words to say in disagreement , Heather; but consider this for a minute.

If you had made up a bogus bullshit theory and wanted to get rich peddling it, and its subject was the bible, I’m willing to bet you would employ two tactics (both of which Dr.Rips uses):

  1. He relates the apparently anachronistic, sometimes far-fetched and often not reader friendly stories of the boble to modern ideas in order to make people sit up and take notice. People are, I ma afraid, interested by and large in what they DO know, rather than what they don’t. Everyone knows about th eKennedy assassinations and the Iraq war: cleverly (or perhaps not so cleverly) Rips attaches a menaing, an explanation to these seemingly inexplicable events.

The point? If we believe his version, we are very likely to become his publicists ourselves (and free of charge).

2.He uses the tabloid journalist hack presentation method! Dibelieving sceptic turns up on scene, is bowled over by ‘explanations and proof’ of Rips’ code, and goes away amazed and conveniced of the truth of his work.
This, I’m afraid, is a rhetorical technique, and at the very least, it has the same function as one. It invites the reader to identify with the story teller, and thus makes the reader at ease. When the outrageous idea is propsed therefore, the reader is not as outraged as he might otherwise have been.

Before you lend any more credence to Dr. Rips and his publication, Heather, you would do well to remember the maxim of Shakespeare:

‘Even the devil could use the bible for his own purposes’.

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Wow, you seem quick to anger. Please remember that I was simply posting a review about a book, that I feel is enlightening and others may also. It’s my personal opinion and nothing more. You are welcome to disagree and I am welcome likewise. Although please don’t assume I have a viel covering myself in regards to Satan, his favorite thing to do is talk about God. Yet he twists the truth ever so slightly, deceiving many people who love God.
The Code findings become what they become to the individual. Different as every person and every value. Personally I credit God with creation of everything. Everything on earth is corruptable though, yet 1+1 always equals 2. Satan would say it equals 1.999999infinite.
Shakespeare would have read the Bible Codes, and then could have wrote a masterpiece play about it. So enlightenment whether good or bad, is still beneficial.
You speak as if you have authority to condemn ideas. Even if the Bible Code books are just an idea, and a negative one to you, flip it over and create not condemn. Negative inspiration can sometimes be the most influencial.

The desire to control ideas and inspiration is like water to a beautiful flame or a seal over the breath in the sky, holding back the sails.
Who enjoys starvation of the creative palette?
He who is starving? Or a miser, gathering the bones of those he has starved to salivate at his feast of nothingness.

Thank you, without your letter I would not have been inspired to write that, even though what you have said was criticizm. That was very beneficial to read something I didn’t care for. :wink: Come down off your thrown and walk around the creative kingdom for a minute. It is what it is.

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If you haven’t read the book then you don’t have all the information, I gave you a short summary. Are you the type who reads a paraphrase of a book and suddenly you are it’s greatest critic? If you are a researcher without all the facts, a jury without all the evidence, then your verdict has no value.

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bahh. that’s my answer, bahh

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i agree with hermes bahh

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So in order to pass judgment on anything, I need to have explored it in all its depth?

So in order to think heroin is ‘bad’ and ‘not something I would enjoy’, or ‘not something beneficial to me or society at large’, I need to have tried it myself before I condemn it??

Come on, Heather, that’s a silly argument.

Of course. Let me explain; it is a source of irritation to me when people read populist drivel about importanmt subjects, rather than the great and influential works. Thus, if you were quoting Augustine, Aquinas, Newman or any scholar of repute and who is not hellbent on trying to make a fast buck, I would be more receptive.

Christianity is not baout hidden codes to be found by publicity speaking mad mathematicians. There is no mysticism. This is fundamental. Dr. Rips does not appreciate this and so he irritates me.

What use is it then? If the code does not provide an objective basis or rationale, of what use can it be as a source of authority??

I don’t follow this argument (at all).

Authority? This is merely the same authority which you have to propound and promote ideas. And why should I appreciate ideas originating in lunacy? I should not. THey should be condemned and consigned to where they belong: the bin.

I don’t want to ‘control’, I want to condemn! Promote any idea you like…I don’t want to control that process. I agree with you, that is a healthy process. The problem comes when you start arguing that ALL idea (no matter how mad) should be appreciated! They should not!
Is it not obvious why?

I would be lying if I said I wasn’t confused by your mixed metaphors. DO you mean my ‘throne’ ? I don’t think I’ve been on one. I’ve merely explained where I disagree with you and Dr. Rips. If disagreeing with you, Heather, constitutes ascent on to a throne, what knid of ‘super-throne’ is it that you inhabit? Is it located in the ether of your ‘creative kingdom’ and are you the ‘king’ of this domain?? If so, don’t let me threaten invasion!

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Lighten up. You call it populist drivel by your own judgement, while many agree many disagree. People read books for different reasons and where this book belongs is classified within the person. A rock can be more than just a rock to a worm.

And of course you know all of us artists have gone mad so we have to appreciate ourselves. :laughing: I appreciate too much I suppose, but I like that in me. As for lunacy, it’s not always fun being of sound mind FOR ME. My kids are lunatics at times, I laugh because its fun just to be goofy. Its an innocence and a release. That doesn’t belong in a bin, nor should a book that you condemn as lunacy. That is when things are at thier funniest sometimes. Have you never read anything so off the wall that you began to laugh at it? Comedy. Print the book for that reason, just to laugh at. I would give up a couple hours a day to be entertained by lunacy. I might even join in. oh well.

I said you were on a throne because you are so serious about the place of this and the place of that. Who has credentials and who (shrug, gasp)
may not yet be considered a smart man by your measuring stick. Youre a knowledge snob.
But oh well, at least youre something. You have a place too.
A knowledge snob and a me the lunatic, now that would be a comical book.

It could be titled, Can I Keep Her Mom? :smiley: sorry I guess I’m in a goofy mood right now, so I wil grace you by withdrawing my antics so you can concentrate on solving life’s problems by exalting or condemning human beings by thier crazy ideas. Yeah like when that one guy like said like the earth was round and like all of those smart people said he was a lunatic. Trash him.

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The problem all of you who think this is non-sense are overlooking is that in any book or whatever plain old chance will guarentee 1,2 or 10 instances of the Bible Code unlocking something. But when it comes to the Torah, a mear 5 books, they have contained within them using the Bible Code literally thousands of events. For any of you who have taken a course on statistics the odds that the Torah would have thousands upon thousands of codes hidden in its text while a book of equal size can come up with 5 maybe 10 events mathematically proved the validity of the Bible Code.

Seems Mathematicians and Staticians are always the first wave of people to know what to really accept and reject. Beyond bias, beyond religion, beyond biology and science, numbers don’t lie. Based on the age of the universe we can calculate the odds of every single event being possible.

Anything that exceeds 1 in 10 to the 50th power is effectively impossible. The closer a number is to that, the more unlikely it is to be chance if looking to prove something like the Bible Code.

And gavtmcc, it might interest you to know that the first person to attempt to break the Bible Code was Sir Issac Newton.

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Yeah Fading Soul according to gavtmcc, we should be thrown into a trash bin for believing such billswash. We must be low on the scale of intelligence by reading and enjoying such a disgrace of a book to mankind. He’s far too intelligent to partake in such ludicrous mathmatical material. Let us bow down oh lord gavtmcc so that we may catch a glimpse of your greatness. Why you can even disprove what none other mathmatician can, that Dr. Rips is wrong. We should tell all the world that gavtmcc’s genius has disproven the Bible Codes. Alert the press, his facts are revealed! Why, we should even write a book about this, so that all may read and understand what Sir Isaac Newton could not even understand, that it is absurd to pittle in such nonsense as a code in the Bible. I’ll even write it. Gavtmcc Send me all of your research that is contrary to the math Dr. Rips has figured, all of your mathmatical answers, I need it all to write an intelligent book mind you. Hold nothing back, this is your hour, your breakthrough to fame. Give us your equations, so that we may understand.

Fading Soul, youre cool. :sunglasses:

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Please don’t throw Newton around like that gives it credibility. Newton was A freakin alchemist for god’s sake.

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Just ignore people like him. He clearly has no backround in any kind of mathematics. People who have no idea how statistics function can easily be deceived into disregarding anything when they don’t want to believe it.

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That’s pretty funny. Hey why don’t you tell that to the scientific community. According to them he was more than just an alchemist. Next you’ll be telling me that we can discredit all mathematical evidence as well because you disagree with it.

I love how bias people can be to the point that they reject obvious truths. If one were to go about life with nothing more than mathematics to guide them they would find through statistics more truths than any other form of learning known to mankind. Yet when someone does not want to believe something simply because they disagree with it, they choose to ignore the greatest discernment of truth mankind has thus far. Statistics and the age of the universe.

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yeah Hermes, he knew his math. And if you know your math, you could understand the Bible Code is a complex math problem not some story made to sell to millions of meat heads. So we can refer to him, he’s in the book anyway. Math is a universal language, I imagine Newton would be well informed of all mathmatical concepts.
You seem to be in the category that 1+1=1.9999999infinite.

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Eh…the fact that the American Mathematical Society denounced the book as a hoax is good enough for me.

And Newton was an alchemist. He was also an uncannily talented scientist. The point is that alchemy and science are two different things. As are mathematics and…well, whatever it is this Drosnin guy thinks he was doing.